X-Men 97 Animated Cartoon Disney+

[TheBlueTurtle1]

It's gonna suck, you can't re create the shows magic again, 30 years later, especially with the way things are. The new art style looks horrible, magneto looks 20 years younger lol

[CyberCubed]

I mean the original series was good but it wasn't a masterpiece either. It was restrained by 90's saturday morning cartoon standards and the animation was always a bit dated for its time. I still like most of the show but there's no reason this can't be a good season or better.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I mean the original series was good but it wasn't a masterpiece either. It was restrained by 90's saturday morning cartoon standards and the animation was always a bit dated for its time. I still like most of the show but there's no reason this can't be a good season or better.

I hope your right, but you are dealing with disney

I have nothing but love for the 90s show, most likely looking at it through rose tinted glasses, but I worry they will taint the legacy of the show.

[ZariusTwo]

A look at the toys

https://bleedingcool.com/collectible...en-97-cartoon/

https://bleedingcool.com/collectible...c-hero-series/

[Coola Yagami]

Seems Storm will have a mohawk, and either the toys messed up or Cyclops might be losing his yellow trunks.

[ZariusTwo]

[TheBlueTurtle1]

They seem to have made some changes to how some of the x-men look, Bishop and storm have been to the Barbers and had new hair cuts, morph looks like a non binary character now. They should have just left this in the past. Going to be filled with modern PC politics, I have no doubt about that.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by TheBlueTurtle1

morph looks like a non binary character now.

That's been his look in the comics for decades.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

That's been his look in the comics for decades.

He was originally based on Changeling http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix6/changeling-xmen.htm)

they just shoehorned him on to the exiles character, my guess is they will play the non binary card, I might be wrong, but that is my guess. Why else does he not look like the morph we know?

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

That's been his look in the comics for decades.

Not in the cartoon though, which is what this was supposed to be based on.

I mean literally none of the characters look like that nowadays, if you really wanna go there.

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by TheBlueTurtle1

They seem to have made some changes to how some of the x-men look, Bishop and storm have been to the Barbers and had new hair cuts, morph looks like a non binary character now. They should have just left this in the past. Going to be filled with modern PC politics, I have no doubt about that.

They can't help themselves. Somehow a show that takes place in 1997 will have modern day politics and probably a Trump expy to kick around.

The moment the Jubilee VA stepped down because she's not Asian, I already knew how all this was gonna go.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

They can't help themselves. Somehow a show that takes place in 1997 will have modern day politics and probably a Trump expy to kick around.

The moment the Jubilee VA stepped down because she's not Asian, I already knew how all this was gonna go.

Yea, alison court is no longer voicing jubilee, and cyclops VA has passed away, hardly the show we knew returning.

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by superstaff

I'd really like to clear something up about the concept of 'wokeness'.

Something delving into the subject of prejudice, bigotry, racism, and division? Doesn't instantly mean woke.

Something having a diverse cast of characters, whether by race, religion, sexual orientation, etc? Doesn't instantly mean woke either.

Wokeness happens when writers ham-fistedly cram overt politics into their works at the cost of quality writing of their plotlines (ex: keeping consistency, proper characterizations, story that makes sense, etc) and of their characters (ex: characters being cardboard cut-outs meant to only exist to spew politically charged dialogue, to the point that this is most/the sole reason these characters exist...don't have interesting personalities or good chemistry with other characters, etc).

I don't think X-Men '92 had it because it had good storylines with characters who had actual backstories, personalities, and relationships that had nothing to do with promoting any ideology. Wolverine's character, if you boil it down, did not revolve solely on his being oppressed. His experiences with prejudice happen, but his entire character was never reduced to 'victim of a white, patriarchal society' (or what-have-you). I probably should've used Jean or whatever for the example I just made. Oh well, you, hopefully, get my point.

I have some appreciation for the specificity that you are going for - the way you are looking at the information. But if this was a class and I was a teacher reviewing the assignment, or if this was an article and I was the editor; then I would refine what you said more into this -

What you described above is actually just "bad writing". I am saying clearly that "woke $#!(" has almost nothing to do with the quality of the content or it's writers or actors. Instead, the "woke edge" is sharp and contains an agenda in the content that lectures specific races or genders, shames the general existence of "traditional content", replaces white people for POC's, and attempts to cast aspersions or shame on groups of people because of the perceived slights by the creators. Woke is not "bad storytelling", but rather racism, generally against white males, presented in the form of entertainment.

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by IMJ

I have some appreciation for the specificity that you are going for - the way you are looking at the information. But if this was a class and I was a teacher reviewing the assignment, or if this was an article and I was the editor; then I would refine what you said more into this -

What you described above is actually just "bad writing". I am saying clearly that "woke $#!(" has almost nothing to do with the quality of the content or it's writers or actors. Instead, the "woke edge" is sharp and contains an agenda in the content that lectures specific races or genders, shames the general existence of "traditional content", replaces white people for POC's, and attempts to cast aspersions or shame on groups of people because of the perceived slights by the creators. Woke is not "bad storytelling", but rather racism, generally against white males, presented in the form of entertainment.

It's kinda both. For the most part woke writing is bad writing because if you're more concerned with hamfisting your personal politics into the story and cramming 'diverse' characters just for the literal sake of it (like this one person is 100% superfluous to the story and surrounding characters but hey at least we got a gay guy in there!).

It's worse when it's pre-existing characters where their established personalities are suddenly replaced with the writer's views to the point you think 'so and so' would never talk like/think like/act like this.

