David Ayer and Margot Robbie helming all female villian DC movie - Page 22

~~Leo656~~ · 02-09-2020, 08:38 AM

I like Hal just fine, I just know some people insist on making it a contest and Kyle was "my" Green Lantern during the 90s. I loved feeling like I was getting in on the ground floor of something. And those first few years were great.

Guy Gardner's the One True Green Lantern any damn ways. Everybody knows that. Even people who don't know it, know it once it smashes them upside the head with a giant boxing glove with his name on it. Then they never forget it.

Although Sinestro Ring Variant Guy Gardner is my favorite. He was more powerful with the Yellow Ring, after all. And he fought the ghost of Sinestro to get it. And he was answerable to no-one, and he even saved Superman and the JLA from Eclipso that one time... not that anyone really bothered to thank him for it.

He's secretly been the glue holding the DCU together for ages. Not that he gets any credit for it. But he's The Man.

*MikeandRaph87* · 02-09-2020, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo656

I like Hal just fine, I just know some people insist on making it a contest and Kyle was "my" Green Lantern during the 90s. I loved feeling like I was getting in on the ground floor of something. And those first few years were great.

Guy Gardner's the One True Green Lantern any damn ways. Everybody knows that. Even people who don't know it, know it once it smashes them upside the head with a giant boxing glove with his name on it. Then they never forget it.

Although Sinestro Ring Variant Guy Gardner is my favorite. He was more powerful with the Yellow Ring, after all. And he fought the ghost of Sinestro to get it. And he was answerable to no-one, and he even saved Superman and the JLA from Eclipso that one time... not that anyone really bothered to thank him for it.

He's secretly been the glue holding the DCU together for ages. Not that he gets any credit for it. But he's The Man.

After all the valid reasons for why Wonder Woman is done right despite obivious built in reservations, but will go see it over "Birds of Prey" and appreciate Gadot all you get is Guy Gardner is the best of the Four Corpsmen.

I like Hal Jordan the best and like John Stewart in a supporting role. You can have your two.

Let me know about the Mr. Zsasz stories.

Gadot and Mamoa are the best parts of the DCEU.

~~Leo656~~ · 02-09-2020, 09:18 AM

Hah. Well, that's certainly an opinion.

I'm afraid I probably wouldn't be able to give the Zsasz stories the proper attention right now, but feel free to check back about it.

*MikeandRaph87* · 02-09-2020, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo656

Hah. Well, that's certainly an opinion.

I'm afraid I probably wouldn't be able to give the Zsasz stories the proper attention right now, but feel free to check back about it.

4 issues, about 90 minutes of reading for proper attention. All are good if you want to see the character done well in comics.

That is what it is, an opinion nothing more. I would like to see him interact with Wally in a cross generations story, buddy story with John Stewart, and finally settle down with Carol. Don't think I will get the Wally request, likely get the John Stewart request, only teases of the committing to Carol request. Hal is outsmarting alien threats and John is getting proper focus in Justice League.

All this makes me want to read an Aquaman and Wonder Woman team up.

*MikeandRaph87* · 02-09-2020, 04:07 PM

I also have to add that I like how we are talking on several points and little about the film itself. It shows how important this is to fans of the DC Comics. The conversation is better than the movie.

It finished a 3 + day opening with just under 33 million.
https://deadline.com/2020/02/birds-o...ie-1202853768/

*Andrew NDB* · 02-09-2020, 04:59 PM

There's nothing to talk about with the movie. The whole movie: "mumble mumble, we need emancipation, mumble mumble, girl power, mumble mumble, action stuff."

~~Leo656~~ · 02-09-2020, 05:21 PM

I frankly don't care one bit about things staying on topic as long as the conversation is good. To me, that's more important. And the last chunk of stuff has been very stimulating.

*MikeandRaph87* · 02-09-2020, 05:41 PM

So on a character related topic:
Black Mask should have been sparred because of his animosity with Catwoman. He is the one and only person she ever killed in the comics. In other media she killed Bane In The Dark Knight Rises climax. I would have liked to have seen dialogue between her and Batman about that and comparing it to Bruce's allowing Ra's to die.

Also, Jeremiah Arkham took over Roman's identity and his criminal holdings after Catwoman shot Roman to death. It was never explained how that happened and Roman was brought back to life with the New 52 reboot.

There are a couple of sicker Bat Villains that are C-listers like Cornelius Strik or Professor Pyg if they are going for disgusting individuals who don't have much to them or like TMNT films, just make up new ones for the film, Lord Noriga and Walker and anti-villain Max Winter. Both Black Mask and Mr. Zsasz are not silly and are layered and dangerous while the above examples are just sick.

*MikeandRaph87* · 02-09-2020, 05:49 PM

In campy day, in darkest knight, let those who worship agendas, beware their power, Fanboys might!

