The Leonardo Thread - Page 7

*Bauer536* · 12-01-2012, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JLS

It almost makes you wonder what Leonardo's personality would be if he wasn't the "leader" from the beginning or wasn't the eldest brother. It's one of those "What came first? The chicken or the egg" analogies. Was it his noble qualities that made him assigned to be a leader OR was it because he was the eldest and had to be responsible for others that developed his leadership/noble qualities?

If Leonardo wasn't the leader, I still think he'd have his time to shine. Any of them can lead, but he does it better. Still, we all know Leo is the leader, and that's what makes him who he is. I mean, he isn't useless. If he was never the leader, he would still prove to have those qualities. Leo's pretty smart (of course, not as smart as Donatello, obviously), so he could have been only a strategist to help the leader. Instead of leader, he would only be a tactician.

If Don was the leader, it's still possible that Raph would be jealous of him. Think about it. It's not Leo that's the problem. It's that Raph doesn't have all that he wants. He won't completely respect anyone who has the postion he believes he deserves.

*Refractive Reflections* · 12-01-2012, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bauer536

If Leonardo wasn't the leader, I still think he'd have his time to shine. Any of them can lead, but he does it better. Still, we all know Leo is the leader, and that's what makes him who he is. I mean, he isn't useless. If he was never the leader, he would still prove to have those qualities. Leo's pretty smart (of course, not as smart as Donatello, obviously), so he could have been only a strategist to help the leader. Instead of leader, he would only be a tactician.

If Don was the leader, it's still possible that Raph would be jealous of him. Think about it. It's not Leo that's the problem. It's that Raph doesn't have all that he wants. He won't completely respect anyone who has the postion he believes he deserves.

The other three can lead, but of course Leonardo is just gifted in leadership. No doubt about that. But I wonder how much is innate character and how much is from conditioning. (I'm sure those who are the oldest among their siblings can relate to the protective position Leonardo is in. There comes a time when those oldest siblings reach an age that they have to baby-sit or watch over their younger siblings if their parent/parents are preoccupied and almost become a "parent" themselves in the process.) In the end, I'm sure Leonardo's personality is derived from both his innate character/skills and environmental conditioning.

If Leonardo, for some bizarre reason, wasn't the leader and thus didn't have the pressure of his siblings' welfare and being the "pillar of strength"...and the perfectionist trait caused by that pressure, in my opinion Leonardo would be a LOT more free-spirited and youthfully innocent but still focused and determined. Who knows...maybe he could even be a much more disciplined version of Michelangelo....? (I'm not trying to challenge anybody's reasoning but interested in Leonardo's character development with different "what if?" scenarios and all of your opinions about it with people's differing life experiences.)

To "stir the pot" even more, let's hypothetically say if Leonardo (being the leader) perhaps was a middle child or, dare I say, the youngest of the four. Just imagine...if you thought Raphael was irritated by Leonardo's "bossing around"/leadership I can't even comprehend how much more upset Raphael would be having a younger brother telling him how to fight/solve things.

Avatar Yuffie · 12-01-2012, 11:22 PM

So your thoughts on 2012 Leo? I love him.

Maybe because the show never made him just "The Leader". He was given childish quirks with a dash of maturity (he makes it a point not to pick fights with Raph if he can help it) and a genuine marriage with his innate idealism (lol Space Heroes).

Or maybe because of Splinter. You guys have no idea how shocked I was when Splinter tells Leonardo that he must "seek victory, not fairness", I can NOT imagine OT/2K3 Splinter saying the same thing at all. And that's amazing.

IMHO... the nick show made me like ALL the Turtles. Which is mindblowing for me. Don's has always been my favorite since the OT, I wasn't much of a fan of angry rebellious loose cannons but accepted Raph's popularity, and Mikey is... Mikey. The fact this show made me LIKE Leo and appreciate his role as "the glue that stuck them all together" is a breath of fresh air.

*BubblyShell22* · 12-02-2012, 07:26 AM

I love Nick's take on Leo the best. He's still learning how to be an effective leader, and while I wasn't sold on how and why Splinter chose him as leader, I think there was more of an underlying issue there. I think Splinter did see all those qualities Leo mentioned but he didn't want to say so for fear of making Leo have a big head. So he chose the simplest answer and stated it was because Leo asked for the position instead of demanding it. Leo's still learning, and I think he wants to be exactly like Captain Ryan instead of doing things his own way. I like that about him.

