5th Turtle?

[Cowabunga Carl]

I find it interesting that a lot of people who don't want a 5th turtle are cool with other mutant characters. What is it about a 5th turtle that bothers people as opposed to other mutant characters?

[Jester]

I think it depends on how the 5th Turtle is introduced. There is a huge difference between Tokka, Slash, and Venus in how they were added. Maybe it's also a friend or foe thing too. I don't know, all I know is Venus gets a lot of flack because she was shoe-horned into the origin (which oddly enough, FW's Mondo Gecko was too...not much hate for him.) and once she was there she defeated the Turtles most hated enemy on her first outing. Slash and Tokka are either mutants made by Shredder and his minions or an evil "Bizarro" Turtle from outer space. In those cases they aren't forced to be the "5th Turtle Splinter missed" and are just new mutants who happen to be turtles.

[CyberCubed]

I agree with how they're introduced.

Slash being an evil turtle makes sense because he's designed to be a dark version of the Turtles. Tokka was always paired with Rahzar, and wasn't just a new turtle out of nowhere.

The Dark Turtles in FF were clones, and robot turtles like Metalhead are fun.

Adding Venus or other turtles to the team feels tacky and uneeded. It's like Poochy being added to Itchy and Scratchy.

[Mr.Turtle]

when u say a lot of ppl... hav u researched on that statistics? or hav u posted any poll at least in this forum? personally, i dont think theres anything bad abt the 5th turtle as long as hes decent.

[Cowabunga Carl]

I've been on these boards long before I started posting, and generally people don't like when a 5th turtle is introduced or that is how it seems. I'm just stating things that seem to be a general trend. I my self don't mind another turtle joining the team.

As Jester pointed out Mondo Geeko was shoehorned into the turtles origin in FW and people seem okay with it. Yet when a 5th turtle is shoehorned in people get angry.

[Mr.Turtle]

by these boards u mean this forum ?

[Cowabunga Carl]

yes, these forums.

I will admit I don't know much about the whole Kirby thing. I mean I know that he was supposed to be in a movie that never happened. People seem okay with him.

Yet when it comes to Venus people seem to universally hate her and don't want to see her ever show up again. I think the flaws with the character come more from the show she was introduced in not the character in general.

[Mr.Turtle]

u mean this forum only? u mean a lot of ppl on this forum dont like the idea of 5th turtle?

[TurtleTitan97]

Originally Posted by Old Hob

Yet when it comes to Venus people seem to universally hate her and don't want to see her ever show up again. I think the flaws with the character come more from the show she was introduced in not the character in general.

100% agreed. I have felt that because of how Venus was poorly handled in Next Mutation, some people hesitate to the idea of a 5th turtle joining the group.

[Cowabunga Carl]

I was talking in general. From all my interaction with people who claim to be TMNT fans. I talk to people outside of these forums also. To me it just seems like a general consensus. I'm sorry if it isn't as scientifically proven for you, or that there is no poll to vote in. It's just something that I've noticed and I thought asking a question would be harmless. That a discussion could be started.

[Jester]

There's no chance of discussion with that one, Hob.

Part of me wonders if the bad blood for Venus is also fueled by Peter's extreme loathing of her. Having a co-creator of the franchise utterly destroy Venus when ever she's mentioned can color peoples opinions.

[Cowabunga Carl]

That brings into question how much of that hatred is based on loyalty to Liard though. Eastman seemed cool with her if memory served.

I just started thinking about this when I was looking in the comic section and I saw Ross Campbell doing his own take on the turtles and introducing his own turtle, Artemisia. I'm interested in seeing how he brings his character in.

But what if Tom and crew decided to introduce a 5th Turtle? Would people be cool with that?

[Mr.Turtle]

lets start a poll?

[zkarlette]

I think most of the issue is the way that she was introduced into the series and the fact that she is a "girl" turtle , that probably would change the dynamic in the house or something. more than anything I didn't particularly like the personality or voice actor chosen for the part in NM.

[KirkyMonster]

I think considering the tone of Next Mutation in general Venus was handled pretty well and added the mystic qualities similar to Splinter that for whatever reason the original 4 turtles never really seemed interested in (besides the scene in the first movie with the astral projection Splinter in the camp fire) I think Venus characterization filled a personality gap missing with the 4 original turtles. I think Slash is really cool but in my opinion his outer space origin in the Archie series is really dumb, but this is my favorite version of the character, the idea of Bebop and Rocksteady making a new mutant turtle to do there chores was a great way to introduce the new character though I really don't like the way Slash was handled in the cartoon. Even though Tokka came to be in similar fashion as the cartoon Slash I always thought Tokka and Rhazar were way too stupid mentally to be appealing to me (perhaps if they had developed mentally in time I would have liked them). I think Kirby looks really cool (depending which sketch you look at) I would have loved to know how Kirby would have been introduced. The clones from Fast Forward are interesting to look at though I don't know much of anything about this series. I think the more Mutants in TMNT the merrier, because no matter how new mutants are introduced (Turtle or not) the idea of pet turtles landing in the sewer and being covered in radioactive ooze and not only surviving but thriving through humanoid transformation sounds a little stupid if you haven't had the privilege of 28 years of stories to supplement the far fetched origin.

[Cowabunga Carl]

Could someone who knows more about Kirby post about what they know about him? What was the idea behind him? Why didn't he come to fruition?

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by KirkyMonster

I think considering the tone of Next Mutation in general Venus was handled pretty well and added the mystic qualities similar to Splinter that for whatever reason the original 4 turtles never really seemed interested in (besides the scene in the first movie with the astral projection Splinter in the camp fire) I think Venus characterization filled a personality gap missing with the 4 original turtles

There was no missing character gap. Being interested in whamy mystic s*ite is unrelatable.

[Candy Kappa]

what I have seen is mostly fanon 5th turtles, usually badly written Sues made for love interest or just to outshine the main turtles.

I think the flack Venus mostly gets isn't that she's a female, but was badly written. And served as a love interest for the turtles while being a overpowered magic user that took out Shredder without breaking a sweat or even fight. And she doesn't really bring much to the table in NTNM as a team player and as a character.

Slash never felt like the 5th turtle since he was an alien/Bebops pet, and Tokka is the same deal. You have to be a very good writer to make a compelling and a engaging story where there always was five turtles, sadly that wasn't the case with Next Mutation and I think that left a sour taste for many when it comes to an actual 5th turtle.

Now that said, I do like the idea of Venus.

[KROW]

Benvenuto's still my favorite.

[Candy Kappa]

No 5th turtle beats Benvenuto