Republicans push for an amendment that would ban abortion; even if the woman is raped

[ComicBookBoy]

Originally Posted by The Stryker

And that couldn't possibly be attributed to the situation that led to abortion or anything of course not. How about you throw out some more meaningless statistics that amount to a hill of beans. I heard if you go outside you increase your chances of getting hit by a car by 100%!

Force people to have unwanted children because of YOUR moral standing. Nobody is asking you and people like you to police the world personally.

Most women have unwanted pregnancies because they were careless, not because they were raped. What I said still stands.

Originally Posted by The Stryker

Church going Christian here BTW. Enjoy the rape everyone! Because...well....sperm is alive apparently.

Keep insults out of this discussion. What you said is just insulting and has no meaning in this discussion.

[The Stryker]

Originally Posted by ComicBookBoy

Most women have unwanted pregnancies because they were careless, not because they were raped. What I said still stands.


Keep insults out of this discussion. What you said is just insulting and has no meaning in this discussion.

What insults just saying that I am a church going Christian and I don't believe others should be forced to do something because of moral standings of a few others.

You have a statistic for that first one or are just going to go with what you perceive again? Even if it was the case, who cares? It's their body, their choice and their lives. Sure it's f*cked up and irresponsible but guess what? Free will homie! That's speaking for the women that just had an accident of course. Rape victims shouldn't be looked down upon for not wanting to carry on the legacy of the dude that raped them.

[ComicBookBoy]

Originally Posted by The Stryker

What insults just saying that I am a church going Christian and I don't believe others should be forced to do something because of moral standings of a few others.

Originally Posted by The Stryker
Church going Christian here BTW. Enjoy the rape everyone!

Sorry about that, I thought you were saying that church going Christians enjoy the rape. I misunderstood you.

[Candy Kappa]

This is as stupid as the law that states a rapist can marry his victim to avoid persecution, heck they could go hand in hand. Let the rapist marry the victim if she gets pregnant from the rape, so the child won't be born out of wedlock.

this article and view points makes me sick to my stomach of this, let's give a f*ck about women's rights and care more about someone that is unborn then the living. had this been just another anti-abortion viewpoint it would be an eye roller, but it's about rape. Shall we blame the victim as well, was she showing her knees. she practically asked to be raped no abortion for you. F*ck this sh*t

[Master Splinter]

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

This is as stupid as the law that states a rapist can marry his victim to avoid persecution, heck they could go hand in hand. Let the rapist marry the victim if she gets pregnant from the rape, so the child won't be born out of wedlock.

This brings up an interesting thought... What kind of rights does the rapist have now that he is a father? Sure he committed a crime by raping the woman but he should still have rights as a new father correct? Could he legally keep the woman he raped from having an abortion because he is the father and wants to raise the child? What if he is very christian and believes every word out of Leviticus. Should the woman be forced to marry the man who raped her just so everything is peachy in the eyes of the lord.

I don't agree with this but it seems like many here would with the backwards thinking I am seeing in this thread. You can believe whatever you want, but if you are trying to make a law based on your religious belief then it seems as though you are crossing a line, because there is a big chance that I don't believe what you believe. So don't force your beliefs on me. If you have a problem with it, pray for me, and in the end I will deal with God on my own. I don't need your laws, guidance, or approval for that.

-ms

[ComicBookBoy]

Originally Posted by Master Splinter

This brings up an interesting thought... What kind of rights does the rapist have now that he is a father? Sure he committed a crime by raping the woman but he should still have rights as a new father correct? Could he legally keep the woman he raped from having an abortion because he is the father and wants to raise the child? What if he is very christian and believes every word out of Leviticus. Should the woman be forced to marry the man who raped her just so everything is peachy in the eyes of the lord.

I don't agree with this but it seems like many here would with the backwards thinking I am seeing in this thread. You can believe whatever you want, but if you are trying to make a law based on your religious belief then it seems as though you are crossing a line, because there is a big chance that I don't believe what you believe. So don't force your beliefs on me. If you have a problem with it, pray for me, and in the end I will deal with God on my own. I don't need your laws, guidance, or approval for that.

-ms

It's not that the guy who raped the woman should have a choice in whether the baby is aborted or not, it's that no one should have a choice of whether or not to kill their baby. The baby should be allowed to live without any consent from the mother or the father.

You tell me not to press my beliefs on others, and not to fuse my beliefs with the laws, but aren't you trying to do the same thing? Except you're belief is that abortion should be legal and that it's not murder.

[Candy Kappa]

Originally Posted by ComicBookBoy

You tell me not to press my beliefs on others, and not to fuse my beliefs with the laws, but aren't you trying to do the same thing? Except you're belief is that abortion should be legal and that it's not murder.

