Is there a "toxicity" in this fandom?

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

I don't know the exact details but it was probably that, and I remember that Steven Universe drama, some SU fans are still very weird, thinking they can call Rebecca Sugar a nazi just for having bad writing and character designs

like yeah bad writing and questionable designs are weird but there's no need to insult a jewish creator like that

Questionable designs... whaaa???

But back to the Turtles, what are the 'hot takes' that are driving people to doxxing and death threats?

[NeonTurtledude]

I'd have to check but I know that they argue about April's depiction a lot, especially in 2012, and some argue about Raphael too

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

I'd have to check but I know that they argue about April's depiction a lot, especially in 2012, and some argue about Raphael too

Which version of Raphael?

I'm out of the loop but I have seen several videos popping up about people hating the Don/April crush, and I mean like HATE, not just mildly annoyed by. I guess I could see them wanting to doxx or send death threats to anyone actually in favor of it.

[NeonTurtledude]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

Which version of Raphael?

I'm out of the loop but I have seen several videos popping up about people hating the Don/April crush, and I mean like HATE, not just mildly annoyed by. I guess I could see them wanting to doxx or send death threats to anyone actually in favor of it.

2012 Raph, thinking he abuses Mikey with his remarks, there's also people who think due to Rise Donatello's apathy that he wouldn't care if his brothers died

as for the Don/April thing, I know a lot don't like the april/turtle or human/turtle pairing ideas regardless of generation or iteration

but I suppose that could be interpreted as a sort of self insert thing (for the viewers to see themselves as the 1987 turtles and see april as the first woman they thought was pretty) (like how in the games when april would kiss the player's turtle of choice as a reward for saving her)

however, there's no need to doxx or threaten someone for their ship opinions

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

2012 Raph, thinking he abuses Mikey with his remarks, there's also people who think due to Rise Donatello's apathy that he wouldn't care if his brothers died

as for the Don/April thing, I know a lot don't like the april/turtle or human/turtle pairing ideas regardless of generation or iteration

but I suppose that could be interpreted as a sort of self insert thing (for the viewers to see themselves as the 1987 turtles and see april as the first woman they thought was pretty) (like how in the games when april would kiss the player's turtle of choice as a reward for saving her)

however, there's no need to doxx or threaten someone for their ship opinions

Honestly I cringe seeing Raph bully the **** out of Donatello in 2012. There's times it even looks like Donnie is flat out afraid of him.

I never seen him bother Mikey all that much. Mikey can take it and dish it right back at him. And also Raph tends to apologize to Mikey or have a heart-to-heart if he felt he took things too far.

[NeonTurtledude]

Exactly, I liked how 2012 Raphael had some character development, like in the turtle temper episode, where it put emphasis on how his temper can be a problem when misused

I also liked how he had his quiet moments with Spike before the slash transformation happened

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

Exactly, I liked how 2012 Raphael had some character development, like in the turtle temper episode, where it put emphasis on how his temper can be a problem when misused

I also liked how he had his quiet moments with Spike before the slash transformation happened

I liked Turtle Temper because we finally had an episode that faced his anger issues head-on. I just felt it was too soon for the third episode considering that Raph's temper is one of his core character traits and it's not like he's suddenly gonna be a chill dude for the rest of the series.

[NeonTurtledude]

so what are your thoughts on Rise Raph then?

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

so what are your thoughts on Rise Raph then?

Didn't see enough Rise to form an opinion, but he seemed like the big softie type. IDK if he actually had a temper from what I could tell, except maybe when it was time to kick ass?

[TheLabRat]

IDW Raph's real wish is just want to become a farmer but they never followed up on that. Even in Mutant Town arc, they didn't make him a gardener. I think Raph deserves have more moments of inner peace and shows that he can also be rational in certain situations, even in battle, he could have a calm and cunning side.