DonatelloNinja82 · 12-02-2012, 12:27 PM

I love 2k12 Leo as well. He's my favorite incarnation of him so far. But one thing I really love about this show is that it has them acting like actual teens.
I love how he takes Captain Ryan as his rolemodel, since he's still a teen trying to find his place in the world. He has nothing else to draw on for leading (except Splinter) except his own instinct.

*Bauer536* · 12-02-2012, 09:46 PM

I absolutely love the 2k12 Leo.

I still think he's the leader we all know and love, but with a tint of geekiness. I love his Space Heroes obsession. It may not be quite like Star Trek, but I love how similar it looks to the old animated series (which I have never watched considering Star Trek seemed like it was always live action).

Now to anyone who says that Leo bases himself off of his favorite television hero Captain Ryan, I can somewhat agree. While there are things that Leo doesn't understand because of his naivety, he has actually proven himself to be capable of leading his team. Yes, he bases himself off of Captain Ryan sometimes. But in the end, he is just him. I mean, I thought his act of mercy in "Never Say Xever" was going to be used because of an episode of Space Heroes he saw. However, this is not evident. It turns out he didn't see himself as performing an act that the captain would commit. It was only him, and him only. And that's what I like about this Leonardo. Now and then, he does look goofy when impersonating Captain Ryan, but he does have the capabilities to think on his own. As I always thought he was intelligent, only second to Donatello, I was impressed. This really proved that he was smart, especially by the end of the episode. I also love that he's not just the kind of guy that goes with, "Master Splinter said we must . . . " all the time. He also makes his own decisions. He's just . . . well . . . AWESOME!

To BubblyShell22: I agree with you about Splinter's choice. I have a feeling it's not only because Leo asked, but really because he believed in him. I think we'll be seeing later on that Splinter is truly Leo's role model and not just a television character. By this point if Leo loses his confidence, Splinter will tell him this, and Leo will then feel humbled and determined to continue as the leader. I can't wait when that happens.

Stingray69 · 12-03-2012, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avatar Yuffie

Or maybe because of Splinter. You guys have no idea how shocked I was when Splinter tells Leonardo that he must "seek victory, not fairness", I can NOT imagine OT/2K3 Splinter saying the same thing at all. And that's amazing.

I was the same way. I thought dang did splinter just say that? But I thought it was awesome at the same time.

DonatelloNinja82 · 12-03-2012, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bauer536

If Leonardo wasn't the leader, I still think he'd have his time to shine. Any of them can lead, but he does it better. Still, we all know Leo is the leader, and that's what makes him who he is. I mean, he isn't useless. If he was never the leader, he would still prove to have those qualities. Leo's pretty smart (of course, not as smart as Donatello, obviously), so he could have been only a strategist to help the leader. Instead of leader, he would only be a tactician.

If Don was the leader, it's still possible that Raph would be jealous of him. Think about it. It's not Leo that's the problem. It's that Raph doesn't have all that he wants. He won't completely respect anyone who has the postion he believes he deserves.

I agree. Don was leader in Leos absence in the 2k7 movie and Raph argued with him.

*BubblyShell22* · 12-03-2012, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bauer536

I absolutely love the 2k12 Leo.

I still think he's the leader we all know and love, but with a tint of geekiness. I love his Space Heroes obsession. It may not be quite like Star Trek, but I love how similar it looks to the old animated series (which I have never watched considering Star Trek seemed like it was always live action).

Now to anyone who says that Leo bases himself off of his favorite television hero Captain Ryan, I can somewhat agree. While there are things that Leo doesn't understand because of his naivety, he has actually proven himself to be capable of leading his team. Yes, he bases himself off of Captain Ryan sometimes. But in the end, he is just him. I mean, I thought his act of mercy in "Never Say Xever" was going to be used because of an episode of Space Heroes he saw. However, this is not evident. It turns out he didn't see himself as performing an act that the captain would commit. It was only him, and him only. And that's what I like about this Leonardo. Now and then, he does look goofy when impersonating Captain Ryan, but he does have the capabilities to think on his own. As I always thought he was intelligent, only second to Donatello, I was impressed. This really proved that he was smart, especially by the end of the episode. I also love that he's not just the kind of guy that goes with, "Master Splinter said we must . . . " all the time. He also makes his own decisions. He's just . . . well . . . AWESOME!