But would people that share the same view get an abortion, people have a free will. Or do you think that people are so stupid that they loose their own way of thinking just because something is legal.

Pretty sure woman did abortion when it was illegal, people was drinking alcohol during prohibition times, and some people don't drink today even thought it is legal to have a beer.

this is very akin the the anti-marijuana vs legalizing marijuana, some people think it'll be Ragnarok if it gets legal cause everyone will get high and go on a murder rampage.

[ComicBookBoy]

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

But would people that share the same view get an abortion, people have a free will. Or do you think that people are so stupid that they loose their own way of thinking just because something is legal.

Pretty sure woman did abortion when it was illegal, people was drinking alcohol during prohibition times, and some people don't drink today even thought it is legal to have a beer.

this is very akin the the anti-marijuana vs legalizing marijuana, some people think it'll be Ragnarok if it gets legal cause everyone will get high and go on a murder rampage.

So, what about just plain murder? People do it all of the time, why restrict it?
THE REASON: because if you restrict something and make punishments for them then far fewer people will murder. The same can be said for abortion.

[Master Splinter]

Originally Posted by ComicBookBoy

It's not that the guy who raped the woman should have a choice in whether the baby is aborted or not, it's that no one should have a choice of whether or not to kill their baby. The baby should be allowed to live without any consent from the mother or the father.

You tell me not to press my beliefs on others, and not to fuse my beliefs with the laws, but aren't you trying to do the same thing? Except you're belief is that abortion should be legal and that it's not murder.

No I am not pressing my beliefs onto you. My belief allows free-will (something God gave to us all if you believe in that sort of thing), aka a choice, a choice to believe whatever you want to believe, you can believe abortion is wrong, you can believe abortion is okay. What you decide on your own is not my decision to make. You on the other hand do not offer any sort of choice. It's either your way or the highway to hell or jail. I can understand that you feel you have a moral obligation to protect an unborn child but I feel it is my moral obligation to keep you the f.u.c.k out of my business. Your religion is not the same as mine so how can you prove that you are right and I am wrong?

-ms

[Type 97 Chi-ha]

Originally Posted by Master Splinter

No I am not pressing my beliefs onto you. My belief allows free-will (something God gave to us all if you believe in that sort of thing), aka a choice, a choice to believe whatever you want to believe, you can believe abortion is wrong, you can believe abortion is okay. What you decide on your own is not my decision to make. You on the other hand do not offer any sort of choice. It's either your way or the highway to hell or jail. I can understand that you feel you have a moral obligation to protect an unborn child but I feel it is my moral obligation to keep you the f.u.c.k out of my business. Your religion is not the same as mine so how can you prove that you are right and I am wrong?

-ms

Religion has nothing to do with this. Pressing beliefs upon people is done in every society. In the USA, people cannot legally drink until age 21; public accomodations (restaurants, hotels, etc.) cannot refuse service to people on the basis of race, religion, etc.; you cannot use asbestos in construction or manufacturing; you cannot have a radar detector in your vehicle in West Virginia; you cannot walk around naked in public. Society can restrict abortion if it wants to; it is not a "constitutional right".

[Katie]

Originally Posted by Master Splinter

This brings up an interesting thought... What kind of rights does the rapist have now that he is a father? Sure he committed a crime by raping the woman but he should still have rights as a new father correct? Could he legally keep the woman he raped from having an abortion because he is the father and wants to raise the child? What if he is very christian and believes every word out of Leviticus. Should the woman be forced to marry the man who raped her just so everything is peachy in the eyes of the lord.

I don't agree with this but it seems like many here would with the backwards thinking I am seeing in this thread. You can believe whatever you want, but if you are trying to make a law based on your religious belief then it seems as though you are crossing a line, because there is a big chance that I don't believe what you believe. So don't force your beliefs on me. If you have a problem with it, pray for me, and in the end I will deal with God on my own. I don't need your laws, guidance, or approval for that.

-ms

In 31 states the rapist does actually have parental rights. So, as a woman, you would then have to go to court again to fight for the termination of the rapists parental rights should he demand custody or visitation.

Also, in my understanding of God, God is all knowing.....your whole life is known to Him before you are even known. So, this being the case, God already knows the fate of every fetus. Why would he put a soul in something he knows isn't going to be in the world.

[Master Splinter]

Originally Posted by Katie

In 31 states the rapist does actually have parental rights. So, as a woman, you would then have to go to court again to fight for the termination of the rapists parental rights should he demand custody or visitation.

