Terminator 7

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Sumac

I think, A4 / A5 have already been written, considering how much was spent of pre-production.

Yeah, he's openly said he didn't want to film anything until all the movies were written in advance.

[Andrew NDB]

Let's try this again.

The SkyNET loop (does NOT factor for Dark Fate):

Step 0: 1985 - John Connor is born to Sarah Connor and an unknown father.
Step 1: 1997 - Judgement Day. SkyNET goes live.
Step 2: 2029 - SkyNET loses to TechCOM forces. Sends back T-800 to kill Sarah Connor before John is born.
Step 3: 1984 - Sarah and Kyle Reese destroy the T-800 but leave the CPU to be found by Cyberdyne Systems. Kyle becomes John's father.
Step 4: 1995 - CyberDyne Systems is destroyed by Sarah, John, and a reprogrammed T-800.
Step 5: 1997 - Judgement Day does not happen, Sarah Connor dies of leukemia
Step 6: 2032 - With TechCOM, John defeats SkyNET... but then is killed when he sees a T-800 with the T101 skin. SkyNET sends back a T-X to kill John's "generals" to 2004 so Kate sends back the murderous T-800, now reprogrammed.
Step 7: 2004 - Cyber Research Systems (CRS) who inherited the T-800 data from CyberDyne Systems, cause Judgement Day when they bring SkyNET live.
Step 8: 2029 - Back to Step 2. And Future John isn't killed by a Terminator with the T101 skin because this John is ready for it.

Original timeline:
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1997 - Judgement Day
2029 - SkyNET loses, sends T-800 to 1984, TechCOM sends Kyle Reese to 1984

Altered Timeline 1:
1984 - T-800 is destroyed, Kyle Reese dies
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1997 - Judgement Day
2029 - SkyNET loses, sends T-1000 to 1995, TechCOM sends a T-800 to 1995

Altered Timeline 2:
1984 - T-800 is destroyed, Kyle Reese dies
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1995 - T-1000 is destroyed, T-800 is destroyed.
1997 - Judgement Day does not occur, Sarah Connor dies of leukemia
2004 - Judgement Day
2032 - SkyNET loses, sends T-X to 2004, TechCOM sends a T-850 to 2004

Altered Timeline 3:
1984 - T-800 is destroyed, Kyle Reese dies
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1995 - T-1000 is destroyed, T-800 is destroyed.
1997 - Judgement Day does not occur, Sarah Connor dies of leukemia
2004 - T-X is destroyed (but not before uploading information about the future into SkyNET), T-850 is destroyed. Judgement Day
2018 - A SkyNET post is destroyed (Salvation)
2029 - SkyNET loses (but now is armed with information from the T-X from 2004), sends T-800 to the 70s and a T-1000 to 1984, TechCOM sends a T-800 to the 70s

Altered Timeline 4:
197X - Sarah Connor's parents are killed by a T-800
1984 - T-800 is destroyed, T-1000 is destroyed, Kyle Reese lives, Sarah and Kyle time-travel to 2017
1997 - Judgement Day does not occur, Sarah Connor does not die of leukemia (she isn't even there)
2004 - Judgement Day does not occur
20XX - John Connor is made into a T-3000
2017 - The T-3000 is destroyed

Altered Timeline 5*
1984 - T-800 is destroyed, Kyle Reese dies
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1995 - T-1000 is destroyed, T-800 is destroyed.
1997 - Judgement Day does not occur, Sarah Connor does not die of leukemia
1998 - T-800 kills John Connor
2004 - Judgement Day does not occur
2022 - Rev-9 is destroyed
202X - Judgement Day happens
2042 - Legion sends a Rev-9 to 2022 to kill Dani Ramos

*It is interesting to wonder if the SkyNET that survived Genisys (from the after-credits) would go on to preserve history, but with one new wrinkle: sending one new T-800 back to 1998. But not that interesting. What a mess.

[Sumac]

A lot of inconsistences in this timelines.
I suggest few corrections:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

The SkyNET loop (does NOT factor for Dark Fate):

Step 0: 1985 - John Connor is born to Sarah Connor and an unknown father.
Step 1: 1997 - Judgement Day. SkyNET goes live.
Step 2: 2029 - SkyNET loses to TechCOM forces. Sends back T-800 to kill Sarah Connor before John is born.
Step 3: 1984 - Sarah and Kyle Reese destroy the T-800 but leave the CPU to be found by Cyberdyne Systems. Kyle becomes John's father.
Step 4: 1995 - CyberDyne Systems is destroyed by Sarah, John, and a reprogrammed T-800.
Step 5: 1997 - Judgement Day does not happen, Sarah Connor dies of leukemia
Step 6: 2032 - With TechCOM, John defeats SkyNET... but then is killed when he sees a T-800 with the T101 skin. SkyNET sends back a T-X to kill John's "generals" to 2004 so Kate sends back the murderous T-800, now reprogrammed.
Step 7: 2004 - Cyber Research Systems (CRS) who inherited the T-800 data from CyberDyne Systems, cause Judgement Day when they bring SkyNET live.
Step 8: 2029 - Back to Step 2. And Future John isn't killed by a Terminator with the T101 skin because this John is ready for it.