Couple that with this mean-spirited attempt to shame men more and more in media to the point that they're now digging up classic heroes like Luke Skywalker and Indiana Jones just to ridicule them and tear them down. They're trying this with James Bond too. Then you have the MCU shows where most of them are pretty much the female costar replacing/showing up the guy the show is named after in every turn. Or nonsense like Wanda enslaving an entire town but we're supposed to root for her cause 'woman'.

Lately it feels everything is forced to cram the 'remember folks, straight white men are bad mkay?' message in there somewhere. Anywhere.

I still remember the critics complaining that Godzilla VS King didn't have any politics in it. Cause God forbid a big dumb movie can't be allowed to just be a big dumb movie.

[sdp]

x-men has always been political, but PC aside which I do think could hamper the writing. It'll be very difficult for this show to truly feel like a new season that fits in. The show embodies the 90s and 90s X-Men, it'll be difficult to give off that same vibe without it feeling like modern X-Men. The cartoon had so many seasons it really did do almost everything. The last seasons wasn't that good but at least it gave us a decent ending.
They only renewed it because the streaming numbers were good when Disney+ first launched, but are those people who streamed out of nostalgia still interested? Will it even get a second season now that Disney is cutting on Marvel & Disney+ spending? It might just ruin the original ending to leave us on a cliffhanger and have the characters do stuff out of character.

They should've done a Marvel animated universe show instead like Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes, have the x-men team up with spidey and the other 90s marvel cartoons. That way it's something new, exciting, while promoting the older 90s shows to a new audience. I mean I hope I'm wrong and the season is good.

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

Yes. But never woke. Hence the good stories that people remember to this day.

Jubilee a female chinese imigrant with foster parents is the first main character you meet and follow. Have you watched 90s cartoons recently? most of them would be considered 'woke trash' if released today. Most are very heavy if not the main plot is the environment, most dealt with racism either explicitly or implicit. Diveristy quotas? oh yes. strong females? definitely.

The only things 90s lack from modern cartoons is race swapping and lgbtq stuff. Not everything is "woke trash" just because there's a brown female in the lead. writing and context is the key. Many "writers" think that just being diverse makes up for good writing, that's the problem not so much the diversity usually.

But with that rant over, I don't feel confident on this new cartoon. I do think there'll be plenty of cringy PC stuff in it but it won't be what makes the show bad. There's other stuff that just won't feel like 90s X-Men.

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

It's kinda both. For the most part woke writing is bad writing because if you're more concerned with hamfisting your personal politics into the story and cramming 'diverse' characters just for the literal sake of it (like this one person is 100% superfluous to the story and surrounding characters but hey at least we got a gay guy in there!).

Hm. You know what Coola, I've got to tell you man that description above was an intellectual truth bomb. You're right. Yeah. Yeah that's an unassailable position and justified right on the money. So yeah, yeah I suppose the nature of the content does dictate the quality.

So yeah, in that regard you and superstaff are right. Hm. Well done, dude.

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by sdp

x-men has always been political, .

Yes. But never woke. Hence the good stories that people remember to this day.

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by IMJ

Hm. You know what Coola, I've got to tell you man that description above was an intellectual truth bomb. You're right. Yeah. Yeah that's an unassailable position and justified right on the money. So yeah, yeah I suppose the nature of the content does dictate the quality.

So yeah, in that regard you and superstaff are right. Hm. Well done, dude.

I try. It usually bugs me when leftists just assume because there's a female lead or a poc in there they just assume we'd call it woke. Or 'if so and so movie was released today it would be considered woke'.

Naw fam. Ripley was as vulnerable as she was strong. She also didn't act high and mighty and the Alien movie didn't have a 'all guys are stupid and useless cause guys, amirite?' vibe to it.

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

Naw fam. Ripley was as vulnerable as she was strong. She also didn't act high and mighty and the Alien movie didn't have a 'all guys are stupid and useless cause guys, amirite?' vibe to it.

Exactly. Exactly.
It's like people calling you a racist because you don't want to support a race-swapped character, and yet it's like "Well... that's weird because Blade was essentially the first Marvel character on-film worth anything and I was all-in and supportive of that one... sooooo?"

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by sdp

Jubilee a female chinese imigrant with foster parents is the first main character you meet and follow. Have you watched 90s cartoons recently? most of them would be considered 'woke trash' if released today. Most are very heavy if not the main plot is the environment, most dealt with racism either explicitly or implicit. Diveristy quotas? oh yes. strong females? definitely.

The only things 90s lack from modern cartoons is race swapping and lgbtq stuff. Not everything is "woke trash" just because there's a brown female in the lead. writing and context is the key. Many "writers" think that just being diverse makes up for good writing, that's the problem not so much the diversity usually.

But with that rant over, I don't feel confident on this new cartoon. I do think there'll be plenty of cringy PC stuff in it but it won't be what makes the show bad. There's other stuff that just won't feel like 90s X-Men.

None of that is woke though.

Jubilee was Asian in the comics too. She wasn't white and made Asian in the cartoon 'just because'. The themes of anti-mutant hatred were done well and still surrounded by all sorts of action, fighting and explosions. Magneto was against ALL humans, not just white people, for example.

You can have diverse characters and strong women without the series being woke. You have zero idea what woke even is, especially when it was clearly explained to you.

Take Bishop for example. His whole plot was going back to the past to prevent a hellish future. And he happens to be black. The entire episode didn't become a lecture of the hard times black people face in America or whatever. His race had literally nothing to do with his mission and the stakes in the episode.

It's just nowadays these hack writers don't know how to write good stories anymore without throwing race and whatever else into everything. I don't want to see the X-Men standing around lecturing everybody. I want to see them kick some ass.