~~Leo656~~ · 02-09-2020, 06:06 PM

Regarding Zsasz, as I've said many times, someone could shoot "The Last Arkham" story without any changes whatsoever and it would make a billion dollars because it's that goddamn strong.

Zsasz was absolutely chilling in that. That's one of my all-time favorite Batman stories for sure. Just an absolutely brilliant piece of work. You've got mystery, suspense, horror, action, and pretty much the entire Rogues gallery (even if most of them only show up to get beaten down in that one scene where Arkham sics them all on Batman). It's got everything. It would be an incredible movie.

The only problem I see is that it would be almost impossible to top. But that doesn't mean they shouldn't do it.

~~Sumac~~ · 02-09-2020, 07:00 PM

How much time left until Harley or director of this movie will say something to the effect of: "this movie failed because of evil white men!!"

*Andrew NDB* · 02-09-2020, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sumac

How much time left until Harley or director of this movie will say something to the effect of: "this movie failed because of evil white men!!"

Probably tomorrow.

*CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy* · 02-09-2020, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Probably tomorrow.

You mean Margot and Cathy haven't said it already? Tomorrow for sure.

Evil white men, my @ss. Make an accurate Birds of Prey movie with a more accurate Cassandra Cain, and I'll plunk down cash for multiple viewings. It IS possible to make female-driven movies without a bunch of slutty costumes AND still be comic accurate.

But no, go ahead and make a $hitty movie instead.

~~TommyT~~ · 02-09-2020, 09:51 PM

The woke women are on full court defence tonight. They even trotted out their bitch ass males to spew vitrol at anyone who dared to dislike this propaganda.

*Andrew NDB* · 02-09-2020, 11:19 PM

lol... look at this. It turns out that 53% of audiences seeing the movie are actually male.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...pening-1277792

The big girl power movie, and women it was "for" (that's what they told us) didn't even show up.

~~TommyT~~ · 02-09-2020, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

lol... look at this. It turns out that 53% of audiences seeing the movie are actually male.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...pening-1277792

The big girl power movie, and women it was "for" (that's what they told us) didn't even show up.

"Women don't like other women"... news at 11.

The apology tour is absurd right now. So many comic fans afraid to be honest.

~~Sumac~~ · 02-09-2020, 11:28 PM

The answer is obvious: internalized misogyny, i.e. women are so brainwashed by evil white males, that they believe that movies depicting "grrrrrrrrl power" sucks.

Another explanation, that most women find this movie dumb and not so much empowering as just ridiculous pastiche about everything related to feminism.

Of course, modern Twitter feminists and their male allies, can't even fathom the idea that women might not be grateful for so daring and empowering and amazing godsend piece of female empowering manifesto. Almost like immature parents who couldn't believe that their kids might find their patronage and guidance, to be infantilizing coddling.

**********
On a serious note: the main problem of all of those female empowering movies is that they can not live without making most of the males look ridiculous, useless or stupid and most female characters one note "grrrrl power" types.

Interesting thing, that I don't remember a lot of the movies (if any) staring male heroes, from the 80-s to 90-s to present, which would done the same to the female characters. Most of the big blockbusters has at least one or two women in supporting roles who play crucial roles in supporting main character, looking cool and competent while doing it, and it doesn't require them to scream every 5 minutes about "evil manliness" and "toxic masculinity" or "grrrrrrl power".

It is almost like movies, which prioritize making good characters over "right message", manage to do both: tell a good story and send a good message. Not to mention hit movies with amazing female leads, like Aliens or Terminators.

*Andrew NDB* · 02-09-2020, 11:31 PM

I'm just peeved that of all the directions they could have gone with this movie ("Gotham City Sirens," "Harley & Joker," a PROPER "Birds of Prey" or even just a standalone "Harley Quinn" movie that didn't drag any other characters into the mud with her) they chose the least interesting and most damaging of all.

~~TommyT~~ · 02-09-2020, 11:36 PM

Or maybe most women who have their lives together, out grew the need to see Harley Quinn, and are more interested in normal ****.

Sure, there are a handful of women who like comics, but it's not the majority, and never will be. Its not about keeping them out, or even gatekeeping; its that most adults read BOOKS when they read, not comics. Comics are a dying market, as we all know.

Like, is anyone watching that Kaley Cucoo disaster toon about Harley Quinn?

~~Leo656~~ · 02-09-2020, 11:49 PM

Yeah, General Statements Are General, and don't apply to every single individual, but MOST women don't read comics OR like action movies. Thus, MOST women wouldn't give a sh*t about this to begin with.

Anecdotal, but most of my close friends are married, most of them DO like comics or action movies, but their wives don't. Their wives like Mama Mia and 13 Reasons Why and stuff. Or they watch stuff like Spartacus so they can see guys' dicks without being "trashy" enough to watch actual porn, but that's about it.

