About seeing TMNT 2

[The True Shredder]

Originally Posted by ScrewtheMirageTMNT

If you guys want to know then I will have to know what your definition of message and theme is. First.

Ever heard of a dictionary? Look it up sometime. The definition is under those words.

[chrisdude]

This is like an awkward scene out of The Office.

[Bry]

Ha ha ha oh my god.

*heavy sigh*

Okay. Moving on, then.

[IndigoErth]

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Nahh, I think I'll skip number two unless the trailers are beyond amazing.

[RaphaelinSTL]

Originally Posted by ScrewtheMirageTMNT

If you guys want to know then I will have to know what your definition of message and theme is. First.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by Bry

And that tells me everything I need to know. It's gonna be another bad, stupid movie, because they don't care about making something that even tries for anything deeper, or even something that makes a bit of sense. Big, dumb "fun". That's it.

And sure, "dumb fun" has a place. But you can do that and give the story some redeeming qualities. You can do that in a well-written movie that makes sense, has actual characters and even has a bit of a "point" or a message. Kids' movies do that all the time, but these guys don't care about any of that, at all. They've set the bar so low you could trip over it.

It's the "turn your brain off" argument. I can't get behind that. People turn their brains off too often as it is - give me something entertaining that actually has some meaning and some themes I can think about. Something that makes me feel something from a place of genuine emotion. If you're expecting me hand over my hard-earned money and clap and cheer because Mikey farted and made a boner joke and then something exploded... no, guys. No. Try harder. I'm not rewarding that. I don't know why anyone would. We need higher standards.

Holy sh*t, that was beautiful. Bravo, man.

I'm partial to what Harold Ramis once said, myself... something to the effect of the "shut your brain off" argument being "insulting", and "Why wouldn't you want to think? Why not just shoot yourself in the head?" I miss that guy.

"Higher standards necessary", indeed. If people swallow pablum and applaud it, then it's all they'll ever get.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by Xiewin

I wonder why PD, especially Liebesman, lied so much about this movie. I feel like I can't trust these people's words anymore. I'm trying to get excited for the sequel, but it's almost getting impossible for me to do so. They all claim to be such big fans, but why would they make April the main focus of the movie, cut out a ton of character development for the turtles, or forcibly make the movie under a 100 minutes long? I wonder, will they at least try to fix the glaring problems that were in the first movie and apply it to the second, or will they just get lazy and use the same formula because apparently people will see it anyways. .

It's not Liebersman's or PD lies I don't care about, it's Kevin Eastman's lies that hold more weight for me. He was promising a totally different movie than I felt we got. But then again, he himself might have seen a more rough cut movie that still had all of the additional scenes in it, making it a more cohesive film. But now, whenever he says something is awesome, I'm not going to get my hopes up.

[Leo656]

I kinda don't feel bad for people who feel burned by Eastman, though. I always said from the beginning, his main role in "assisting" the production was mostly PR shilling, because that's how it always goes in these kinds of movies when they bring one of the creators in as a "consultant", and that people shouldn't get too excited by him saying it's awesome because him saying that is exactly why his check has so many zeroes in it. He's also said bad TMNT stuff was awesome before, many times.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, maybe even a great guy, but he's still a "worker", so what's he gonna say? "Well, I'unno, not everyone is gonna like it..."? Why would they pay him for that? Of course he was gonna say everything was great, that's the job. Duh.

I'unno, I've never been completely on board with what either Eastman or Laird have to say about TMNT. They both seem like they only had the magic when they worked together, and that separately neither one of them really knows how to make TMNT work right. I don't really listen to either of 'em.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I kinda don't feel bad for people who feel burned by Eastman, though. I always said from the beginning, his main role in "assisting" the production was mostly PR shilling, because that's how it always goes in these kinds of movies when they bring one of the creators in as a "consultant", and that people shouldn't get too excited by him saying it's awesome because him saying that is exactly why his check has so many zeroes in it. He's also said bad TMNT stuff was awesome before, many times.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, maybe even a great guy, but he's still a "worker", so what's he gonna say? "Well, I'unno, not everyone is gonna like it..."? Why would they pay him for that? Of course he was gonna say everything was great, that's the job. Duh.

I'unno, I've never been completely on board with what either Eastman or Laird have to say about TMNT. They both seem like they only had the magic when they worked together, and that separately neither one of them really knows how to make TMNT work right. I don't really listen to either of 'em.

Don't feel bad for me because I think he is literally throwing his mind under the buss. But, like I said, he might have seen something totally different, maybe he was there when they were filming The Raid like scenes and thought they would look wicked in the film. Maybe there was more character scenes or something more coherent in the storytelling before the 100 minute minimum threshold started to chop up scenes. Heck, Eastman's cameo was part of the chopping block, so it goes to show how much the producers cared about one of the creators. Granted, both Eastman and Laird have been awfully silent since the movie has come out.

[Leo656]

It's possible. One of the dudes from Latino Review was on set for some of the filming and he saw a ton of stuff filmed that never made it into the final cut. A scene of April using a sai to fight off Foot soldiers was one of the more notable things.

