Could/Should Timothy(Pulverizer) and Mutagen Man be considered the same person?

[Papenbrook]

I have been thinking about this for a while now. They both look radically different from each other. Leo even says that Timothy is "gone" now. I wonder if there will be an arc about this.

Discuss below.

[IndigoErth]

Hmm... no mutant is who they used to be, some more removed than others, though it doesn't take away their past as the person they once were. Timothy may be an extreme case though and pretty far removed from his original self.

Although... taking retromutagen into account... April's dad became some kind of bat monster, but his normal self was still in there and able to be returned to normal. Assuming Timothy could be returned to normal should they ever get around to trying to use it on him (I know he was annoying, guys, but come on, it's only right)...if it works, then some part of his normal self is still there.

[Ninjinister]

What makes a person a person? Is it their own self identification? If one has amnesia and starts a new life, are they now an entirely different person, or just on a superficial level? Does the body factor into it at all? Can anybody actually BECOME a different person, or are we still the same miserable little piles of secrets from cradle to grave?

[victory_angel]

this is a somewhat of a question with no real answer. Timothy and Mutagen man are one in the same. However when Leo was telling Donnie that Timothy was gone, he was saying the Person who Timothy had been was no longer there.

[Metalwolf]

I think a mutant is still the same person as they were as a human, or you wouldn't see a lot of them object to the monster names that Mikey tries to give them. They still see themselves as people, although a lot of times trapped in a body that became monstrous from mutagen. It doesn't stop them from adopting a mutant 'identity,' but ultimately they aren't animals despite looking like them. (I always found it telling that April in that return to New York episode was saying to crazy!Splinter "You ARE NOT a rat. You are Hamato Yoshi." And reason why is because if he was no longer a human being and himself (I'm not necessarily saying human) she'd be calling him Splinter instead.)

So as such, a lot of Timothy is still there, but it's buried under his IQ dropping and being heavily subject to extreme emotion. He can still understand speech, he can still process concepts, but his ability to reason sanely and logically is heavily compromised.

[CyberCubed]

Just.

[Ninjinister]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Just.

And so once again, you have nothing to bring to the conversation.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by Ninjinister

And so once again, you have nothing to bring to the conversation.

This is coming from a guy who is asking for Batman to show up in the Nick cartoon in the other thread.

[Ninturtle]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

This is coming from a guy who is asking for Batman to show up in the Nick cartoon in the other thread.

That's completely different , he was stating what he hoped would happen at NYCC and added to the conversation (which is a possibility because Bat Man is in the IDW comics). You just typed a stupid comment that added nothing to the conversation. I'm not a fan of this thread either but I just ignored it as opposed to insulting it.

[myconius]

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

I have been thinking about this for a while now. They both look radically different from each other. Leo even says that Timothy is "gone" now. I wonder if there will be an arc about this.

Discuss below.

i don't think we'll ever see Timothy again?

his character pretty much ran his course in the 2 episodes he was in before becoming the Mutagen Man.

now ... will we ever see another episode with the Mutagen Man again???
that i am curious about!

[Rukitron]

This bugged the hell out of me, Donnie could have fixed him when he had retromutagen for everyone else, now he's just stuck in the lab because I guess if they un-mutated him, he'd probably do more stupid things?

[IndigoErth]

Turtles secretly just don't want that annoyance back.

As if it isn't bad enough that Donnie hasn't kept his promise to try to change him back, I find it just as odd that nothing in the show, even just something in the background, has ever eluded to his family or anyone else reporting him missing and looking for him. If anyone should be on the random milk carton seen on occasion it's him; either edit that object or put him on a MISSING poster in the background of a shot. Unless the guy is really that annoying that no one is looking for him, how sad.

[Nasubionna]

Well, Muckman did mention The Pulverizer... so obviously at least HE knew about Timothy's vigilante exploits before he became Mutagen Man. I was really pleased with that little shout-out so late after Timothy/Mutagen Man's episodes, because I am one of those who REALLY wants his character to be revisited (and I want to see Donatello make good on his promise to demutate Timothy - to the best of his ability, at least).
As to the question of if Timothy/Pulverizer and Mutagen Man should be considered one and the same person? I don't know, that is too deep of a question for me to tackle this late at night.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by Rukitron

This bugged the hell out of me, Donnie could have fixed him when he had retromutagen for everyone else, now he's just stuck in the lab because I guess if they un-mutated him, he'd probably do more stupid things?

Donnie did have an opportunity and that was in Lonely Mutation of Baxter Stockman. The way I see things is since the Turtles particularly Donnie has seen Splinter mourn the loss of his humanity through out their lives. He likely got it into his head as a child that if he ever found a way to reverse Mutations, Splinter would be first dibs. While Timothy was mutated before Kirby, Kirby was a far more urgent case at that time.

So if things had gone according to plan and Splinter was given the second vile only refuse it, Timothy would have gotten it by default.

After that incident, there was the whole issue with Karai being mutated, the Kraang Invasion that forced the Turtles flee the city, and so on. And then the whole goings on with the Shredder and the mind control serum and the Triceraton invasion. It's put Timothy perpetually on the back burner with a "We'll help him later, this situation has more priority." mindset.

Also Timothy is dangerous as mutagen man and It's likely he may need to be thawed out before they could get started in curing him. And that would be dangerous as he likely would not have forgotten that Donnie's betrayal.

So there would need to be a way to keep him contained so he could be cured.

[Shark_Blade]

Timothy is definitely dead to me. Obnoxious waste of space.

[IndigoErth]

Originally Posted by Nasubionna

Well, Muckman did mention The Pulverizer... so obviously at least HE knew about Timothy's vigilante exploits before he became Mutagen Man.

True, I had forgotten about that.

You know, now I kind of want Muckman to turn out to be Pulverizer's uncle or, at the very least, his longtime next door neighbor.