Do you like the way Donnie acts around April this series? - Page 3

*BabyTurtles* · 06-20-2014, 03:25 PM

I defiantly don't like the way Donnie acts around April.

I also don't like the way April acts around Donnie.

Casey is starting to also get on my nerves.

(can't we just end the love triangle?)

*BubblyShell22* · 06-20-2014, 03:49 PM

No because that's the way the writers want it. I don't mind it at all, and I don't see April as just a love interest for Donnie anyway. She is her own person even if we haven't seen much of that as of late. Same goes for Karai not just being Leo's love interest. The only people who may define Donnie solely by his crush on April are the ones who are new to the franchise or who only want to see that because they like it. We all know there's more to Donnie than just his crush on April, but instead of people focusing on those aspects, they want to b*tch and moan about Don and April.

*BabyTurtles* · 06-20-2014, 04:03 PM

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Originally Posted by BubblyShell22

No because that's the way the writers want it. I don't mind it at all, and I don't see April as just a love interest for Donnie anyway. She is her own person even if we haven't seen much of that as of late. Same goes for Karai not just being Leo's love interest. The only people who may define Donnie solely by his crush on April are the ones who are new to the franchise or who only want to see that because they like it. We all know there's more to Donnie than just his crush on April, but instead of people focusing on those aspects, they want to b*tch and moan about Don and April.

look we both see things differently. No biggie.

I believe the love stuff is too focused on whenever April shows up.

maybe you think everything is fine. We can agree to disagree.

But no one is complaining just to whine, we just see a problem and are criticizing it. At the end of the day we all want the show to do awesome.....but when a good amount of people see a problem with the love stuff....then somethings gotta be wrong with it right?

Raphtastic · 06-20-2014, 04:11 PM

Disclaimer: this is all just my personal opinion and no one is obligated to just agree with me. I'm not out to pick fights, just opinionated and long-winded.

And it's not directed at anyone in particular, just the general theme of complaints I keep hearing about this part of the show both on this site and elsewhere.

I'm just kinda tired of the use of stalker, Nice Guy TM, etc for Donnie in this series. Not because of shipping or because I'm some kind of delusional person who thinks a character I like or show I like is infallible and beyond reproach, but because those words have a serious meaning for me and seeing them applied this way irks me the same way people casually tossing out the word sociopath irks me. (Sociopath has a meaning and it isn't "mean person that I don't like or understand. " Or serial killer or criminal genius or any number of other things. )

Donnie isn't bitterly complaining to everyone in earshot or any other character on the show that girls (or April in particular) owe him a relationship because he is civil to them and thinks they're pretty. He isn't pretending to be her friend or care about April as a ruse to get something from her. If she turns him down, the writers of this show have given no indication that he will drop her friendship like a hot rock or fly into a rage at her because she owes him. He's not telling or implying that April is his girlfriend and seems mostly afraid she thinks he's a freak. His occasional "my beautiful princess" in context seemed more pathetic and day dreamy than an overt, literal assertion of possession. He backpedaled and seemed apologetic to April when he realized what he'd said aloud. We're allowed to wish that someone is our beautiful prince/princess/person that we adore. What you're not allowed to do is to just assume that you own someone or that they HAVE to like you back, and there's a big difference between the two.

There are good conversations to be had about writers in media using female characters as objects for the hero to obtain who have little or no personality or agency of their own, but I see no evidence that Donnie is a Nice Guy TM and I think there's some convenient forgetfulness surrounding April's story arcs and characterization where we might be throwing the writers of the show further under the bus than they deserve. I am happy to see that people are actually looking for and talking about these harmful tropes, but I think we do have to keep in mind that April is a secondary character, the show has a pretty short run time and the emphasis is on action, so there may not be a ton of room for extra elaboration and nuance here. I see April as a stubborn, independent character with her own story arc outside of Donnie's unrequited crush and Casey ' s crude pursuit of her affections. (Honestly, Casey needs some extra background and development, but that's another story.)