So again, anecdotal, BUT, if it happens a lot in one's own "bubble", it's not hard to see how the trend would increase exponentially when attaching a multiplier.

Women, statistically, have very specific tastes in TV, movies, reading material, and music. And that's okay. Or at least, it USED to be. People used to intrinsically accept that Men and Women were different, that they were wired differently and liked different things. And it was also accepted that some people were outliers, that a lot of boys were more "effeminate" even if they weren't gay, and a lot of girls were tomboys without being lesbians.

Now everyone is trying to make Everything "for everyone" and it simply doesn't work that way. There are things that appeal more to men and things that appeal more to women. It's not "social programming" as some would claim, it's just how people are. And that should be allowed.

02-09-2020, 04:07 PM	#425
MikeandRaph87 Jedi Master Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: JLA Satellite Headquarters Posts: 11,189	I also have to add that I like how we are talking on several points and little about the film itself. It shows how important this is to fans of the DC Comics. The conversation is better than the movie. It finished a 3 + day opening with just under 33 million. https://deadline.com/2020/02/birds-o...ie-1202853768/ __________________ Michelangelo: This looks like a job for the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles! Raphael: Sheesh, Mikey this ain't a cartoon!

02-09-2020, 04:59 PM	#426
Andrew NDB Weed Whacker Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Auburn, WA Posts: 34,573	There's nothing to talk about with the movie. The whole movie: "mumble mumble, we need emancipation, mumble mumble, girl power, mumble mumble, action stuff." __________________ [ ODYSSEY \| ORIGIN \| THE IMAGE/VOL. 3 CONCLUSION \| THE SHELLSHOCKED PODCAST \| ON FACEBOOK ]

02-09-2020, 05:41 PM	#428
MikeandRaph87 Jedi Master Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: JLA Satellite Headquarters Posts: 11,189	So on a character related topic: Black Mask should have been sparred because of his animosity with Catwoman. He is the one and only person she ever killed in the comics. In other media she killed Bane In The Dark Knight Rises climax. I would have liked to have seen dialogue between her and Batman about that and comparing it to Bruce's allowing Ra's to die. Also, Jeremiah Arkham took over Roman's identity and his criminal holdings after Catwoman shot Roman to death. It was never explained how that happened and Roman was brought back to life with the New 52 reboot. There are a couple of sicker Bat Villains that are C-listers like Cornelius Strik or Professor Pyg if they are going for disgusting individuals who don't have much to them or like TMNT films, just make up new ones for the film, Lord Noriga and Walker and anti-villain Max Winter. Both Black Mask and Mr. Zsasz are not silly and are layered and dangerous while the above examples are just sick. __________________ Michelangelo: This looks like a job for the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles! Raphael: Sheesh, Mikey this ain't a cartoon!

02-09-2020, 05:49 PM	#429
MikeandRaph87 Jedi Master Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: JLA Satellite Headquarters Posts: 11,189	In campy day, in darkest knight, let those who worship agendas, beware their power, Fanboys might! __________________ Michelangelo: This looks like a job for the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles! Raphael: Sheesh, Mikey this ain't a cartoon!

02-09-2020, 11:19 PM	#435
Andrew NDB Weed Whacker Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Auburn, WA Posts: 34,573	lol... look at this. It turns out that 53% of audiences seeing the movie are actually male. https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...pening-1277792 The big girl power movie, and women it was "for" (that's what they told us) didn't even show up. __________________ [ ODYSSEY \| ORIGIN \| THE IMAGE/VOL. 3 CONCLUSION \| THE SHELLSHOCKED PODCAST \| ON FACEBOOK ]

02-09-2020, 08:38 AM	#421
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	I like Hal just fine, I just know some people insist on making it a contest and Kyle was "my" Green Lantern during the 90s. I loved feeling like I was getting in on the ground floor of something. And those first few years were great. Guy Gardner's the One True Green Lantern any damn ways. Everybody knows that. Even people who don't know it, know it once it smashes them upside the head with a giant boxing glove with his name on it. Then they never forget it. Although Sinestro Ring Variant Guy Gardner is my favorite. He was more powerful with the Yellow Ring, after all. And he fought the ghost of Sinestro to get it. And he was answerable to no-one, and he even saved Superman and the JLA from Eclipso that one time... not that anyone really bothered to thank him for it. He's secretly been the glue holding the DCU together for ages. Not that he gets any credit for it. But he's The Man.

02-09-2020, 09:18 AM	#423
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	Hah. Well, that's certainly an opinion. I'm afraid I probably wouldn't be able to give the Zsasz stories the proper attention right now, but feel free to check back about it.

02-09-2020, 05:21 PM	#427
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	I frankly don't care one bit about things staying on topic as long as the conversation is good. To me, that's more important. And the last chunk of stuff has been very stimulating.

