Star Wars Episode 8

[sdp]

Well just got back from seeing it and I'm sad to say that it sucked, are the reviews shill or just that hypnotized by the brand? Best movie since Empire Strikes Back? This could be the weakest movie of them all.

Now I know I've been harsh on Disney Star Wars and I wasn't excited for the movie but I went in as a fanboy expecting to be impressed, I really didn't want to hate it, I wanted it to redeem VII. I don't hate it, it's not a rehash like VII, it's just boring. Mild spoilers ahead but I'm going to be as vague as I can, if I write a real spoiler I'll tag it.




The Good:
Every scene with Luke Skywalker is awesome, every single one, is it the best Luke Skywalker movie? haha no, but he did make the movie interesting. The training was a bit by the numbers but it worked and I feel they handled the character well.

The Rey/Kylo relationship was actually compelling, I actually cared about Kylo who I hated in TFA, Rey is still a Mary Sue but she was interesting. They kind of dropped the ball at the end though, but at least there's something besides Nostalgia from Luke that makes the movie interesting.

The Bad:

The whole movie drags, especially the beginning, and even near the third act when things begin happening it starts to drag again. It's so boring, this will make it very hard to re-watch, especially since I already know the "twists". I think even VII being a rehash will be more rewatchable than this one.

Captain Phasma is treated as well as she was in TFA, Finn, one of my fav. characters from VII was not written well in this movie, they kind of ruined him. All the new characters except for one who was ok sucked. Even Chewbacca felt wasted only used for laughs. Leia sucked, she's not that much different from TFA so you know what to expect.

Too much comedy? Maybe but that's far from the movies problems. We still don't know who the heck is the first order or what the resistance is. And somehow the resistance is now a rebellion and the first order is now almost in complete control of the galaxy? I don't know what's going on except that it really went back to the status quo of Episode IV, some fans tried to justify that VII had a different relationship between the factions but no, this movie confirms it's the status quo of the OT.

They drip fed us through out this long boring movie tidbits of information that should've been explained since TFA, and still it didn't really answer many questions. It's a bad movie that only lives by the "twists" it does, but if you take those away you are left with the only two good points I mentioned.

It's a bit depressing but I just don't like this new trilogy, there's literally nothing that IX could do to fix the damage done by VII and VIII. I can only hope any future Star Wars movies/projects are different but counting everyone is eating it up like they're great movies I'm not counting on it when people say "It's literally better than the ESB"

The Spoilers

Spoiler:

Luke dying worked fine for me, it's sad since he was awesome in the movie but it works.

Yoda appearing? I don't know, it was cool but maybe it'll age just as bad as Lightsaber Yoda from Ep. II did which I loved when I first saw it but now cringe.

Snoke being killed while keeping things interesting, we never learn who the hell he was or how he knew all the things he knew, now that he's dead I doubt it'll be something too important in IX unless he somehow didn't die. ugh.

So Finn isn't Rey's love interest anymore? Way to downgrade the black guy in this movie..

I don't think Phasma died, but if she didn't she will never have any credibility.

[ZariusTwo]

Right, seen it. My thoughts

Spoiler:

I was weary in the opening few minutes with Po quipping like a bad Marvel a-lister, but it thankfully settled not long after. Porgs weren't as intrusive as I thought they were going to be. The natives of Luke's island were lousy comic relief but, again, didn't appear too much.

Luke being responsible for Ben's downfall was a twist I was'nt spoiled on, but one I could see from orbit coming. I wonder what's become of the Knights of Ren? I thought we'd get a broader look at the destruction of the temple, but it really was very fleeting. Felt like an epic flashback made on a shoestring budget. All sorts of short cuts taken.

I liked that Rey really wasn't as big a deal as the packaging had you beleive. Oh sure she gets a lot of the focus early on and at the middle, but by the third act she's just piloting the Falcon and raising some rocks, instead it's left more to Kylo and Luke, as well as Finn and Rose. Rose was fine, though I think her love for Finn was more one-sided, at least that's what it seemed.

The lightsaber choreography fell very flat in my eyes, it was paced badly and the tug of war Kylo and Ray had over Luke's lightsaber was just preposterous.

It was interesting to see the codebreaker actually get away with selling out the Resistance at the end...part of me kind of does'nt want him to come back, just to show you that the galaxy is'nt a small world and a guy like him can get away with working both sides of "the machine" as he put it.

There was near-the-knuckle moments with Carrie Fisher..seeing her helpless in intensive care awoke painful memories of 2016, but I loved that she tore through the ship when she got back up and quashed Po's rebellion-within-the rebellion.

