Official Episode Discussion S2 #22 "Vengeance is Mine"

[JTH]

Originally Posted by Joshdonnie

EDIT: Splinter might have friends from when he was human.

Boy, that would turn this show into some Sitcom Crash TV Comedy there.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by jth

Boy, that would turn this show into some Sitcom Crash TV Comedy there.

I wish they would've explained why Yoshi came to New York. It's not like he was fleeing like in the other incarnations, and I'm under the impression he wasn't hanging around the sewers either prior to his mutation.

Originally Posted by Ninjinister

Kurtzman's still around. Murakami too but he's always getting his place trashed.

I still feel iffy about Kurtzman...like there's something he's hiding.

[CyberCubed]

I'm surprised Coola Yagami didn't complain they brought back Chrome Dome again as Bradford's armor.

Didn't the Kraang create Chrome Dome in this show? I wonder how Shredder got it.

[fridaynightdestination]

I loved the look on Leo's face when Karai got all up close and personal with him before knocking him out

[Electric]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I'm surprised Coola Yagami didn't complain they brought back Chrome Dome again as Bradford's armor.

Didn't the Kraang create Chrome Dome in this show? I wonder how Shredder got it.

im surprised you didnt complain that karai didnt turn into a character from the 80s toon


speaking of chrome dome, kinda cool they brought him back, even if just for a few seconds for karai to stab him

[CyberCubed]

I don't like the idea of Karai being a mutant, but seeing her change back into human form at the end of the episode makes me think this has potential.

At least it won't be a repeat of Kirby-bat, which looking back...was a pretty dumb idea and went nowhere.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

I wish they would've explained why Yoshi came to New York. It's not like he was fleeing like in the other incarnations, and I'm under the impression he wasn't hanging around the sewers either prior to his mutation.I still feel iffy about Kurtzman...like there's something he's hiding.

Due to how hesitant he sounded when Kurai asked him "If he ever wanted vengeance" I think he did want vengeance at one point, to make Oroku Saki pay for destroying his clan and family. But for the time being he needed to go away from Japan because as long as he stayed in his home country he would be hunted. But after suddenly and fortuitously becoming a father again he realizes that he would gain nothing by seeking vengeance because it would only bring more sorrow. Where as his sons gave him a something to live for, protect, and cherish.

But he also knew that there will come a day his son's would have to face the Shredder, but he wanted that to be when they were older and much more experienced.

[Tora]

So I wonder if new Karai is based on Scale Tail?

[CyberCubed]

No, she looked nothing like Scale Tail. It's like saying Dr. Cobrato in the original cartoon was Scale Tail just because he was also a mutant snake.

Or like saying Tiger Claw and Old Hob are the same because they're both cats with eye patches.

[T-U-R-T-L-E POWA!]

Dang man that was a crazy episode! So can Karai basically shapeshift between forms or something?

[ssjup81]

I bet that the next episode will have either Leo or Splinter having a nightmare over the incident with Karai.

Originally Posted by T-U-R-T-L-E POWA!

Dang man that was a crazy episode! So can Karai basically shapeshift between forms or something?

Yeah,

Spoiler:

she was being held over a vat of mutagen. She was being used as bait for Splinter and the turtles. Something spilled in due to Baxter's clumsiness. After that, Shredder cut the chain accidentally causing her to fall in. She mutated into a snake mutant, but can shapeshift back to her human form...minus the eyes and the fangs.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by victory_angel

Another option would be Donnie and Leo getting the into the argument. Because if they seem to be playing up Leo's relationship with Karai as a juxtaposition of Donnie's relationship with April.

For example: The other Turtles for the most part are supportive of Donnie's feelings for April, but otherwise feel he is deluding himself into believing in something that will never happen

With Karai, none of the Turtles are supportive of Leo's companionship with her, and feel that nothing good would come from it.

April is an outsider, but the Turtles and Splinter have welcomed her into their home and have treated her like she is part of the family.

Karai on the other hand is their adoptive sister and by technicality biological sister. And the Turtles are all hesitant about welcoming her into their lair even after learning she is Splinter's daughter.

In Alien agenda, when Donnie learns about Karai's existence he says "I don't know who she is, but I KNOW I HATE HER!!" and for someone like Donnie to use a word like "Hate" towards someone is not a idle thing.

He was the only one of the Turtles who was visibly angry with Leo about not informing them about Karai. Raph was disappointed and Mikey was more confused as to what transpired. And his statement of "I'm surprised you didn't trust us enough to tell us. Could be interpreted as "I'm surprised you didn't trust *me* enough to tell me about this."