[GameCobra]

Originally Posted by TheLabRat

IDW Raph's real wish is just want to become a farmer but they never followed up on that. Even in Mutant Town arc, they didn't make him a gardener. I think Raph deserves have more moments of inner peace and shows that he can also be rational in certain situations, even in battle, he could have a calm and cunning side.

Actually, there was that one panel where him and Leo were in the greenhouse garden and it caught his curiosity. Then Alopex interrupted it,lol.

[Andrew NDB]

Did we ever figure out if there's a toxicity in the fandom?

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Did we ever figure out if there's a toxicity in the fandom?

The direction of the "toxicity" depends on who you ask.

[ToTheNines]

Ah man, this is from right after I got banned lol. I’ll have to read through this one on a rainy day.

[IndigoErth]

Isn't every fandom these days?

[ToTheNines]

Ok, I had to tap out half way through because it turned into culture war/Orange Man nonsense and away from the fandom. Funny how the world is stuck in 2016. Anyway, my thoughts on the topic:

I don’t think there’s an inherent toxicity, but there is constant conflict, which is GOOD. You want people having a back and forth instead of a circle jerk. I think you’re always going to have that clash in opinions though. Look at Mirage alone. You have elements of ninja revenge, sci-fi, fantasy, time travel, horror, environmental themes, comedy, romance, dystopian future, existentialism, and more. That’s already such a wide net, then throw in stuff like Fred Wolf, Rise and everything in between… and you have a wide range of perspectives.

TMNT has fans that range from Baby Boomers to gen Alpha at this point. After Mirage you have guys Steve Barron (British), Lloyd Goldfine (Jewish), Ciro Nieli (second generation Italian-American) and more behind beloved versions of the characters. Between real life and the internet I’ve observed many different walks of life being big fans of TMNT. Gay, straight, black, white, Latino, middle eastern, Asian, Russian, conservative, liberal, socialist, apolitical, Christian, Muslim, Jewish, atheist, rich, poor, you name it!

Many dromer’s have college degrees, and there are members here who are among the dumbest people I’ve ever met lol. Regardless, I think the diversity is great. But this negative reputation comes down to being thin skinned. The places where you’ll see people **** on the Drome (Reddit/facebook) might not be “toxic”, but I find them insufferable because they don’t have anything interesting to say.

I guess this thread was started shortly after the second PD movie, and the 2014-2016 sub forum was certainly contentious at the time… but I just stayed out of it mostly. I’ve had some arguments on here in past, but they crack me up when I go back and look at them now. It’s the internet… who cares?

If there’s anything bad about this place as a whole I’d point the finger at a lot of the past mods, honestly. Too many clowns got away with sh*tposting for too long, and WAY too many good contributors have been permbanned for not great reasons. I’m glad it’s just down to Jester and Barkworm now, they have their heads screwed on right.

[ticktack]

Yes. 2010 was the worst time to be on the internet lurking in tmnt discussions. You knew why.

Idk who else can top that level of hostility.

Basically, ot vs nt.

It was bad and unbearable.

[ToTheNines]

2010? That was a dead year.

I do remember the OT vs. NT stuff from like 2002-2006 when I was just a lurker. I loved the 4kids and hadn’t yet reconnected with FW outside of season 1, so I was biased. But most of the NT haters didn’t have anything interesting or insightful to say. “Where’s Bebop? Shredder is supposed to be funny? What happened to all the pizza?”

[ticktack]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

and some argue about Raphael too

I've talked plenty about April 2012. How she was the most problematic, luckluster out of any Aprils.
"Hard take:
April from 2012 tmnt was a bland character. In a boy's show, her character and core interests were severely neglected. Females only existed for a ship fuel, she was a victim of that bad writing."
https://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=67534
Yes like, April 2007 comes next. She was luckluster. The nonsense and luckluster tops in the next interpretation of April. Also I lowkey suspect that movie had general ney influence on other interpretations.