Loved Luke and Leia's reunion, especially in light of Carrie's passing, At least Leia got closure across both films before Carrie signed off

You sort of feel like a third one isn't necessary despite all that's still to be tied up.

[CyberCubed]

Wow, sdp, your review is so negative. Do you hate all Star Wars now?

[sdp]

I still love Star Wars, I just hate most of the Disney Star Wars output.

I do think Ep VIII might be the worst Star Wars film, worse than VII and Rogue One. The Luke Skywalker & Rey/Kylo parts of the movie are great and got my inner fanboy excited but the rest is just so bland and by the numbers, I guess I feel Disney Star Wars is soulless.

I think I feel how the Prequel haters felt with the prequels and how those movies ruined their Star Wars. To me the prequels had issues but it was still Star Wars and I could live with it, these movies ruin the OT more than the prequels ever did since they basically retcon and crap all over the OT.

[Andrew NDB]

Spoiler:

Want to see what Yoda looks like?
https://www.instagram.com/p/BcqJl0EHB-v/

[Andrew NDB]

One thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is John Williams' "Last Jedi" music score. Is it any good?

[Vegita-San]

I honestly don't think he's the main guy anymore. he's just on there for honorary reasons.

With episode 7...you could tell one or two scores where his... the rest where so bland and un interesting, it had to be the second guy credited on the composer list.

[sdp]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

One thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is John Williams' "Last Jedi" music score. Is it any good?

Like Episode VII nothing stood out to me, I can't recall any new theme that was memorable.

It's not bad I guess since I never felt the score was boring just not iconic like William's music usually is, might be his age tho. I had the same issue in TFA.

It is a shame tho, Star Wars always had great music.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

I think TFA's score is very good. It isn't trying to be eclectic and sprawling like the prequels' music; it's very much like A New Hope on steroids, which is what TFA is.
I haven't heard The Last Jedi but I hear there aren't any big new themes which were added, which is rather unfortunate.

[Spike Spiegel]

Originally Posted by sdp

I still love Star Wars, I just hate most of the Disney Star Wars output.

I do think Ep VIII might be the worst Star Wars film, worse than VII and Rogue One. The Luke Skywalker & Rey/Kylo parts of the movie are great and got my inner fanboy excited but the rest is just so bland and by the numbers, I guess I feel Disney Star Wars is soulless.

I think I feel how the Prequel haters felt with the prequels and how those movies ruined their Star Wars. To me the prequels had issues but it was still Star Wars and I could live with it, these movies ruin the OT more than the prequels ever did since they basically retcon and crap all over the OT.

The only thing I like in this era of SW is the Rebels TV show, which still falls way short of the standards set by Clone Wars.

[NinjaPug]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

One thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is John Williams' "Last Jedi" music score. Is it any good?

It's basically the same score from TFA

[Redeemer]

Saw the movie tonight, I definitely thought this was better than Force Awakens or Rogue One. The movie was not a Re-hash of any of the previous movies and had a couple of twist to the plot that you don't see coming.

[Krutch]

Just came back from seeing it.

Quick, random, spoiler-free thoughts....

-I liked that it felt different from all other Star Wars movies, so that's a big plus.
-Enjoyed everything involving Rey+Kylo. Cool to see the Force used in new ways, too.
-Rian Johnson's shortcomings as a director are really on display here, unfortunately. Every scene feels needlessly bloated and when the big moments come, he shoots them in the most obnoxiously overdramatic way possible.
-Every bit of comedy fell flat for me, but there were a few in the theatre that it seemed to work for.
-The sense of time in this is completely bizarre. It feels like everything with Leia takes place over maybe a day, but everything with Rey feels like at least a week. Anyone else feel this way?
-The movie hits a sweet spot in the middle in terms of payoff and pacing. There's a solid half hour in the middle where everything just feels right.
-The movie ends in a place where I'm not terribly interested to see what happens next. Actually, the very last scene was a very strange choice to end on. I get it, but it's still odd.
-No cool lightsaber fight in this movie. Kind of a bummer.
-Hated how alot of the best pairings from the previous movie were pretty much completely seperated this time around.

Overall, I liked it, but definitely underwhelmed.