To BubblyShell22: I agree with you about Splinter's choice. I have a feeling it's not only because Leo asked, but really because he believed in him. I think we'll be seeing later on that Splinter is truly Leo's role model and not just a television character. By this point if Leo loses his confidence, Splinter will tell him this, and Leo will then feel humbled and determined to continue as the leader. I can't wait when that happens.

I totally agree with all of this, Bauer. And I like the fact that though he does idolize Captain Ryan and wants to be a leader like him, he also knows he has to do things on his own to be his own leader. I wonder if he'll feel pressured by Splinter to be a good leader in this series. I know in the 2K7 movie it felt like Splinter was heaping a lot of pressure on Leo which was why he sent him away and then was so harsh with him after the fight with the monsters.

DonatelloNinja82 · 12-03-2012, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stingray69

I was the same way. I thought dang did splinter just say that? But I thought it was awesome at the same time.

It works for this Splinter...it fits his personality. As said before, I cannot imagine OT or 2k3 speaking like that...especially 2k3. He was so gentle lol!

Red-eyed Jaguar · 12-03-2012, 06:17 PM

While Leo might be not my favourite Character, I do like him and have a lot of Respect for this Character.

Now, since I haven't read the Comics yet(saw only a few scans), I'm curious how he is potrayed in the Mirage Comics. Somebody care enough to tell me?
I hope that's not too much to ask for ^^;

*Bauer536* · 12-03-2012, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red-eyed Jaguar

While Leo might be not my favourite Character, I do like him and have a lot of Respect for this Character.

Now, since I haven't read the Comics yet(saw only a few scans), I'm curious how he is potrayed in the Mirage Comics. Somebody care enough to tell me?
I hope that's not too much to ask for ^^;

He's very serious in the comics . . . but he is VERY badass and makes 2k3 Leo look like a salad instead of a steak.

He actually kills a few criminals such as the Shredder. He's that awesome. As for the IDW Leonardo: not as awesome enough.

While this one may not be aligned with the Mirage counterpart, the one on the Nickelodeon series is great, too.

Red-eyed Jaguar · 12-03-2012, 08:05 PM

Well, when I first saw him (then again, this goes for all four Mirage Turtles) in Turtles Forever,let's say, the Reaction of the OT ones came close to mine |D"
But it left me impressed, it's a complete Contrast to the 87' Cartoon(which I grew up with).

Agreed, Leo in the Nick Cartoon is great.

Quote:

While this one may not be aligned with the Mirage counterpart, the one on the Nickelodeon series is great, too.

Well, the way he carries the Katanas on his Back is similiar. And from what I've seen, the fighting style too?!

LeoDonnieMikeyRaph95 · 12-08-2012, 10:07 PM

Leo is my favorite turtle because as a kid ive always wanted to be like him! a leader! a fearless leader! Leo will always be my favorite!

Ulisa · 01-13-2013, 01:47 AM

Well, it's been a bit over a month since a comment in this thread but I really wanted to add in my two cents.

Leonardo is not my favorite turtle but I definitely count him as my second favorite. I think he's very intriguing both in 2k3, OT, movies, etc. However, my primary exposure to him is OT and 2k3. I find him very different in these two series but also just as enjoyable.

2k3: Very serious, devoted, determined and I love the protective factor. I also love his perfectionism becoming a flaw in Season 4. Leonardo's worst enemy in this series really is himself. He definitely has a deep rooted respect for Splinter, which was touched on in the OT but it really shines through here. I also find his interactions with Usagi to be intriguing. The two are very similiar but they also have different view points on certain topics. I do love Usagi's comments about becoming more 'ninja than samurai.' His development was definitely a key point of the 2k3 series and it was interesting to see the events of each season drive that. However, it did get a bit bothersome that Leo seemed to be the "hero" most of the time. I would have liked to see the others get some limelight too.

