The CONFIRMED New Season

[The Shelf]

Originally Posted by Spitfire666xXxXx

You all know there's no way your going to win this argument with me because I think I'm right and I'm not bending. I've yet to see anything that has made me think otherwise yet, and when I do I'll admit I'm wrong. But let's just drop the subject cause this going back and fourth is getting nowhere.

Let's leave it at, some people see what I'm talking about, some don't. Is that cool?

Well, to be honest, you haven't given me any examples to prove me wrong either other than Batman TAS. I genuinely want to know what cartoons you're thinking of that are more violent and/or suggestive than cartoons today because I really can't think of any. Cartoons are no more or less dumbed down today than they were years ago.

But if we can't progress this conversation any more than we already have, then I'm willing to drop the subject.

[Spitfire]

Yeah I should have listed more shows, to be honest I don't remember the names of allot of them because I was pretty young, which now that I think of it could mean their less violent then I remember.

There was this one called "Mutant League" or something like that where they'd tear each other apart while playing sports. What I was really getting at was censorship is allot more hardcore now then it was back then. The ability to get away with more was there. Though I wish I could remember more show names. Now I'm kinda mad cause I have images of series but no names to tag onto them.

[Drtooth]

Originally Posted by Spitfire666xXxXx

There was this one called "Mutant League" or something like that where they'd tear each other apart while playing sports. What I was really getting at was censorship is allot more hardcore now then it was back then. The ability to get away with more was there.

An addendum.

Mutant League was a syndicated show. Syndiaction doesn't have the same standards and practices that networks have. In fact, Fat Albert even got into some pretty heavy subjects once it was syndicated. Stuff like sex. There was even one I have on DVD, where they were looking at porno. They didn't show it, but just discussing it is amazing for a kids' show to do.

Just wanted to add that factor in.

[Masked Ninja]

Originally Posted by Leonardo Mystic

Uh, yeah, it is. How often do you hear a cartoon character refer to the size of boys and mens toys? It sounds pretty suggestive to me. Anyone else I've quoted it to sounds sexual to them. Or maybe I or them are not as jaded to it as some folks are.

I'm still not seeing it, sorry... but then again I'm not thinking about sex all the time so I don't always relate everything to it like some do. "Toy" makes me think of something plastic and shaped like a car or animal that you give to a four-year old to act on with his imagination... not something related to sex or its necessary equipment. Whenever anyone I know mentions something like that "boys and their toys" phrase, it's referring to the fact that men often appear to get the same pure glee out of their sports cars, power tools, and ATVs as 6-year-olds get out of their RC cars.

Which is exactly the context of Raph's quote in that episode. Forget the little RC cars or whatever that Don put together for them in their childhood... now THIS is a machine!

*ponders* Nevermind, I bet that sounds sexual to you too. Gah, I hate double entendres... a person can't just say what they mean anymore.


In the vein of old vs. new cartoon censorship, I don't see a whole lot of difference, for the most part. Sometimes the style of avoiding violence will shift a bit, and that could be what you're noticing. For example, Swat Kats was pretty tame as far as the hand-to-hand fighting went, but villains were shown to be dangerous by indiscriminately destroying skyscrapers. Not every Enforcer chopper or jet that exploded had the now-obligatory "parachuting pilot," though some episodes did. The implied death count was huge, and nevermind that the destroyed buildings would touch some post-9/11 nerves if they tried to pull that off today.

But I still would say it's no darker than most action shows right now... the overall tone is still light enough and every episode is a one-shot (that is, no tense "to be continued?!" show endings). I haven't seen most of the series in years, but I'll bet that even the '80s TMNT had some heavy subject matter in their otherwise light and funny show. And even though TMNT 2k3 is considered "dark," it's still mostly the same thing as Swat Kats... the sheer implied body count, but no blood. Only instead of blowing up skyscrapers, their devices are more of the "turtle pulls a thug into the shadows and you hear a sound suspiciously similar to a neck being wrenched." Though you get some awesome onscreen fight footage, but how many shows have done that? Quite a few, if not Swat Kats.