[ProactiveMan]

I didn’t really like this movie – it has its moments, but I though the script was pretty abysmal. The plot felt like one of those exquisite corpse exercises, where someone writes a chunk and then passes it onto someone else. I don’t mean that it felt like a lot of people re-wrote the actual script, I mean that things that happened earlier in the script didn’t seem to have much bearing on things that happen later – sometimes immediately afterwards. For example…

Spoiler:

I don’t know if the writer director did any research or anything, but in most military or paramilitary organisations, attempted mutiny and insubordination are very difficult to come back from. You don’t forcedly assume command from the highest ranking officer, only to have them calmly explain their point of view and applaud your moxie.

The codebreaker is supposedly gambling, wearing a red flower thing… no not really, the codebreaker is some other guy now. Then he betrays Rose and Fin and it’s played up as a big moment, then he just kind of wanders away.

Luke gives Ray her first lesson and freaks out over her power and attraction to the dark-side, and you’d think, that’s it, training’s over. Not so; he’s back the next day for lesson two, and doesn’t really bring it up again.

There are a lot of other examples, and just as many silly and unbelievable plot contrivances. Like the very first scene, where after a really lame series of jokes about Po putting General Hux on hold, some stuffy Admiral explains that their dreadnaught cannot defend itself against a single fighter, because it’s ‘too small and fast’. Why? That’s absurd. Fit it with a phalanx gun or something.

This improbable oversite allows the resistance to attempt a bombing run, which is even sillier if you think about it. How the f**k do you drop bombs in zero gravity?

At one point, Rose and Fin are about to be executed, surrounded by about a thousand Stormtroopers when Laura Dern hits the ship they are on with a Hyperspace Kamikaze run; killing all the Stormtroopers, including the two would-be executioners, but Rose and Fin are totally fine. So is Phasma, (who looks like she is having a lot of trouble walking for some reason). There are too many examples to mention.

The humour didn’t hit very often for me, and I thought it was badly incorporated into the script. It’s like the writer was contractually obliged to include a joke every five minutes, on the minute. A lot of them are poorly timed, mostly falling flat, but also often undercutting the weight of scenes. There are big moments that should feel weighty and tense, but the script keeps letting the air out with site-gags and misplaced observational humour; not to mention the ultra-cheesy attempts at fist-pumping one-liners that are one step away from “that’s gotta’ hurt”.

There was some shonky acting too. I thought Ray and Luke were really good, as were Rose and Fin. Po was alright, but he was given some of the dumbest stuff to do. Kylo Ren was pretty good as well, but almost everyone else in the First Order stunk it up big time. Hux and Snoke feel like they wandered out of one of the prequels.

The movie is getting good reviews and I’m vaguely disturbed by this. Are my taste changing, or is the mainstream leaving me behind? Is everyone caught up in the Star Wars excitement that I’m no-longer in synch with; am I outgrowing it? I liked the Force Awakens quite a lot, but Rogue One didn’t do a lot for me, and now this… maybe it’s me, I don’t know.

[Andrew NDB]

I suspect I'll share your sentiments, but...

Originally Posted by ProactiveMan

Spoiler:

How the f**k do you drop bombs in zero gravity?

Isn't that what the TIE-Bombers did in 5? In the asteroid belt? Presumably some self-propellant downward.

[Mayhem]

Yeah, that was my thought as well, the bombs were on some sort of rail system and being delivered downwards via it.

Originally Posted by ProactiveMan

Spoiler:

Like the very first scene, where after a really lame series of jokes about Po putting General Hux on hold, some stuffy Admiral explains that their dreadnaught cannot defend itself against a single fighter, because it’s ‘too small and fast’. Why? That’s absurd. Fit it with a phalanx gun or something.

Spoiler:

Guess the First Order hadn't learned any lessons from the Empire...

Lt Tanbris: We count 30 rebel ships Lord Vader, but they are so small, they are evading our turbolasers!
Vader: We'll have to destroy them ship to ship, get the crews to their fighters.

[plastroncafe]

I caught this movie last night, and I'm still trying to process what it is I just watched..

The parts of this movie that I loved, I loved so hard. But I found the entire movie to be really inconsistent tonally. Not just within itself as a movie, but in terms of its place in the broader story.

Like Thor Ragnarok, it felt like it was just missing a sense of Gravitas that the other films generated so easily.

Spoiler:

I loved that when push came to shove, Luke basically pulled a Yoda, and in the wake of his grief went crazy sarcastic hermit. No ****s left to give! Luke is my favorite Luke. And I certainly love the fact that he recognizes all of the flaws in the Jedi belief system.

At the risk of pulling avatar The Last Airbender into this, it's like he realized something Yang Chen said, about how the avatars' are not allowed to be spiritually pure because they have to remain part of the world. The Jedi's main folly is that they removed themselves from the world, and in doing so bred in themselves a kind of arrogance that ultimately led to their downfall.

