The Umbrella Academy (Netflix TV series)

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Aren't you technically not trans until you undergo an operation to become the opposite gender? I admit I'm no expert on these things, but declaring yourself trans means nothing until you literally have a penis attached to you.

The current think is that -- say if you're a dude -- all you have to do is one day (whether you're 5 years old or 50) wake up and say, "I'm a woman," and that's that. No surgeries needed, no nothing. You should be 100% taken at your word that you were born into the wrong body and if anyone says otherwise they're a bigot and probably a fascist nazi.

[sdp]

So it's retroactive? Imagine you see this person:

You have sex with them, he had a vagina. Years later you find out he is trans and was trans all her life. Did you actually have gay sex?
These are important questions that you can't ask without having your notifications blow up.

[Leo656]

What I find interesting, is that the "You Are What You Say You Are" phenomenon ONLY applies to this one type of situation.

I swear to God I'm not trolling, I'm just saying. If I say "I FEEL like a little kid" they'll still throw me out of the McDonald's Play Place because it doesn't matter what I "identify" as, they don't let guys pushing 40 in the ball pit. And THAT is an entirely separate issue that needs to be addressed at another time.

Or like, I've seen documentary shows about people who "identify" as tigers or birds or whatever, and the material treats them with respect but when people watch and comment on these shows, it's 100% people saying "What a loon."

But I mean, the grown-up in the ball pit most likely isn't hurting anyone. Neither is the guy who gets tattoos all over his body and "whiskers" implanted in his face. They're "living their best life".

So the broad point I'm trying to make is, why exactly are those people "clearly crazy" and openly derided and mocked, but with issues of human sexuality, "You are whatever you say you are?" That literally makes no sense. There's no consistency of standard, here. But it really is the exact same thing if you break it down.

It's just odd. Not only did nobody ever post "The Rules", they seemingly change by the day and it's all very confusing to try and keep up with.

[Jester]

Sad thing is there are people who WILL use the "You are whatever you say you are" to hurt people.
Guys like this come to mind:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...tefonknee.html

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by sdp

So it's retroactive? Imagine you see this person:
https://64.media.tumblr.com/720f3cca...803zo1_250.jpg
You have sex with them, he had a vagina. Years later you find out he is trans and was trans all her life. Did you actually have gay sex?
These are important questions that you can't ask without having your notifications blow up.

So out of curiosity how do they drain away the boobs to give you a flat male chest? Obviously in Ellen Page's case her breasts are small to begin with, but for women with sizeable C and D cup breasts, how do they "drain away the boobies" to give them male chests?

It would be like popping a balloon with a pin.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

So out of curiosity how do they drain away the boobs to give you a flat male chest? Obviously in Ellen Page's case her breasts are small to begin with, but for women with sizeable C and D cup breasts, how do they "drain away the boobies" to give them male chests?

It would be like popping a balloon with a pin.

They don't drain, man, they cut. It's called a mastectomy, like for breast cancer.

Or at least, that'd be my best guess.

[Autbot_Benz]

Fandom
@getFANDOM
Elliot Page will continue playing Vanya Hargreeves on 'The Umbrella Academy' — Netflix is currently updating Page's credits in all of his titles on the streamer

(via
@THR
| http://bit.ly/3qgqnTH)

[frank_one]

She can go by Elliot or Joe if she wants, but I hope she won't touch her body, she doesn't need to. A short hairdo, less makeup and a t-shirt, that's all she needs.

[Sumac]

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

You know, you'd think that would happen. But it sure doesn't seem to actually work that way.

When's the last time a major worldwide religion took a head dive? Christianity (Protestant and Catholic), Judaism, Islam, and Buddhism, to name the ones I'm most familiar with, are all still alive and kicking hundreds to thousands of years later.

Christianity was nerfed and made apologies for years of **** they did. Judaism and Buddhism are not that powerful and basically confined to small groups of people anyway (relative to the population). Islam degenerated into who knows what and is the very big problem.

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Aren't you technically not trans until you undergo an operation to become the opposite gender? I admit I'm no expert on these things, but declaring yourself trans means nothing until you literally have a penis attached to you.

Transcult gonna eat you, if you try to make this clear.
The thing - they don't care and change rules arbitrary depending on what they want at the moment, from "all who says they are woman is a woman" to "women are not a biology, but we have a specific set of requirements, because, we are women".
It's a mess.

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

Sure, maybe. But over how long? Decades or centuries?

Depends what leaders of Islamic countries would want: total war against Europe and US or more civilized societies. It's all about money in the end, bar intervention from other countries.
Considering China I think they might stick by their "values" (in reality to maintain absolute power). But I don't think it'll last for long. Society of rabid zealots can't exist indefinitely - it burns out at some point.

Originally Posted by Leo656

So the broad point I'm trying to make is, why exactly are those people "clearly crazy" and openly derided and mocked, but with issues of human sexuality, "You are whatever you say you are?" That literally makes no sense. There's no consistency of standard, here. But it really is the exact same thing if you break it down.

It's just odd. Not only did nobody ever post "The Rules", they seemingly change by the day and it's all very confusing to try and keep up with.

There are no exact rules, because, if they make "exact" rules, it suddenly would be obvious that half of transcultists are nothing, but deranged pretenders.

Also, what kind of name "Vanya" is? "Vanya" is a cutesy form of a Russian name "Ivan" ("John") used only for men here.