Also, in my understanding of God, God is all knowing.....your whole life is known to Him before you are even known. So, this being the case, God already knows the fate of every fetus. Why would he put a soul in something he knows isn't going to be in the world.

So in theory a man can rape a woman, get her pregnant, have the law keep her from having an abortion, take her to court for custody, and possibly have her pay child support as well.

Wow.

-ms

[ComicBookBoy]

Originally Posted by Katie

In 31 states the rapist does actually have parental rights. So, as a woman, you would then have to go to court again to fight for the termination of the rapists parental rights should he demand custody or visitation.

Also, in my understanding of God, God is all knowing.....your whole life is known to Him before you are even known. So, this being the case, God already knows the fate of every fetus. Why would he put a soul in something he knows isn't going to be in the world.

Each of those children who were aborted still had a soul, and God still loved them. That is why God said,
"See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.."
Just because God knows that those children are going to be murdered doesn't mean He is going to intervene. If God stopped every person from doing something evil then the world would be perfect.

[Katie]

Murder shouldn't be used to describe an abortion.

Murder is a legal term whereby a human knowingly and with malice ends the life of another human. For it to be murder, the fetus would have to be considered legally alive. In the legal definition of life....life begins at birth not conception.

Exceptions are sometimes made when the fetus would be viable outside the womb as in the Lacy Peterson case.

[ComicBookBoy]

Originally Posted by The Stryker

You have a statistic for that first one or are just going to go with what you perceive again? Even if it was the case, who cares? It's their body, their choice and their lives. Sure it's f*cked up and irresponsible but guess what? Free will homie! That's speaking for the women that just had an accident of course. Rape victims shouldn't be looked down upon for not wanting to carry on the legacy of the dude that raped them.

They don't have to keep the baby as their own, they could give it to an adoption agency. If you had to choose whether to live at an adoption agency or be put to death which would you choose?

[Andrew NDB]

The way things are going, they really ought to be encouraging, perhaps even forcing abortions in some cases... not banning them.

[Type 97 Chi-ha]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

The way things are going, they really ought to be encouraging, perhaps even forcing abortions in some cases... not banning them.

What about for underage females? Can parents or guardians compel kids under their care to get an abortion, as the mother didn't have the legal right of consent?

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Type 97 Chi-ha

What about for underage females? Can parents or guardians compel kids under their care to get an abortion, as the mother didn't have the legal right of consent?

No, but the state should probably step in at that point and sterilize the kids afterward until they're an adult. Or something.

Too many people, and at the rate and growth of resources we're expending is unsustainable. China is the model to follow, but no one will ever be the president or governor to make the tough decisions that need to happen (1, maybe 2 children per registered family, etc., and oh, you know that underage kid that squeezed out a kid? that wasn't a "freebie," that counts to the 1-2 kid total).

[Master Splinter]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

No, but the state should probably step in at that point and sterilize the kids afterward until they're an adult.

Too many people, and the rate and growth of resources we're expending is unsustainable. China is the model to follow, but no one will ever be the president or governor to make the tough decisions that need to happen (1, maybe 2 children per registered family, etc., and oh, you know that underage kid that squeezed out a kid? that wasn't a "freebie," that counts to the 1-2 kid total).

You are absolutely right Andrew, the world's population is growing at a crazy rate, and to a point to where we will be killing each other over natural resources... wait that's already happening!

-ms

[Xav]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Too many people, and at the rate and growth of resources we're expending is unsustainable. China is the model to follow, but no one will ever be the president or governor to make the tough decisions that need to happen (1, maybe 2 children per registered family, etc., and oh, you know that underage kid that squeezed out a kid? that wasn't a "freebie," that counts to the 1-2 kid total).

Really China is the model to follow? So we should force women to have abortions, and abort all the female fetuses so we have an imbalance of men and women?

Originally Posted by mysterycolor

you are absolutely right- and that is why decisions involving pregnancy, abortion and anything else surrounding our reproductive system should be left for us to determine what is best. as if just being pregnant isnt tumultuous enough, add in a less than desirable, or absolutely tragic situation into that... and make it worse by having people hover around judging when they know nothing about what it is like. ever notice that during abortion debates people rarely bring up the situations where pregnancy has to be "terminated" because complications will result in the death of the mother- how dare anyone make that woman feel wrong for choosing to abort the fetus so she can live... it is disgusting the way we treat women in this country it is often referred to as the "invisible burka"- we may not come right out and cover our women... but politicians wont hesitate to slash their rights for a campaign promise... and the fact that it is effective proves just how deep the nastiness goes.

WTF, again your thinking in extremes that the only two views on abortion are abortion is ok no matter what, or ban abortion with no exceptions.