I really dug all the stuff between Rey and Ben.

But I feel like the continuation of the Rebellion story was a different movie.

And I'm kind of torn as to how they represented Leia finally using some of her Force control.

Was I wrong, or was there a split-second shot of all of the Jedi texts ending up in a drawer on the Millennium Falcon?

I'll be honest, this is not my favorite Star Wars movie.
I certainly like it better than the prequels, but it doesn't feel like Star Wars to me the same way that Rogue one or The Force Awakens did.

I'm going to have to see this one again, and I'm certainly looking forward to seeing what other people think.

[NinjaPug]

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

I caught this movie last night, and I'm still trying to process what it is I just watched..

The parts of this movie that I loved, I loved so hard. But I found the entire movie to be really inconsistent tonally. Not just within itself as a movie, but in terms of its place in the broader story.

Like Thor Ragnarok, it felt like it was just missing a sense of Gravitas that the other films generated so easily.

Spoiler:

I loved that when push came to shove, Luke basically pulled a Yoda, and in the wake of his grief went crazy sarcastic hermit. No ****s left to give! Luke is my favorite Luke. And I certainly love the fact that he recognizes all of the flaws in the Jedi belief system.

At the risk of pulling avatar The Last Airbender into this, it's like he realized something Yang Chen said, about how the avatars' are not allowed to be spiritually pure because they have to remain part of the world. The Jedi's main folly is that they removed themselves from the world, and in doing so bred in themselves a kind of arrogance that ultimately led to their downfall.

I really dug all the stuff between Rey and Ben.

But I feel like the continuation of the Rebellion story was a different movie.

And I'm kind of torn as to how they represented Leia finally using some of her Force control.

Was I wrong, or was there a split-second shot of all of the Jedi texts ending up in a drawer on the Millennium Falcon?

I'll be honest, this is not my favorite Star Wars movie.
I certainly like it better than the prequels, but it doesn't feel like Star Wars to me the same way that Rogue one or The Force Awakens did.

I'm going to have to see this one again, and I'm certainly looking forward to seeing what other people think.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts. The stuff that worked for me REALLY worked for me but the movie was so inconsistent that it was jarring to me. Way too much jokey stuff that just didn't land.

While the Finn-Rose subplot tied into the overall theme of the movie it fell flat for me and took me out of the movie. I just wanted to get back to the Luke-Rey-Ben-Snoke story.

Yes, you did see the Jedi books in drawers of the Falcon.

I really hope JJ doesn't retcon Rey's parentage in IX. It would be really disappointing to suddenly make her a Skywalker, Kenobi, etc. and just dismiss the whole anyone can be a hero narrative that Rian layered into the entire movie.

[MikeandRaph87]

I saw it last night.

Spoiler:

Luke is dead? I don't get it. He was not dying of old age like Yoda or allowed to be killed like Obi Wan. Did he just exhaust his body for not using the force then using it full blown? Just trying to make sense of it.

Also, after two years of waiting Luke tossed the light saber aside.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by NinjaPug

I really hope JJ doesn't retcon Rey's parentage in IX. It would be really disappointing to suddenly make her a Skywalker, Kenobi, etc.

That might have been the plan from the start. Episode IX: "PSYCHE! She's been Luke's daughter the whole time." And then maybe we meet Mom.

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

Spoiler:

But I feel like the continuation of the Rebellion story was a different movie.

Spoiler:

My biggest wish was that they would bother to explain why it's a Rebellion. The New Republic is the established ruling government of the galaxy, put in place by the Rebel Alliance after their victory over the Empire in Episode VI. "The First Order" isn't even the Empire, but rather just some ragtag Imperial remnants that cobbled together their forces. I re-watched VII last night and it literally says in the opening crawl that the New Republic "supports" the Resistance... but why is it a Resistance? Why are they "rebels"? Why is it a "Rebellion"? The "First Order" are the ones rebelling against the ruling body of the Republic, not the other way around. I've read that the new books and stuff explain that the New Republic is inherently pacifistic, so that's why they can't openly endorse the Resistance, but they still want the Resistance to fight the First Order, but quietly, on the side. Why in the hell would the Rebel Alliance, all of those war-hardened generals and leaders among them, set up the New Republic as a pacifistic governing body to begin with? Especially with the Imperial remnants still lurking out there?? It doesn't make any sense.

I don't care what the explanation is, I just want to understand what's going on.