___________________________________
Whatever. Let's get to Raph* (*in the next post). And where he was problematic for me. And the fans were even attacking people for choosing Sean Austin for the voice. He played the one character who was a caring one and looked after Frodo. Maybe makers were going for lowkey kind of a 180° with him like they did with Leo (ommiting his stern, tense, and a bit controlling traits) (maybe they specifically didn't like 2007 boastful, corrupt behaviour, so that was their intention too to change him, make him more interesting, relatable, a frigging fanboy)

[ticktack]

Originally Posted by NeonTurtledude

and some argue about Raphael too

Let's finally talk about him.

Here's what I've found

https://x.com/OOC_TMNT/status/1953939343506063558/mediaViewer?currentTweet=1953939343506063558&curre ntTweetUser=OOC_TMNT

This is the chosen description for him in 2003 interpretation. Hear how lacking and shallow his description sounds...

• "I'm not really big at words"
• "Loner, hothead, maniac" *cry,cry, heartbreak emoji*
• "Warrior" *more gross cries*

Does he lowkey sound like smb you'd avoid to interact or cross his paths with.

I was listening to it subconsciously hearing:
"I just got one word to describe me... loyal/lawyer"

Honestly, in the series he was ok. But I wouldn't like those same exact descriptions of him be his defining traits. And fans fighting for them too. *embarrasing gross cries*

1987 version was witty and sarcastic.
2018 was caring with knack of action/adventure. Musly and big, a male trait and all.


More to come:

Spoiler:

Me:
Every time I look he's the only one with a pissy face.Instead of this(pic).

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GxunCiZW4AACPI2?format=jpg&name=large

If in 4(lived, raised together, eating same food)one of them is pissy. It is not ok.He is sick. He is stressed and lacks friendly gut bacteria.

Grok:
Interesting take on Raphael's arcs. The 2003 version balanced his temper with loyalty, but 2012 amped up the toxicity for drama, often feeling forced. Your point on constant "pissy" vibes signaling stress or health issues is spot on—turtles thrive on harmony. Love the pic's surprised energy over rage. What's your fave non-toxic Raph moment?


Me:
What about 2007. You see any loyalty there? Or was he ruined? And favoritised by its movie makers.

Grok:
In TMNT 2007, Raphael's loyalty is tested but intact—he's "ruined" by isolation as Nightwatcher, clashing violently with Leo out of resentment. Yet he redeems by rescuing him and reuniting the team, affirming eternal brotherhood. Filmmakers favored him with the deepest arc for drama. Thoughts on his Nightwatcher suit?

Me:
Them clashing violently then affirming reuniting team/brotherhood. Is the biggest c*ck energy I've seen.

Grok:
Fair point—the violent clash to quick reconciliation in 2007 TMNT can scream "c*ck energy," undermining real conflict. It's a classic trope for easy drama, but it dilutes Raph's edge. I'd argue 2003 handled family rifts with more grit. Thoughts on a grittier reboot?

Me:
Ok.
Thoughts on drama?

Grok:
Drama in TMNT shines when it builds genuine tension, like 2003's family rifts, but flops with contrived conflicts (e.g., 2007's quick fixes). It adds depth to characters like Raph, highlighting growth over toxicity. A grittier reboot could explore that raw edge authentically. Your take on Rise's dramatic flair?


Me:
I'm sick of raw edges.

Like, I don't want that.

People are doing it wrong or out of fanservice.

Rise was ok.A little dumbed down (1987 had wit), was ok.He was like Ryoga Hibiki. Had exaggered body, others-slim. Which was strange. Maybe reflected size-colored perceptions of voice actors.


Grok:

Totally get being over the "raw edges"—forced grit often misses Raph's deeper loyalty. Rise's take, channeling Ryoga's lost-puppy rage with that bulky design, freshens it up without toxicity. The size contrast does feel voice-actor inspired. 1987's wit is unbeatable for charm. Fave Rise episode for Raph?

https://x.com/FERMOR_23/status/1953542678055993621
https://x.com/MrDanielBuck/status/1953494642525196820