OT: This is probably my favorite version of Leonardo, as weird as that may sound because he has often been called the boring one. However, even as a kid, I loved this version. He is very noble, honorable and yet he is not nearly as serious as other versions, knowing how to be light-hearted, though he sometimes needs reminders. He loves to do what's right, regardless of the response. I can't recall the exact episode but I believe during the Red Sky era, he says something along the lines of "I'm not going to stop doing what's right just because it isn't popular." I really liked Leonardo's interactions with the other turtles in this series, mainly because it seemed to slip into many different roles: leader, protector, friend, brother, and at times, even seemed to border on parent. Splinter was much more 'teacher' than father in this series so it seemed like, at times, that Leonardo took over that role which is an interesting dynamic. One of my favorite interactions of this always involves Michelangelo. Michelangelo tells Leonardo to 'chew me out later' and at one point, when Michelangelo is more focused on a video game than the situation at hand, Leonardo responds with "Michelangelo if you don't stop playing that stupid game, I'm going to shut it off with my katana." I don't know why I love those scenes so much but it seems like a different take than most other versions.

Either way, no matter the version, Leonardo is definitely a brother I'd love to have behind me

Ulisa

*Zulithe* · 02-26-2013, 10:34 AM

*Donnie* · 02-26-2013, 10:50 AM

The fact that Leo's geekiness is played up in the Nick iteration makes me like him even more, I like him almost as much as Don in the show.

As was pointed out, Leo's nerdy tendencies were always there, as testament to his reading Dune in issue #2!

Blossombrooks · 02-26-2013, 05:10 PM

Personally I like nick Leo the least out of all the incarnations, he's still the best...obviously

but I prefer him to be much more serious like in the 2K3 series and the mirage comics, Blind Faith was just amazing!
Yes I know 2K3 Leo gets a lot of stick for being a perfectionist and going all 'batman' but I think the depth of his character was explored very well, I loved it when he went to study with the ancient one.
As for being a geek I think all variations of Leo have had a good book in hand at some point but I think the choice above is more creator orientated than character. I do wish Nick Leo wouldn't watch quite so much T.V but that's just my opinion and I understand the franchise has to move on.

*Zulithe* · 02-27-2013, 02:30 AM

Good comments. I think it's just that Nick is trying to portray the turtles as 'younger' and still maturing and growing into their personalities. In 2k3 they felt older. In Nick I think it's pretty clear they are 15. In 2k3, I am not very familiar with the canon to know what ages they technically are, but they felt closer to 17ish to me. It could explain some of the personality differences.

*BubblyShell22* · 02-27-2013, 07:15 AM

Yeah, I always felt that they acted older in the 2K3 series than they do in the Nick series. In the Nick series, they act younger, and I like how Leo is a geek and loves TV. It makes him seem more relatable to other people. The only thing I could relate to Leo about in the 2K3 series is the whole beating himself up for failure and putting pressure on himself. Other than that, I couldn't really relate to him at all. But I can relate to Nick Leo more even though I'm not a sci-fi geek like he is because I do have shows I love and watch constantly like he does with Space Heroes, so I can relate to him there.

Plus, you never know, but I'm sure Leo will start to put pressure on himself to be a good leader, though in a different way than 2K3 Leo did.

12-01-2012, 11:22 PM	#123
Avatar Yuffie Stone Warrior Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 805	So your thoughts on 2012 Leo? I love him. Maybe because the show never made him just "The Leader". He was given childish quirks with a dash of maturity (he makes it a point not to pick fights with Raph if he can help it) and a genuine marriage with his innate idealism (lol Space Heroes). Or maybe because of Splinter. You guys have no idea how shocked I was when Splinter tells Leonardo that he must "seek victory, not fairness", I can NOT imagine OT/2K3 Splinter saying the same thing at all. And that's amazing. IMHO... the nick show made me like ALL the Turtles. Which is mindblowing for me. Don's has always been my favorite since the OT, I wasn't much of a fan of angry rebellious loose cannons but accepted Raph's popularity, and Mikey is... Mikey. The fact this show made me LIKE Leo and appreciate his role as "the glue that stuck them all together" is a breath of fresh air. __________________ We all know that Most Writers Are Male. Something like eighty percent of media aimed at children have male main characters, whereas half the population is female. At best, women will often be minor characters or will not be present at all. Stories about women are for women, stories about men are for general consumption. (TV Tropes Feminist Fantasy)