I think some of Eastman's claims were someplace in between hopeful exaggeration and flat-out lies, though. Ain't mad at him, but still, it's kind of a shame, because some people do believe in him and I can imagine more than a few being let down.

[Candy Kappa]

I've yet to see the first PD movie, but I'd imagine I won't see the second one either in the cinema unless they do a complete 180 turn and make something that doesn't look like a slow motion car crash.

[Warhorse]

I'm just curious, are they going to increase the budget for the next one, or slash it? When 5 of the main stars are pure CGI, which can eat into a budget real fast, is now going to be sharing screen time with other possible CGI characters like Bebop, Rocksteady and anything to do with the technodrome, a bigger budget is inevitable. But the movie looks like it's going to barely break even as it is now.

[ScrewtheMirageTMNT]

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

I've yet to see the first PD movie, but I'd imagine I won't see the second one either in the cinema unless they do a complete 180 turn and make something that doesn't look like a slow motion car crash.

Sure thing skip.

[chrisdude]

According to Box Office Mojo, it's already profitable. I think people are forgetting the international numbers.

[Candy Kappa]

Originally Posted by ScrewtheMirageTMNT

Sure thing skip.

It is, Bub.

[Bry]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Holy sh*t, that was beautiful. Bravo, man.

I'm partial to what Harold Ramis once said, myself... something to the effect of the "shut your brain off" argument being "insulting", and "Why wouldn't you want to think? Why not just shoot yourself in the head?" I miss that guy.

"Higher standards necessary", indeed. If people swallow pablum and applaud it, then it's all they'll ever get.

You and I are on the same page here for sure. And hey, bonus points for the Ramis quote. Found the full quote here, and man, he totally got it. He is sorely missed.

And that's the thing - you can have dumb fun, you can have a bunch of it, but you need something more there. Something smart or emotionally-real thing to say underneath. Y'know? A genuine point. Something you can think about and analyze a little. Anything.

Originally Posted by Warhorse

It's not Liebersman's or PD lies I don't care about, it's Kevin Eastman's lies that hold more weight for me. He was promising a totally different movie than I felt we got. But then again, he himself might have seen a more rough cut movie that still had all of the additional scenes in it, making it a more cohesive film. But now, whenever he says something is awesome, I'm not going to get my hopes up.

I mean, we may never know for sure what he was basing that on, but Eastman's always been super positive about the property. I love the guy, and I could never be "mad" at him, but I definitely take his claims about this stuff with a grain of salt. He's basically a Nick employee at this point, so he's invested in it doing well. More power to him, but I don't necessarily agree with him or find him objective about this stuff all the time.

Originally Posted by ScrewtheMirageTMNT

Sure thing skip.

Ever find that dictionary?

[RaphaelinSTL]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I kinda don't feel bad for people who feel burned by Eastman, though. I always said from the beginning, his main role in "assisting" the production was mostly PR shilling, because that's how it always goes in these kinds of movies when they bring one of the creators in as a "consultant", and that people shouldn't get too excited by him saying it's awesome because him saying that is exactly why his check has so many zeroes in it. He's also said bad TMNT stuff was awesome before, many times.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, maybe even a great guy, but he's still a "worker", so what's he gonna say? "Well, I'unno, not everyone is gonna like it..."? Why would they pay him for that? Of course he was gonna say everything was great, that's the job. Duh.

I'unno, I've never been completely on board with what either Eastman or Laird have to say about TMNT. They both seem like they only had the magic when they worked together, and that separately neither one of them really knows how to make TMNT work right. I don't really listen to either of 'em.

Did you check out the recent AMA he did on Reddit a couple weeks I believe? He was still really selling this movie and called it his favorite adaptation next to the 1990 film in which a lot of people were basically letting him know "Hey, you don't have to lie and do PR for us....we know it's bad."

I mean if he actually likes this, so be it....but Eastman seems like a guy with a little bit more taste than that. I know Eastman was apparently there a lot with the production team, but it's not Eastman had any say in the filming. They've might showed him a scene or two or a design but it's not like anything negative Kevin said would drastically change production....even though that seemed to be the case with the re-shoots and the fan backlash.

Laird seemed like he had a decent grasp on things at time, I actually enjoyed his 2001 TMNT Mirage run and I need to pick some of those up again.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

According to Box Office Mojo, it's already profitable. I think people are forgetting the international numbers.

Unless you are in the 400 million range, international numbers mean sh!t. Studios get 50% or less of the monies earned OS. In the USA, they get about 80% to 100% of the gross within the first 2 to 3 weeks, and then after that, the percentages start to dwindle every week there after. That is why a movie to break even has to make TWICE it's budget back in domestic alone. Rarely does the OS market save a movie, unless, like I said, it's making more than 400 million. The Turtles have to be making 250 million to get it's budget back. Case in point. The Lone Ranger, production budget 215 million. WW gross, 260+ million, Dom 89 million/OS171 million, and it's considered a colossal box office failure. In fairness, TMNT is at least performing strongly domestically, but don't count on the OS markets to help it out.

[ScrewtheMirageTMNT]

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

It is, Bub.

No, that is crazy talk.