Which Shredder is better: 03 or 87.

[gzilla46]

Originally Posted by cartoonistaaron

Plus 2k3 Shredder was way too convoluted. He was cool at first, but then he was an Utrom? And then there was that Tengu Shredder, whatever that was? Too much.

They probably did that because they tried to add as MUCH character development as they could with Shredder. But still, there's only SO MUCH you can do with a certain character.

[Method101]

CMON NOW! True, 03 shredder may have been more bad ass, but JAMES AVERY as shredder makes me choose the 87. Just so many good memories growing up with the original shredder character, it actually bothered me in Turtles Forever when they made him out to be a little punk to the utrom one

[Lethal Lullaby]

I'd have to go with the 2K3 Shredder. He actually looked like someone you don't wanna mess with. Also this may sound cliche but "he does have a great sense of style. I mean nice outfit".

[SS_Turtle]

2K3 Shredder was dark, badass and worthy of being a true villain.To top it off he was actually a threat!

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by samg

2K3 Shredder was dark, badass and worthy of being a true villain.To top it off he was actually a threat!

To be brutally honest, he stopped being a threat after the Turtles whooped him in "Return To New York"

OT Shredder once levitated 90% of NYC. Has Ch'rell ever done that?

[Stingray69]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

To be brutally honest, he stopped being a threat after the Turtles whooped him in "Return To New York"

OT Shredder once levitated 90% of NYC. Has Ch'rell ever done that?

Plus dude the technodrome, come on technodrome vs office building. It's technodrome for the win by a landslide.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

OT Shredder once levitated 90% of NYC.

Which episode?

[Stingray69]

Originally Posted by Swedenfan 1982

Which episode?

Pretty sure its sky turtles.

[Xav]

Originally Posted by Jester

I'm kind partial to the FW (90's) Shredder, BUT he has to be paired with Krang. What made the Fred Wolf villains fun was their dynamic together. The "old married couple" vibe they had was fun.

Would't FW Shredder be 80's?

[03 Leonardo]

Neither Shredder is cool to me. While only one is my arch nemesis, they are both evil villains.

[Jester]

Originally Posted by Xav

Wouldn't FW Shredder be 80's?

I guess, but the series ran for 10 years...7 of which were in the 90's.

[Samhain]

2k3 is better. But FW Shred-head is far more entertaining.

[Jester]

FW Shredder: More Character. More Entertaining.
4Kids Shredder: More "EVIL!!!". More Intimidating.

[MikeandRaph87]

Originally Posted by Jester

FW Shredder: More Character. More Entertaining.
4Kids Shredder: More "EVIL!!!". More Intimidating.

I will go with that except Chr'ell was ALLOWED to be more "evil" because of less restrictions when the cartoon was made opposed to the late 80s' into the mid 90s' where more restrictions forced more chessy and less dark. Just imagine if Shredder was allowed to have kills off screen like was done in some 2000s cartoons and his partner-in-crime had to have shed someone's blood to be exiled as he was.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by mikeandraph87

I will go with that except Chr'ell was ALLOWED to be more "evil" because of less restrictions when the cartoon was made opposed to the late 80s' into the mid 90s' where more restrictions forced more chessy and less dark. Just imagine if Shredder was allowed to have kills off screen like was done in some 2000s cartoons and his partner-in-crime had to have shed someone's blood to be exiled as he was.

Adding on it was on network television too which was very restrictive.

[Killer Moth]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

To be brutally honest, he stopped being a threat after the Turtles whooped him in "Return To New York"

OT Shredder once levitated 90% of NYC. Has Ch'rell ever done that?

If you count the Manhattan Project game as part of that era, then technically that's twice he levitated NYC. Although, 87 Shredder didn't have the "I must not have my public identity become associated with my secret crimes and criminal organization for as long as possible" shtick, which Ch'rell had to deal with as Oroku Saki. Thus, it's a lot easier for 87 Shredder to cut loose. Conversely, as mikeandraph and others noted, Ch'rell benefited with lesser censorship, so he, in turn, could cut loose with mayhem, death, destruction, etc. It's an interesting Catch-22 when you compare/contrast them.

I want to like Ch'rell, except he's too one-dimensional. It's great he's more competent and actively wants to kill the Turtles, yet he doesn't get more complicated than "I'm evil! I hate Turtles! Yah!" What else is there? Granted, the same could be said with 87 Shredder, in terms of general motivation, but as oldmanwinters implied, 87 Shredder clearly has far more personality and range in his approach.

Besides achieving the rare "comedic relief villain who could actually pose a serious threat" archetype, 87 Shredder in the early-to-middle seasons had a borderline sympathetic quality in his constant failures. You almost want to feel sorry for him, until you realize what he did with the Mousers, Baxter's near execution (twice!) and much later, "I Never Bluff."

Great work if you can get it, and most animated villains, especially of that era, don't.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by 03 Leonardo

Neither Shredder is cool to me. While only one is my arch nemesis, they are both evil villains.

...Are you actually going to roleplay when you post?

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Originally Posted by Stingray69

Pretty sure its sky turtles.

Krang's invention.

[Dirty Blond]

Karai Shredder.

[Stingray69]

Originally Posted by Swedenfan 1982

Krang's invention.

Did ch'rell invent anything himself?