What These Cartoons Did To Turtles - Page 4

Konchadunga · 01-31-2013, 11:13 AM

The Mirage series was at its best, in my opinion, when playing the whole fantasy kitchen sink thing full-stop. The sort of zany I expect from a series of this title, without the tameness the Fred Wolf show descended into quickly. I'm not opposed to the Turtles hacking and slashing enemies, shell; I prefer it, but simple Melee duels are something you can get a lot of other places. Creative ideas are what made the series good

Shredded · 01-31-2013, 02:45 PM

First of all.

"Adam Wests Batman." did not kill Batman or disgraced it, it's the reason why Batman became popular and why Burton even get to make a movie later, and the 92 show was originally made to promote the Burton movie, and Nolan only got to make his movie because Burtons movie and the tas show made the Batman the most popular hero out there.

No Adam West Batman.. no Batman in the modern day, it is what made the hero popular enough in the public eye the first time around for any-one to even bother later with the figure.

Beside Adam Wests Batman is awesome.
And we are talking the age of the silver age comics! pick up a silver age comic, read it, and remind yourself that is the time Adam Wests Batman came out, that was how comic books were back then. They first changed to a more serious tone with the comic book renecaence in the 80's twenty years after.

Any-way.. don't look at the eighties turtle as the thing that dummed Turtles down. Look at it as the thing that made the turtles importnat!

Here's the thing, the original tmnt mirage comic book were nothing but an underground comic book, sold some issues for its time, sure. But without the popularity of the show, would any-one really have cared today?

The movie happened because of the popularity of the show, not the comics.
Most people were introduced to the turtles through the tely show, and then back-tracked later to the comics, thus the show actually introduced most people to the comics and made them relevant in the first place.

A new ninja turtles show that pays tribute to the 80's show is not killing the turtles or the darker versions of them.. it's keeping them alive!
It's introducing an entire new genneration to the turtles, an genneration whom would not have cared otherwise, some of these kids will grow up and one day, search out the source material of the turtles on their own, which would be the mirage comic books.

What would really suck, would be if the show was really bad, cause that would turn people off the turtles, and they wouldn't search out the source material, then it would be killing it.
But it's not, it's a good show, thus a new genneration of kids can search out the source material on their own, because of their own interest.

People can be so protective of their fandomn, and even go so far as to prefer having nothing new coming out over a re-make.

But here's the thing... remakes are a franchise way of surviving past it's initial genneration.

I hate a bad remake just as much as the next guy, things that are being made for name recognision only have a tendencey to suck.
But a genuinly good new remake and re-enterpretation of things I like, introducing it to a bigger audience so I can share my passion with them. How can I be angry or even dissapointed about that?

Beside, here seems to be the curve of the turtles.

"Mirage comics, adult and gritty, though also with a sense of humour." (thank god, I can't take dark and gritty that takes itself to seriously, I need good characterasation.)
"Eighties show, fun and comedic, some-times feels like a self parody."
"Movies, some-where in the middle."
"2k3 show, back to comic book roots, pulling scenes, character and dialougs straight out of the comic book, takes itself much more serious."
"2k7 movie, feels in tone like the more serious 2k3 show."
"2k12 show, fun tribute to the eighties show with a flair of drama mixed with the comedy."

Each one a new interpretation, each one trying to be different than the previous one, which is good.. you don't make some-thing new for it to be a carbon copy of some-thing that all-ready exist. It needs to be a tribute to what came before, also adding new things. All interpretations will do that.

And to take a guess.. the 2k12 show will run its own course, run for some years, and then end. Now that was a more fun show. So what will be natural to make after that? A more serious show, so that will probably come next in around a decade from now.

Just enjoy your ride, and enjoy that your fandomn is not only alive, but is striving so well, and you can share the awesomness with a younger crowd whom also loves the turtles

*Candy Kappa* · 02-01-2013, 01:50 AM

You right, the Adam west show did not hold Batman down, it temporarily boosted it.

Batman thrives in all genres but the sales was falling back in the early 60's after the Comics Code Authority, where Batman began having zany campy space adventures. The whole Batman world was redesigned right before the Adam West show, and the influence the TV show had over the comic, vanished as soon as the show was canceled cause the sales dropped again. And then comes Dennis O'Neil and Neal Adams.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shredded

"Mirage comics, adult and gritty, though also with a sense of humour." (thank god, I can't take dark and gritty that takes itself to seriously, I need good characterasation.) )

Hmm, I guess you haven't read much Mirage. it's no more adult then the marvel comics that was in the mid 80's, dark & gritty? Not really, this wasn't any MAX print. C'mon get real.

The TMNT might be a indie comic, but they where still very popular before the cartoon show. They had their very own PnPRPG for Pete's sake, which had multiple supplement book. The RPG's downfall was the cartoon, sadly.

Shredded · 02-01-2013, 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

You right, the Adam west show did not hold Batman down, it temporarily boosted it.

Batman thrives in all genres but the sales was falling back in the early 60's after the Comics Code Authority, where Batman began having zany campy space adventures. The whole Batman world was redesigned right before the Adam West show, and the influence the TV show had over the comic, vanished as soon as the show was canceled cause the sales dropped again. And then comes Dennis O'Neil and Neal Adams.

Hmm, I guess you haven't read much Mirage. it's no more adult then the marvel comics that was in the mid 80's, dark & gritty? Not really, this wasn't any MAX print. C'mon get real.

The TMNT might be a indie comic, but they where still very popular before the cartoon show. They had their very own PnPRPG for Pete's sake, which had multiple supplement book. The RPG's downfall was the cartoon, sadly.