[Andrew NDB]

The "Sparrows" for season 3 are cast:

https://www.darkhorizons.com/umbrell...five-sparrows/

[Andrew NDB]

Elliot Page talks about struggles:

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/el.../1100-6490866/

[Sumac]

Poor thing. It must be hard to live in a world, where everything reminds you that your identity is a fictitious fabrication, created only by EGO and mental illness.

A definition of First World Problems.

Anyway...

[Andrew NDB]

So now we have the answer. Unless there is some multiversal trickery afoot... this may be the first example of a fiction changing itself midway to suit the actor's identity:

https://movieweb.com/umbrella-academ...box=1648606532

[Sumac]

Idiocy.
I can imagine some "gender-liquid-queer folx" using this, just inflate their egos.

[Andrew NDB]

It goes one episode before it becomes the "Vanya becomes Victor" show.

[Jester]

And all it really took was a hair cut and a name change.

[Sumac]

Originally Posted by Jester

And all it really took was a hair cut and a name change.

But she is now a totally changed human!

[mrmaczaps]

Originally Posted by Sumac

But she is now a totally changed human!

Unless someone checks her dna...

[IndigoErth]

Uh...what. So we're just never even going to attempt to address why Reggie is an alien, why he's even on Earth, or why there was a floating sentient cube as #7?? Okay...

And ultimately the whole deal was...because he wanted his wife back. Uhh. But she was clearly ill, so I'm not sure how resetting the universe would not only get her back, but cure her. Or why an alien was in love with her to begin with. (Unless they're both aliens in disguise.)

Wedding... obvious set up for yet another loss, a theme that was wearing thin at that point, imo.

And then of course there is Victor... I get that the actor is trans and maybe Netflix took it as an opportunity for inclusion by changing the character, but given how Vanya is just a fictional character I sort of feel like Page, who by then was used to playing her, could have stuck it out and finished up the series or had the character killed off this season before no longer taking female roles.

Because... my only real complaints with this show since the start (though I'm sure the comic is probably to blame) has been the minimal representation of female characters in the Umbrella Academy -- as well their powers being unabashedly based on female stereotypes (gossip and powers that are, or were initially, ruled by emotions) -- annnnd then frickin' Vanya decides to stop being one, cutting it down to just Allison...who is being handicapped and unpredictable and an in-group "bad guy" by way of emotions due to the devastating fact that her daughter no longer exists and her family really couldn't care less. The Sparrows added more women, but that team sucked as people and most died.

Kind of hoping it might continue, since old man Five would still happen and it's left unknown what even happens for them now. Allison seems to be the only one with an actual life waiting for her with both her kid and husband she left in the past. What the heck is everyone else even going to do, they don't have normal lives to return to or know where they belong. Sloane may well exist somewhere in the world, but good luck to Luther trying to find her and not mess it up and freak her out if he did. Kind of feel like the damn rich guy alien owes them assistance to get on their feet as regular people. After all they gave for his quest just for him to leave them effed up and short changed in life.

All that out of the way though, Klaus is the biggest bright spot, imo. Generally, I wouldn't be taking up some drug user as a favorite, but the evolution of his character has been interesting and fun to watch.

[Andrew NDB]

So yeah. I did finish this up a couple nights ago. After the first maybe 3 or 4 episodes I was pretty well invested in the story. It's a stronger season than the last one for sure, and less preachy about this or that (though they still manage to sneak in some stuff, of course). As the apocalypse was getting closer and closer things did get decidedly creepy. And in the alternate dimension hotel.

Well done, all around.

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

Uh...what. So we're just never even going to attempt to address why Reggie is an alien, why he's even on Earth,

I'm sure that's coming next season, given what season 4 would appear to resemble.

And then of course there is Victor... I get that the actor is trans and maybe Netflix took it as an opportunity for inclusion by changing the character, but given how Vanya is just a fictional character I sort of feel like Page, who by then was used to playing her, could have stuck it out and finished up the series or had the character killed off this season before no longer taking female roles.

I have to wonder what the behind the scenes talk was. Was it her going to the producers and telling them, "Hey, I'm Elliot now and I'm not comfortable playing a woman anymore" or was it the producers going to her preemptively with, "Hi, Elliot! We're super proud of your coming out as trans so we've taken the liberty of re-writing the character in season 3 to be a trans man, like you!"*

If it's the former, f*** her, she's an actress. Playing made up parts. Recast and move on. If it's the latter, f*** them. This is not the way it's supposed to work. If Benedict Cumberbatch reveals he's become a vegan that doesn't mean go and make Dr. Strange into one, too. That's retarded on its face.

*: Also, isn't what they did kind of "problematic" to trans people? As in, lots of mental health issues and wishy washy (I'm a lesbian now! Now I'm a transexual! etc.)?

Kind of hoping it might continue, since old man Five would still happen

He'll have to lose his arm again, if that's the case.

All that out of the way though, Klaus is the biggest bright spot, imo. Generally, I wouldn't be taking up some drug user as a favorite, but the evolution of his character has been interesting and fun to watch.

Yeah, he was oddly amusing to watch this season. Also it's hard not to enjoy watching Lila. That actress really seems to light up and have a lot of fun with the material. The biggest fumble, I think, is how Harlan was handled. I dug the surprise twist of who he is but the stuff about him killing all the moms and then getting killed himself was pretty sudden and random and didn't really have any payoff. When we see him in the trunk it was presented in such a matter-of-fact way that I was assuming that it can't be real. And then it's barely brought up again.

I just noticed the guy who plays Elliott on Breaking Bad is the Pogo actor. Huh.