In Enemy of My Enemy Donnie is the one who leads Raph and Mikey away after Karai jumps into the water to save the Shredder. And he's later shown attempting to comfort Leo about the whole ordeal.

Donnie clearly has no trust for Karai and with good reason as Karai has hurt and tried to kill the girl he loves at least twice. However he does trust Leo enough to try and see things from Leo's point of view, or at least tries to believe that maybe Leo could be right about her. And because of that it is going against his better judgement regarding her.

he knows Karai is Splinter's missing daughter, and he knows she should be with her true family. But unlike April and her father, it's questionable as to whether Karai is trust worthy enough to reunite with her true father because she has been raised to think of Splinter has the man who murdered her family.

And now she is a creature that hunts and kills creatures like Splinter. While she was able to keep her mind enough to recognize Splinter as her father. She is other wise an unpredictable monster and her loss has hurt Splinter and their family greatly.

So even though he is able to create retromutagen, he knows a lot more **** will go down before he can create it. So he would have a hard time agreeing with Leo's actions based on faith alone and that would lead to contention between the two calmer brothers.

I don't find it too likely, but it would be nice. I really would like these two to have some legit conflict.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

I don't find it too likely, but it would be nice. I really would like these two to have some legit conflict.

Who knows, we've had two supposed SaiNW references with Mikey getting his arm slashed...(I know Mikey loses his arm, but dismemberment might be a bit much) and venom being spit into Raph's eye which could cause him to go blind in that eye be it permanently or temporarily.

Now all we need is Leo to go blind, and Donnie to disappear. A conflict between these two would be a good lead in to a Same as it Never Was plot or a Good Gene's plot, due to the conflict leaving the other feeling some regret after wards such as Raph's "It's all my fault" after Leo's abduction. Or the cliche making up and then **** happens to one of the people involved in the issue. Such as Karai realizing which side she should be on, and then being abducted.

[Toadtrooper]

Originally Posted by Mega Man

A new version of the City at War story arc is set up for season 3, this time with Shredder's Foot Clan battling Karai's Foot Clan.

That's probably still going to happen. I wouldn't be surprised if Miwa has a hypnotic power and can lure lesser-minded mutants to side with her. Maybe starts with Baxter and somehow acquires Bebop and Rocksteady.

I don't think they'll make her an outright villain. She probably will believe with her new powers she's superior to both Splinter and Shredder, both of whom are bound by tradition. She's more progressive. Her style and appearance hinted at it and now she can take it to a new level.

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I'm surprised Coola Yagami didn't complain they brought back Chrome Dome again as Bradford's armor.

Didn't the Kraang create Chrome Dome in this show? I wonder how Shredder got it.

It was such a short and pathetic little scene for it, I really didn't give a damn. Maybe later they'll see he needs to be upgraded and looks more... Chrome Dome-ish.

[Electric]

Don't know if it's been discussed, but in Karai and shredders fight scene, I think the best moment was when she threw shuriken at him. When he caught one, he saw it wasn't her usual ones, and had the hamato symbol on it, and it seemed to really upset him, since he knew she was officially on the other side.

In fact, shredder caring for her was probably the best part of the episode. Having both him and splinter call out for her when she mutated, promising revenge for her, still referring to her as daughter. It made everything so much more dramatic and I think is why this episode had such an impact on viewers.

[ShredderX633]

Whatever happens next, I hope with all my faith Karai will be restored to normal. Nick went way too far into mutating her into a freak. How can they do this to Karai like that?! They better save her soon it's such a shame that she had to turn into a friggen snake of all things.

[Sighphi]

Originally Posted by ShredderX633

Whatever happens next, I hope with all my faith Karai will be restored to normal. Nick went way too far into mutating her into a freak. How can they do this to Karai like that?! They better save her soon it's such a shame that she had to turn into a friggen snake of all things.

Dude, she is the best kind of mutant. A mutant that can turn back to human form. Now she has the power to take down Jango Katt. The whole episode showed how ineffective she was against him and now she will actually get payback because she is able to.

[Netkeeper]

Like I said: were-snake.

[NitpickingMask]

Originally Posted by ShredderX633

Whatever happens next, I hope with all my faith Karai will be restored to normal. Nick went way too far into mutating her into a freak. How can they do this to Karai like that?! They better save her soon it's such a shame that she had to turn into a friggen snake of all things.

Dude, snake mutants are the best kind!