I also think people tend to forget that "Batman Tas." actually weren't any call-backs to any roots. There existed nothing like Batman Tas before that show, not in comic book format, not in tely, not any-where. Batman tas invented this tone, which is today so synomenous with comic books, it invented a new form of story telling, the tone, several background stories, it re-shaped how we look at not only comic books and comic book adaptations.. but saturday morning cartoons! Batman tas were its own revolution, telling we can have smarter stories in children shows. allowing the way for such things as the 4kids ninja turtles where there's genuine empathis on clever story, and even this new nick show.
And clearly the creators of Batman Tas were actually fans of the Adam West show as they drew several elements from the show, even re-used some characters and call-backs.

So yeah, we owe Adam West Batman.. which is an awesome show. Only show I have ever seen where an elderly lady just pulls up a BB-gun from her hand-bag and yells at her kids at the children. "Just keep on eating your carrots boys! i'll handle this!" *Steps towards window and starts shooting at police.* .... oO;

I've read some of the Mirage comics, and what stroke me was the actual good characterasation, embrace of it's own "Fantastic." univers, which fully utilize that this is an story that can do what-ever it feels like, it can use "Sciense." as if it's magic, does it feel like it.
It never stands still and actually do stuff, without being to pretentious. "Look at us we are so gritty."
That's what annoys me most about. "Serious stories." it takes itself so serious.. that it doesn't do a thing, nothing ever happens, that's pretentious and boring.
The comic is about four teenage mutant ninja turtles, and it is aware of that, it's not "Realistic." in any stretch of the word, and that's pretty good.

You know what I meant, the tone of the comics is darker than any of the interpretation in moving media.

But I guess the thing also is, the comics were made for teens and young adults in mind, the movies and tely show has to be made for kids, at most young teen. So erh yeah, there will always be a tone difference.

How-ever, as I like a good saturday morning cartoon that just go for traditionel story telling without needing to out-smart itself and just have a good time.
I don't mind at all.

01-31-2013, 11:13 AM	#61
Konchadunga Stone Warrior Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Southern California Posts: 912	The Mirage series was at its best, in my opinion, when playing the whole fantasy kitchen sink thing full-stop. The sort of zany I expect from a series of this title, without the tameness the Fred Wolf show descended into quickly. I'm not opposed to the Turtles hacking and slashing enemies, shell; I prefer it, but simple Melee duels are something you can get a lot of other places. Creative ideas are what made the series good __________________

01-31-2013, 02:45 PM	#62
Shredded Foot Soldier Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 228	First of all. "Adam Wests Batman." did not kill Batman or disgraced it, it's the reason why Batman became popular and why Burton even get to make a movie later, and the 92 show was originally made to promote the Burton movie, and Nolan only got to make his movie because Burtons movie and the tas show made the Batman the most popular hero out there. No Adam West Batman.. no Batman in the modern day, it is what made the hero popular enough in the public eye the first time around for any-one to even bother later with the figure. Beside Adam Wests Batman is awesome. And we are talking the age of the silver age comics! pick up a silver age comic, read it, and remind yourself that is the time Adam Wests Batman came out, that was how comic books were back then. They first changed to a more serious tone with the comic book renecaence in the 80's twenty years after. Any-way.. don't look at the eighties turtle as the thing that dummed Turtles down. Look at it as the thing that made the turtles importnat! Here's the thing, the original tmnt mirage comic book were nothing but an underground comic book, sold some issues for its time, sure. But without the popularity of the show, would any-one really have cared today? The movie happened because of the popularity of the show, not the comics. Most people were introduced to the turtles through the tely show, and then back-tracked later to the comics, thus the show actually introduced most people to the comics and made them relevant in the first place. A new ninja turtles show that pays tribute to the 80's show is not killing the turtles or the darker versions of them.. it's keeping them alive! It's introducing an entire new genneration to the turtles, an genneration whom would not have cared otherwise, some of these kids will grow up and one day, search out the source material of the turtles on their own, which would be the mirage comic books. What would really suck, would be if the show was really bad, cause that would turn people off the turtles, and they wouldn't search out the source material, then it would be killing it. But it's not, it's a good show, thus a new genneration of kids can search out the source material on their own, because of their own interest. People can be so protective of their fandomn, and even go so far as to prefer having nothing new coming out over a re-make. But here's the thing... remakes are a franchise way of surviving past it's initial genneration. I hate a bad remake just as much as the next guy, things that are being made for name recognision only have a tendencey to suck. But a genuinly good new remake and re-enterpretation of things I like, introducing it to a bigger audience so I can share my passion with them. How can I be angry or even dissapointed about that? Beside, here seems to be the curve of the turtles. "Mirage comics, adult and gritty, though also with a sense of humour." (thank god, I can't take dark and gritty that takes itself to seriously, I need good characterasation.) "Eighties show, fun and comedic, some-times feels like a self parody." "Movies, some-where in the middle." "2k3 show, back to comic book roots, pulling scenes, character and dialougs straight out of the comic book, takes itself much more serious." "2k7 movie, feels in tone like the more serious 2k3 show." "2k12 show, fun tribute to the eighties show with a flair of drama mixed with the comedy." Each one a new interpretation, each one trying to be different than the previous one, which is good.. you don't make some-thing new for it to be a carbon copy of some-thing that all-ready exist. It needs to be a tribute to what came before, also adding new things. All interpretations will do that. And to take a guess.. the 2k12 show will run its own course, run for some years, and then end. Now that was a more fun show. So what will be natural to make after that? A more serious show, so that will probably come next in around a decade from now. Just enjoy your ride, and enjoy that your fandomn is not only alive, but is striving so well, and you can share the awesomness with a younger crowd whom also loves the turtles Last edited by Shredded; 01-31-2013 at 02:50 PM.