As for the "stalking, " that bugs me more because the application of stalking here is overkill and I take stalking extremely seriously. I've seen it in real life and it isn't anything they're covering here. Fortunately. Because I don't watch TMNT to delve into that weirdness. April and Donnie are friends, so they know where the other one hangs out. April (and anyone else, for that matter) knows that Metalhead has a camera and that Donnie is controlling him, so she has no expectation of not being observed. Staring, while sometimes (okay, usually) rude or pathetic, is not equivalent to stalking or entitlement or really anything except possibly bad manners. If he were actively staring at certain body parts and/or commenting on them all the time, that would be different, but they haven't been writing Donnie that sleezy. (The nice jumpsuit comment was the only thing on his part that I recall getting close.) Showing up where you know someone you have a crush on likes to hang out in hopes of seeing them or talking to them is not stalking, even if you chicken out and just occasionally stare moon eyed at them. It might be awkward and pathetic, and it might not be comfortable to have someone who has unrequited feelings for you hanging around, but that doesn't mean you get to label every annoying or awkward person who likes you a creep or harasser or stalker. There's an actual line one has to cross to earn that label and it's a serious one. We should all be able to expect to not be harassed or stalked. But we don't get to demand that we never feel uncomfortable because someone likes us, we don't feel that way about them, and it's awkward. That's just a part of life. And, yeah, if you're the person with the unrequited feelings, try not to stare and absolutely do not do things like hover without talking to someone. But Donnie isn't being that weird guy who comes up like right next to/behind you and wordlessly creepily dances with?/at? you when you're just trying to watch a band or dance with your friends. At all.

As for the park, we can assume that Donnie wouldn't hide if he weren't, ya know, a mutant turtle who might attract lots of attention and violence if he weren't hiding. We can also assume that occasionally following friends/family/love interests in superhero contexts to make sure they get home safely or are doing all right or whatever is a different context from following someone like a predator everywhere they go in the real world. (There's actually a lot of behaviors in superhero/sci fi/fantasy/supernatural/action thriller contexts that would be creepy if you remove important aspects like someone being hunted down by aliens/monsters/whatever or villains plotting world domination. Typical crime fighting heroes would just be creepy people hanging out on rooftops, spying on everyone, following their loved ones around, lying to people about what they do in a totally bad way instead of "just protecting their secret identity so they can save the world/stop crime.") Donnie didn't track April for hours/days waiting for her to be alone so that he could scream at her about talking to a boy. He hasn't been breaking into her place to watch her sleep or installing cameras in her bathroom or something. He's not breaking her stuff or leaving her creepy gifts at her place, showing up at her home all the time after she's told him to leave her alone or getting up in her personal space, pawing at her and hanging on her against her wishes. He's not tracking her anywhere close to everywhere or all the time.

When April tells him to back off, he does and he apologizes. Splinter has a good conversation with him about how you can't make someone like you. Donnie is socially awkward and just learning about boundaries, so sticking around too long can be something we discuss, but it still doesn't make him a stalker. He is too busy and doing too many other things to have time to stalk April and, to me, appears to have too many other interests. Some of which are tangential to April (curing her father), but I don't think they are just shallow acts to impress her. Seriously, he's mostly depicted hanging out with his brothers and in his lab.

This doesn't mean someone likeable can't stalk someone or do bad things. Just that stalking is a real thing that goes beyond an occasional boundary transgression. I honestly thought the thing with the park and Splinter ' s discussion was a decent lesson about dealing with possible rejection and the temptation that a young person might have to be too pushy or not respect another person's boundaries and agency. Could the show have done more or better? Yes. But I think that it's important to point out that April is not afraid of Donnie and is still his very good friend even if she finds his behavior annoying on occasion. That context is important and not unrealistic.

And I also think arguments that April is leading Casey and Donnie on are unfounded. I don't see them writing her as a manipulative game player. She may not know what she wants or how she feels or she may have more important things on her mind (like all the drama with her father, the mystery surrounding her powers and her mother, etc) than sorting out a dating life that we're not certain she's interested in. There's been no evidence in the show that she's cold or calculating, anyway. I hope that the show doesn't slide into the easy trap of reducing her to a mere love interest and that, should she decide to date either Casey or Donnie, she does so for good reasons (not just Casey ' s the only human who knows the turtles or because he's just more confident; not just because Donnie likes her). So far, I'm not seeing it. They could leave her single. She could date Casey for awhile and they might realize they're too different or something and wind up finding a real reason to date Donnie later, as they've grown up more. She could date Donnie and find his life ultimately too different for her to really want that. Or she could have a more simple happily ever after scenario. If it's handled well and doesn't take over the action, I'm cool with it.