02-09-2020, 06:06 PM	#430
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	Regarding Zsasz, as I've said many times, someone could shoot "The Last Arkham" story without any changes whatsoever and it would make a billion dollars because it's that goddamn strong. Zsasz was absolutely chilling in that. That's one of my all-time favorite Batman stories for sure. Just an absolutely brilliant piece of work. You've got mystery, suspense, horror, action, and pretty much the entire Rogues gallery (even if most of them only show up to get beaten down in that one scene where Arkham sics them all on Batman). It's got everything. It would be an incredible movie. The only problem I see is that it would be almost impossible to top. But that doesn't mean they shouldn't do it.

02-09-2020, 07:00 PM	#431
~~Sumac~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 6,129	How much time left until Harley or director of this movie will say something to the effect of: "this movie failed because of evil white men!!"

02-09-2020, 09:51 PM	#434
~~TommyT~~ Banned Join Date: Jul 2019 Location: Canada Posts: 859	The woke women are on full court defence tonight. They even trotted out their bitch ass males to spew vitrol at anyone who dared to dislike this propaganda.

02-09-2020, 11:28 PM	#437
~~Sumac~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 6,129	The answer is obvious: internalized misogyny, i.e. women are so brainwashed by evil white males, that they believe that movies depicting "grrrrrrrrl power" sucks. Another explanation, that most women find this movie dumb and not so much empowering as just ridiculous pastiche about everything related to feminism. Of course, modern Twitter feminists and their male allies, can't even fathom the idea that women might not be grateful for so daring and empowering and amazing godsend piece of female empowering manifesto. Almost like immature parents who couldn't believe that their kids might find their patronage and guidance, to be infantilizing coddling. ********** On a serious note: the main problem of all of those female empowering movies is that they can not live without making most of the males look ridiculous, useless or stupid and most female characters one note "grrrrl power" types. Interesting thing, that I don't remember a lot of the movies (if any) staring male heroes, from the 80-s to 90-s to present, which would done the same to the female characters. Most of the big blockbusters has at least one or two women in supporting roles who play crucial roles in supporting main character, looking cool and competent while doing it, and it doesn't require them to scream every 5 minutes about "evil manliness" and "toxic masculinity" or "grrrrrrl power". It is almost like movies, which prioritize making good characters over "right message", manage to do both: tell a good story and send a good message. Not to mention hit movies with amazing female leads, like Aliens or Terminators. Last edited by Sumac; 02-09-2020 at 11:38 PM.

02-09-2020, 11:31 PM	#438
Andrew NDB Weed Whacker Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Auburn, WA Posts: 34,573	I'm just peeved that of all the directions they could have gone with this movie ("Gotham City Sirens," "Harley & Joker," a PROPER "Birds of Prey" or even just a standalone "Harley Quinn" movie that didn't drag any other characters into the mud with her) they chose the least interesting and most damaging of all. __________________ [ ODYSSEY \| ORIGIN \| THE IMAGE/VOL. 3 CONCLUSION \| THE SHELLSHOCKED PODCAST \| ON FACEBOOK ]

02-09-2020, 11:36 PM	#439
~~TommyT~~ Banned Join Date: Jul 2019 Location: Canada Posts: 859	Or maybe most women who have their lives together, out grew the need to see Harley Quinn, and are more interested in normal ****. Sure, there are a handful of women who like comics, but it's not the majority, and never will be. Its not about keeping them out, or even gatekeeping; its that most adults read BOOKS when they read, not comics. Comics are a dying market, as we all know. Like, is anyone watching that Kaley Cucoo disaster toon about Harley Quinn?

02-09-2020, 11:49 PM	#440
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	Yeah, General Statements Are General, and don't apply to every single individual, but MOST women don't read comics OR like action movies. Thus, MOST women wouldn't give a sh*t about this to begin with. Anecdotal, but most of my close friends are married, most of them DO like comics or action movies, but their wives don't. Their wives like Mama Mia and 13 Reasons Why and stuff. Or they watch stuff like Spartacus so they can see guys' dicks without being "trashy" enough to watch actual porn, but that's about it. So again, anecdotal, BUT, if it happens a lot in one's own "bubble", it's not hard to see how the trend would increase exponentially when attaching a multiplier. Women, statistically, have very specific tastes in TV, movies, reading material, and music. And that's okay. Or at least, it USED to be. People used to intrinsically accept that Men and Women were different, that they were wired differently and liked different things. And it was also accepted that some people were outliers, that a lot of boys were more "effeminate" even if they weren't gay, and a lot of girls were tomboys without being lesbians. Now everyone is trying to make Everything "for everyone" and it simply doesn't work that way. There are things that appeal more to men and things that appeal more to women. It's not "social programming" as some would claim, it's just how people are. And that should be allowed.