12-02-2012, 07:26 AM	#124
BubblyShell22 Leo-holic Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Indiana Posts: 16,912	I love Nick's take on Leo the best. He's still learning how to be an effective leader, and while I wasn't sold on how and why Splinter chose him as leader, I think there was more of an underlying issue there. I think Splinter did see all those qualities Leo mentioned but he didn't want to say so for fear of making Leo have a big head. So he chose the simplest answer and stated it was because Leo asked for the position instead of demanding it. Leo's still learning, and I think he wants to be exactly like Captain Ryan instead of doing things his own way. I like that about him. __________________ "A warrior who never fails, never learns."-The Ancient One. "Embrace your inner a**holiness."-Mr. Anderson.

12-02-2012, 12:27 PM	#125
DonatelloNinja82 Mad Scientist Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,345	I love 2k12 Leo as well. He's my favorite incarnation of him so far. But one thing I really love about this show is that it has them acting like actual teens. I love how he takes Captain Ryan as his rolemodel, since he's still a teen trying to find his place in the world. He has nothing else to draw on for leading (except Splinter) except his own instinct. __________________ Michelangelo: Holy guacamole with hot sauce and jalapenos!

12-02-2012, 09:46 PM	#126
Bauer536 Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2011 Location: United States Posts: 1,550	I absolutely love the 2k12 Leo. I still think he's the leader we all know and love, but with a tint of geekiness. I love his Space Heroes obsession. It may not be quite like Star Trek, but I love how similar it looks to the old animated series (which I have never watched considering Star Trek seemed like it was always live action). Now to anyone who says that Leo bases himself off of his favorite television hero Captain Ryan, I can somewhat agree. While there are things that Leo doesn't understand because of his naivety, he has actually proven himself to be capable of leading his team. Yes, he bases himself off of Captain Ryan sometimes. But in the end, he is just him. I mean, I thought his act of mercy in "Never Say Xever" was going to be used because of an episode of Space Heroes he saw. However, this is not evident. It turns out he didn't see himself as performing an act that the captain would commit. It was only him, and him only. And that's what I like about this Leonardo. Now and then, he does look goofy when impersonating Captain Ryan, but he does have the capabilities to think on his own. As I always thought he was intelligent, only second to Donatello, I was impressed. This really proved that he was smart, especially by the end of the episode. I also love that he's not just the kind of guy that goes with, "Master Splinter said we must . . . " all the time. He also makes his own decisions. He's just . . . well . . . AWESOME! To BubblyShell22: I agree with you about Splinter's choice. I have a feeling it's not only because Leo asked, but really because he believed in him. I think we'll be seeing later on that Splinter is truly Leo's role model and not just a television character. By this point if Leo loses his confidence, Splinter will tell him this, and Leo will then feel humbled and determined to continue as the leader. I can't wait when that happens. Last edited by Bauer536; 12-02-2012 at 09:55 PM.

12-08-2012, 10:07 PM	#134
LeoDonnieMikeyRaph95 Mouser Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Gotham city Posts: 10	Leo is my favorite turtle because as a kid ive always wanted to be like him! a leader! a fearless leader! Leo will always be my favorite! __________________ GIFSoup LEONARDO LEADS

12-03-2012, 06:17 PM	#131
Red-eyed Jaguar Thug Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Germany Posts: 99	While Leo might be not my favourite Character, I do like him and have a lot of Respect for this Character. Now, since I haven't read the Comics yet(saw only a few scans), I'm curious how he is potrayed in the Mirage Comics. Somebody care enough to tell me? I hope that's not too much to ask for ^^;