Btw, Refractive Reflections, "Tales of the Young and Scaly" cracked me up. There's many a fan fic that could go by that name! (Not that I have any problem with fan fic) And I can respect your argument that fandom can get caught up in trying to ship everyone. Though I'm not sure that removing romantic subplots would help, because fandom has a tendency to do that (and to pair up the weirdest combos of characters...like people who met once or mortal enemies) regardless. I think people just like to talk about Donnie's crush because 1. it's a new aspect of the franchise (we nerds are resistant to change), 2. some people want no romance and 3. The whole mutant and human aspect of the possible relationship. (I sometimes wonder if they've heard of Mass Effect or Captain Kirk or any number of sci fi/supernatural romance/fantasy books, but, whatever, to them it's a new idea)

*JTH* · 06-20-2014, 04:23 PM

^^^

True, the "Donnie knew April was at the park is creepy" thing confuses me to no end.

Do people just forget the Mutagen Man episode? Of course he knew she is always at the park at that time.

He's clearly been with her there before, along with who knows how many more times. He knew from experience, not from stalking.

Konchadunga · 06-20-2014, 04:44 PM

Don may not be a stalker, and it helps to know he's not a jerk. He may have taken his lust too far, but it's obviously not going to the point of predation. Nevertheless, the show's insistence on continuing this bit as is gets annoying. I have nothing against shipping, but I do despise any status-quo-is-God dilly-dallying on principle. Let it go somewhere.

*ssjup81* · 06-20-2014, 06:21 PM

Raphtastic: What you wrote there is what I've been trying to say...you just worded it better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jth

^^^

True, the "Donnie knew April was at the park is creepy" thing confuses me to no end.

Do people just forget the Mutagen Man episode? Of course he knew she is always at the park at that time.

http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb2..._April_pic.jpg

He's clearly been with her there before, along with who knows how many more times. He knew from experience, not from stalking.

I mentioned this. He also said, "She's usually in the park studying around this time" or something like that. He has that photo if them together. He also mentioned he could offer to help her with homework/studying. It's not really too surprising he would know that.

Midnight Mutant · 06-20-2014, 07:42 PM

I don't understand why people find it creepy. He acts like any socially awkward 15 year old nerd boy with his first crush. I feel like people forget that kids have extreme emotions and respond to it much different than adults.

Because a lot of people who find it creepy are older and past that kind of reaction. They think it's weird or creepy, but it's not. I mean, does anyone remember having a crush when they were young and writing 'I love ___' or '____ plus ____ equals <33' all over their binder, diaries, journals or even carved in trees? And getting butterflies when said person talked to you or called you and it was like the most epic thing ever?
Just because it's not how you respond to it now, doesn't mean it's creepy when you did. Or creepy when kids do it now. It's perfectly natural.

Most young boys aren't as expressive about it as often because they don't want to get teased by their peers, so maybe because Donnie is, it seems awkward. I bet you a billion dollars if the roles were switched and April had a crush on Donnie and acted the same way, no one would bat an eye.

And that's with someone who HAS social skills. (I.E. interacting with more relatives/friends/classmates/teachers) Donnie has NONE aside from his brothers and Splinter.

His obsessiveness isn't even over April, it's over EVERYTHING! He's a scientist and a creator. He spends hours in his lab or training. You have to basically be borderline obsessive to lock yourself away to tinker with things for hours. Just like you have to be as a writer or a cosplayer. You can see how his mind works, calculating and analyzing and over thinking constantly, then throw in hormones, and a girl he likes while being thrown in the middle of saving the city/world!

He's acting exactly the way he should given the circumstances.

You want creepy crushes, look at Edward from Twilight. At least Donnie isn't slipping into Aprils room to watch her sleep. : /

And I'm not even an Apritello shipper.

*Donatello19* · 06-20-2014, 07:47 PM

I think most of the moments with Don and April are hilarious, so yeah, I guess you could say I like how he acts. He's awkward and clumsy around the girl he likes...all teenage guys do that, I know I did. As for the whole "stalking" thing you guys speak of...I think you're looking into it way too far. You make it like he watches her sleep or something, geez. I either want April to be single or end up with Don...because if she ends up with Casey they'll probably make Don depressed and jealous for several episodes, if not the entire season in which it happens. I can't see him being able to get over it too quickly...

*Netkeeper* · 06-20-2014, 07:49 PM

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