Paul Rudd to play Ant-Man

[chrisdude]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

True, but you can sort of understand it when people frustrated with their mediocrity constantly get told "Marvel can do no wrong, they are killing it, number one company ever, DC sucks, rofl". It's obnoxious and nauseating. Objectively, DC are so much better in many respects, and Marvel are probably in their worst shape creatively in years in comics and animation, and their creative minds don't give a f*ck because they'd rather insult their customers and fans online than do anything about it.

Even when fans call Marvel movies mediocre, those movies are still pleasing most people. Yeah, the stories are generic, but the movies are unapologetically comic-booky, and I think they're admired for that. The Dark Knight trilogy was hugely successful, without played-out plots, or pandering to kids, but they stripped out a lot of unrealistic and fantastical elements that make Batman fun. And Man of Steel did a great job at putting Superman in the real world, and I like the movie a lot, but it was utterly joyless, and no fun at all. I think DC's strategy has been, "Let's give 'em comic book movies that don't look like comics, so people who don't like comics will watch." Marvel has been successful without doing that. So, I can can kinda see how people can look at Marvel and say, "These guys are doing it right."

Heck, I knew two people at work who were watching Arrow, not knowing it was based on a comic. I haven't watched Arrow, but that must be some seriously grounded stuff.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

Heck, I knew two people at work who were watching Arrow, not knowing it was based on a comic. I haven't watched Arrow, but that must be some seriously grounded stuff.

I think the likes of Arrow and Flash are the most comic booky things DC have done live-action wise. Arrow is a bit gritty, but it has loads of more fantastical elements in it. Flash in particular is a load of fun and fully embraces it's superhero elements, and the new Supergirl from CBS show looks set to be pure cheese-on-toast

[Jester]

yeah, I prefer Flash to Arrow, because it has a sense of humor about itself. I agree Supergirl is probably gonna take that to 11.

[ZariusTwo]

Totally. Flash is embracing the more bizzare ideas, even going as far as putting a talking gorilla on live tv and earning praise and an award nomination for it.

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

Marvel's movies and shows are completely connected, sacrificing individual story-telling and creative stakes to always build to the next movie, only to skip on actual stakes/consequences again and kick the can down the road to the next big crossover.

This is a fair assessment. Marvel unfortunately are just extended commercials for each succession in the line, that to me does not entail a good time because there are some properties I'm not interested in seeing nor do I wish to force myself into seeing them.

[JakeSully]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

Even when fans call Marvel movies mediocre, those movies are still pleasing most people. Yeah, the stories are generic, but the movies are unapologetically comic-booky, and I think they're admired for that. The Dark Knight trilogy was hugely successful, without played-out plots, or pandering to kids, but they stripped out a lot of unrealistic and fantastical elements that make Batman fun. And Man of Steel did a great job at putting Superman in the real world, and I like the movie a lot, but it was utterly joyless, and no fun at all. I think DC's strategy has been, "Let's give 'em comic book movies that don't look like comics, so people who don't like comics will watch." Marvel has been successful without doing that. So, I can can kinda see how people can look at Marvel and say, "These guys are doing it right."

Heck, I knew two people at work who were watching Arrow, not knowing it was based on a comic. I haven't watched Arrow, but that must be some seriously grounded stuff.

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

The biggest problems for me with DC movies and Marvel movies can be summed up in one sentence each.

DC's movies and shows are completely unconnected, which requires multiple unnecessary reinventions at the cost of building on some of their best product. (Examples, Ezra Miller Flash versus Grant Gustin Flash, Christopher Nolan Batman versus Zach Synder Batman)

Marvel's movies and shows are completely connected, sacrificing individual story-telling and creative stakes to always build to the next movie, only to skip on actual stakes/consequences again and kick the can down the road to the next big crossover.

Originally Posted by chrisdude

X-Men over everything.

Most of the Marvel Studios movies are pretty generic. Darned near all of them are cookie-cutter as can be. Doesn't mean you can't love them. But it's harder to win people over when they don't have as much as an attachment to the character, like in Ant-Man's case.

And what makes Fox's X-Men movies different? tell me?

[Jester]

X-men is probably the best melding of realism and the comic-booky stuff.

[ToTheNines]

Really? I think they're all awful. Save for First Class and parts of The Wolverine.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Originally Posted by JakeSully

And what makes Fox's X-Men movies different? tell me?

My assessment of Fox's X-Men is half-assed.

That is to say, about half of the material and characters are great (Origins' Sabretooth, Wolverine, both versions of Magneto, both versions of Xavier, both versions of Beast, Traske, etc) and some of the movies are awesome (X-Men First Class, X2).

But the other half is so poorly done (Storm, Jean Grey, Rogue, Cyclops) and the movies are either terribly written (The Wolverine's third act) or don't even bother to adhere to source material for plot and character (X3, Origins).

[chrisdude]

Originally Posted by JakeSully

And what makes Fox's X-Men movies different? tell me?

Better stories. More compelling hero-villain dynamics.

EDIT:
I was pressured by my friends to participate in a boardgame while I was trying to post. My point was that most Marvel Studios movies are about some bad guy who wants to abuse weapons and technology to get rich and powerful. The X-Men films are about mutantkind's civil rights struggle. They center around some obstacle to peace, and Xavier and Magneto's conflicting philosophies about how to handle it. It's rarely is cut and dry as good versus evil. I think that makes for, if not better, at least different stories.

[TurtleTitan97]

Just got back from seeing it. It was great, my favorite scene was probably Ant-Man vs. Falcon. That was fun.