01-13-2013, 01:47 AM	#135
Ulisa Foot Soldier Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Various Fantasy Realms Posts: 145	Well, it's been a bit over a month since a comment in this thread but I really wanted to add in my two cents. Leonardo is not my favorite turtle but I definitely count him as my second favorite. I think he's very intriguing both in 2k3, OT, movies, etc. However, my primary exposure to him is OT and 2k3. I find him very different in these two series but also just as enjoyable. 2k3: Very serious, devoted, determined and I love the protective factor. I also love his perfectionism becoming a flaw in Season 4. Leonardo's worst enemy in this series really is himself. He definitely has a deep rooted respect for Splinter, which was touched on in the OT but it really shines through here. I also find his interactions with Usagi to be intriguing. The two are very similiar but they also have different view points on certain topics. I do love Usagi's comments about becoming more 'ninja than samurai.' His development was definitely a key point of the 2k3 series and it was interesting to see the events of each season drive that. However, it did get a bit bothersome that Leo seemed to be the "hero" most of the time. I would have liked to see the others get some limelight too. OT: This is probably my favorite version of Leonardo, as weird as that may sound because he has often been called the boring one. However, even as a kid, I loved this version. He is very noble, honorable and yet he is not nearly as serious as other versions, knowing how to be light-hearted, though he sometimes needs reminders. He loves to do what's right, regardless of the response. I can't recall the exact episode but I believe during the Red Sky era, he says something along the lines of "I'm not going to stop doing what's right just because it isn't popular." I really liked Leonardo's interactions with the other turtles in this series, mainly because it seemed to slip into many different roles: leader, protector, friend, brother, and at times, even seemed to border on parent. Splinter was much more 'teacher' than father in this series so it seemed like, at times, that Leonardo took over that role which is an interesting dynamic. One of my favorite interactions of this always involves Michelangelo. Michelangelo tells Leonardo to 'chew me out later' and at one point, when Michelangelo is more focused on a video game than the situation at hand, Leonardo responds with "Michelangelo if you don't stop playing that stupid game, I'm going to shut it off with my katana." I don't know why I love those scenes so much but it seems like a different take than most other versions. Either way, no matter the version, Leonardo is definitely a brother I'd love to have behind me Ulisa

02-26-2013, 10:34 AM	#136
Zulithe Ninjutsu Master Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 6,418

02-26-2013, 10:50 AM	#137
Donnie Something from the Past Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: New York Posts: 3,256	The fact that Leo's geekiness is played up in the Nick iteration makes me like him even more, I like him almost as much as Don in the show. As was pointed out, Leo's nerdy tendencies were always there, as testament to his reading Dune in issue #2!

02-26-2013, 05:10 PM	#138
Blossombrooks Stone Warrior Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: 'hero' turtle land Posts: 946	Personally I like nick Leo the least out of all the incarnations, he's still the best...obviously but I prefer him to be much more serious like in the 2K3 series and the mirage comics, Blind Faith was just amazing! Yes I know 2K3 Leo gets a lot of stick for being a perfectionist and going all 'batman' but I think the depth of his character was explored very well, I loved it when he went to study with the ancient one. As for being a geek I think all variations of Leo have had a good book in hand at some point but I think the choice above is more creator orientated than character. I do wish Nick Leo wouldn't watch quite so much T.V but that's just my opinion and I understand the franchise has to move on. __________________ There's too much green to feel blue! http://blossombrooks.deviantart.com/

02-27-2013, 02:30 AM	#139
Zulithe Ninjutsu Master Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 6,418	Good comments. I think it's just that Nick is trying to portray the turtles as 'younger' and still maturing and growing into their personalities. In 2k3 they felt older. In Nick I think it's pretty clear they are 15. In 2k3, I am not very familiar with the canon to know what ages they technically are, but they felt closer to 17ish to me. It could explain some of the personality differences.

02-27-2013, 07:15 AM	#140
BubblyShell22 Leo-holic Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Indiana Posts: 16,912	Yeah, I always felt that they acted older in the 2K3 series than they do in the Nick series. In the Nick series, they act younger, and I like how Leo is a geek and loves TV. It makes him seem more relatable to other people. The only thing I could relate to Leo about in the 2K3 series is the whole beating himself up for failure and putting pressure on himself. Other than that, I couldn't really relate to him at all. But I can relate to Nick Leo more even though I'm not a sci-fi geek like he is because I do have shows I love and watch constantly like he does with Space Heroes, so I can relate to him there. Plus, you never know, but I'm sure Leo will start to put pressure on himself to be a good leader, though in a different way than 2K3 Leo did. __________________ "A warrior who never fails, never learns."-The Ancient One. "Embrace your inner a**holiness."-Mr. Anderson.