And Avatar canceled? Heh heh heh... that's like saying Harry Potter was canceled by the publisher, or that Lord of the Rings IV was scrapped due to lack of support. It was meant to be a three-season story from the getgo, but it's so popular that I'm sure pressure will be on the creators to consider starting a new arc after this one is finished. And that show is fantastic... dark and serious in some parts, but doesn't consider itself above goofy humor episodes. Honestly, any good show needs a balance. The ones that endured from "back then" had it, and the ones from this decade that will endure have it too.

And that's another thing... as time goes on, we only really remember the ones with that enduring quality. Radio stations that play '80s music won't play the ones that bombed. Stations that play new stuff play... new stuff. Some will become classics, some are terrible. Same thing with shows. The networks are awash with crappy cartoons, but I bet they were "back then" too. Thing is, in 10 years nobody will remember shows like Cyberchase or a good chunk of the Flash cartoons on Nick right now either. Just the ones that stood out, for good or ill.

Well, there's an all-over-the-place post if I ever saw one. My apologies, guys.

[gobo]

Originally Posted by Masked Ninja

I'm still not seeing it, sorry. Whenever anyone I know mentions something like that phrase, it's referring to the fact that men often get the same pure glee out of their sports cars, power tools, and ATVs as 6-year-olds get out of their RC cars.

That's what I was getting at. Just because this is a lesser used adage, it sounds sinister to some, like it has a hidden meaning. But, if you try hard enough, you can take sexual meaning from anything. The closest 2K3 ever got to adult humor was when Quary turned human for the first time. But, to retain the innocense, they just played it off as an awkward moment.

Originally Posted by Masked Ninja

Well, there's an all-over-the-place post if I ever saw one. My apologies, guys.

You have the mind of an artist. What did you expect? Don't worry though. We still think you're 'kick-awesome'.

[Leonardo Mystic]

Originally Posted by Masked Ninja

I'm still not seeing it, sorry... but then again I'm not thinking about sex all the time so I don't always relate everything to it like some do. "Toy" makes me think of something plastic and shaped like a car or animal that you give to a four-year old to act on with his imagination... not something related to sex or its necessary equipment. Whenever anyone I know mentions something like that "boys and their toys" phrase, it's referring to the fact that men often appear to get the same pure glee out of their sports cars, power tools, and ATVs as 6-year-olds get out of their RC cars.

Which is exactly the context of Raph's quote in that episode. Forget the little RC cars or whatever that Don put together for them in their childhood... now THIS is a machine!

*ponders* Nevermind, I bet that sounds sexual to you too. Gah, I hate double entendres... a person can't just say what they mean anymore.

So you're assuming that I'm thinking about sex all the time just because it happens to translate to me like that? Thanks. Thanks a lot. You've just insulted me. That was really uncalled for.

No, I do not think about sex 24/7, thank you very much. In fact, FYI, I hardly think about it at all. However, that doesn't mean I've not heard even the most innocent phrases can have a little underlying meaning there. The tone and delivery of that dialogue plays a part of it, and *gasp* some of it isn't sexual (shocking, isn't it?).

The RC cars, powertools, etc. would've popped to my virgin mind long before the other did, but it was Raph's tone and delivery of that dialogue that changed my translation of it. Besides, I've heard that phrase long before to describe more the sizes of that part of the anatomy, and less to real plastic toys.

The visual of the Foot Tech machine was supposed to help that image of ATVs and such, but like I said, it was tone and delivery that underlyingly translated it elsewhere. You can still agree or disagree, that's fine. It's how it is to me, but don't ever insult like me that. I've not lowered myself to such abrasive behavior.

[gobo]

That's not how I read her post. And, actually, those were my exact thoughts on the matter. Does that mean I think you're a perv too? If so, I've just lost respect for myself for being such a hypocrite... pot calling the kettle black and all. I just don't think either of us meant to be insulting. Forgive me?

[VaughnMichael]

pft most people think about sex allot, just some of us are more open about it. I took it that way also don't be such a prude.

[Leonardo Mystic]

Originally Posted by gobo

That's not how I read her post. And, actually, those were my exact thoughts on the matter. Does that mean I think you're a perv too? If so, I've just lost respect for myself for being such a hypocrite... pot calling the kettle black and all. I just don't think either of us meant to be insulting. Forgive me?

I believe I took it as being insulting because of these two lines from her post

I'm still not seeing it, sorry... but then again I'm not thinking about sex all the time so I don't always relate everything to it like some do.

and

Nevermind, I bet that sounds sexual to you too.

But yes, I can forgive you. It'd be nice for us just to all get along, and get our points across without hitting below the belt. Uh, no pun intended.

[gobo]

Oh. That's probably foot-in-mouth. I just didn't think anything of it (because I used to have it quite bad myself). But, now that she knows you aren't just stuffing words into her mouth, I guess she needs to make amends for her own mistake. Sorry for the confusion.

[Sage Ninja]

**sigh** more fights and disagreements start on this board more often from misunderstandings than anything

[Machias Banshee]

Originally Posted by Sage Ninja

**sigh** more fights and disagreements start on this board more often from misunderstandings than anything

Agreed...Often times in the battle to prove who's right, everyone loses all over. Sometimes its just best to agree to disagree and move on.

[Splinter's Iroonna]

Originally Posted by Machias Banshee

Agreed...Often times in the battle to prove who's right, everyone loses all over. Sometimes its just best to agree to disagree and move on.

I disagree.

*runs*

[gobo]

COWARD!
*shakes fist*

^_^

[Machias Banshee]

*shoots a rotten mango at Sp's Iroona*

Trouble maker...

*needs to get this back on topic before she gets attacked by off-topic ninjas*

Is there ANY concrete information about when this new season will air?

[Roseangelo]

Originally Posted by Machias Banshee

Is there ANY concrete information about when this new season will air?

It'll start with 4Kids' new Fall programing in September.

[Fugitoid Jones]

Reruns of Fast Forward until Sept. yippee.

[Splinter's Iroonna]

Originally Posted by gobo

COWARD!
*shakes fist*

^_^

Oh, and Fugitoid... Fast Forward reruns when they're not airing the Lost Season stuff...

[Scandia]

Reruns of Fast Forward until Sept. yippee.

Better not be that way. I want to see the 5th season aired on TV- and released on Region 1 DVD.

[Drtooth]

Originally Posted by Masked Ninja

In the vein of old vs. new cartoon censorship, I don't see a whole lot of difference, for the most part. Sometimes the style of avoiding violence will shift a bit, and that could be what you're noticing. For example, Swat Kats was pretty tame as far as the hand-to-hand fighting went, but villains were shown to be dangerous by indiscriminately destroying skyscrapers. Not every Enforcer chopper or jet that exploded had the now-obligatory "parachuting pilot," though some episodes did. The implied death count was huge, and nevermind that the destroyed buildings would touch some post-9/11 nerves if they tried to pull that off today.

But I still would say it's no darker than most action shows right now... the overall tone is still light enough and every episode is a one-shot (that is, no tense "to be continued?!" show endings). I haven't seen most of the series in years, but I'll bet that even the '80s TMNT had some heavy subject matter in their otherwise light and funny show. And even though TMNT 2k3 is considered "dark," it's still mostly the same thing as Swat Kats... the sheer implied body count, but no blood. Only instead of blowing up skyscrapers, their devices are more of the "turtle pulls a thug into the shadows and you hear a sound suspiciously similar to a neck being wrenched." Though you get some awesome onscreen fight footage, but how many shows have done that? Quite a few, if not Swat Kats.

Well, I didn't see too many SWAT Kats episodes, or at least remember it that well. So I'll take your word there.

Censorship is an on again, off again thing, I think. Every so often when, let's say, Janet Jackson's grotesque old boob hangs out, or some dumpkoff somehow gets a gun (which I won't discuss) and decides his life is so terrible that he has to go around shooting everyone that has NOTHING to do with his crappy life, then the letters begin. I have to say, looking at what 4Kids did to most of their animes, I'm absolutely surprised they let half the stuff in. A lot of scenes had to be altered so people didn't die. They just somehow got injured slightly, but were suspiciously never seen again. Just like in real life.. Where as TMNT actually aknowledged death on an episodely basis. Didn't at the end of that dark future episode, everyone but Donatello from the past died? I mean, that is pretty Dark.

So I guess Laird or someone objected to the fact they'd have to shelter kids from reality ("No honey! Grampa didn't die of old age. he just magically disappeared, and you'll never see or speak to him again."). Too bad someone at Toei didn't feel the same way. Nami's mother being trapped in a dungeon, and miraculously not existing after that point. Kinda dumb.