Loop is valid only for T1.

Loop stops working after T2, because, if Judgement Day is postponed, so is the Future War, which means even, if Kyle Reese is sent back to the past it won't be from 2029 and it will be slightly different version of Kyle Reese.
T3 takes care of this by moving Future War 7 years forward.

Here is important thing: since Judgement Day and Future War are postponed it means that events of T1 and T2 can't occur as they were.

This puts us at odds with how Terminator continuum works - on one hand future can be changed (postponement of JD and FW 7 years forward). On the other, events that had already occurred in the past won't be changed, even if they have no causes anymore.

T2 essentially breaks T1 loop, by moving or canceling future events, but it does not effect anything in the past: John Connor still exists, as well, as Skynet's designs derived from T800 chip, even though neither Kyle Reese nor OG T800 no longer exist due to timeline changes.

T3 throws another wrench into this scheme, since it never-ever mentions previous time travels made by Skynet and Resistance in the future.

There are two possibilities: Skynet and Resistance sent their respective parties to the past somewhere prior to 2032, whether its done to preserve timeline (something which John Connor might know, but this means he should be the one to sent Kyle in the past first, before Skynet sends T800, since Skynet shouldn't know about time travels at this point) or just, because, it just happens like before.

Or those time travels simply don't happen at all (which is, IMO, more logical), which won't effect timeline in the slightest, since as we know breaking time loop and effectively erasing original Kyle and T800 has no effect on existence of John Connor and Skynet in the past.

Point is: T2 and T3 break time loop and basically mutually exclusive to T1 and each other.
Conclusion: most likely time travels from T1/T2 don't occur in T3 version of timeline, since there is no reason for them to.

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Step 6: 2032 - With TechCOM, John defeats SkyNET... but then is killed when he sees a T-800 with the T101 skin. SkyNET sends back a T-X to kill John's "generals" to 2004 so Kate sends back the murderous T-800, now reprogrammed.

I don't think anything indicates that John defeated Skynet in 2032. More than that, T850 says that John and Kate children will play important role in the war, which means it will continue at least up until their maturity, so 2032 is not an end of the war.

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Original timeline:
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1997 - Judgement Day
2029 - SkyNET loses, sends T-800 to 1984, TechCOM sends Kyle Reese to 1984

Altered Timeline 1:
1984 - T-800 is destroyed, Kyle Reese dies
1985 - Sarah Connor gives birth to John Connor
1997 - Judgement Day
2029 - SkyNET loses, sends T-1000 to 1995, TechCOM sends a T-800 to 1995

AT1 doesn't make sense: T2 mentions that Skynet had sent T800 and T1000 at the same time to 1984 and 1991 respectively. There was no change "in-between" T1 and T2 timelines. Outside of Cameron retconning T1, but that is besides the scope of this conversation.

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

2004 - T-X is destroyed (but not before uploading information about the future into SkyNET), T-850 is destroyed. Judgement Day

I know it is a popular theory (which clears some plot holes in the movie and gives TX more importance), but its just a theory.

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

2029 - SkyNET loses (but now is armed with information from the T-X from 2004), sends T-800 to the 70s and a T-1000 to 1984, TechCOM sends a T-800 to the 70s

If I am not mistaking, it was T1000 who was sent to the 1970s by either regular Skynet or some of his future iterations (I don't think anyone mentions anything about Skynet sending T1000 in the Future War segment of the story, I think they only mention T800). OG T800 was still sent to 1984 and it was sent by a regular Skynet.

Who had sent Pops to 1970s is unknown. It could have been Techcom or its just another Skynet twist to manipulate timeline to a specific outcome (I wouldn't put it past writers to pull this off as "WHAT A TWIST" moment for a possible sequel). It could have been some third party we know nothing about.

Also, I don't think TDF fits anywhere in a regular timeline. Even if you can shove Genisys somehow into T1-T4 series, TDF completely contradicts it, like Sarah Connor Chronicles before it to the point that its either should be discarded or relegated to some alternate universe (which do exist, according to SCC).

Legion exists, because of events of T1 and T2, which do not happen in Genisys timeline and, in fact, they can not happen at all, since T1000 was sent to 1970s, instead of 1991 and Sarah has completely different life being raised by Pops. Not to mention she doesn't sleep with Kyle in 1984, so John Connor birth moved to...some undefined date in the future, if at all. Therefore none of the old time is valid in TG version of events and TDF simply can't happen. Neither do events of SCC, which follow T1/T2.

[Andrew NDB]

More T7 rumblings from Cameron:

https://www.darkhorizons.com/james-c...ew-terminator/

[CyberCubed]

There's literally no point for any other movies at this point other than John Conner winning the war in the future. They basically altered the timeline 3-4 times already sending a Terminator back in time over and over again, the plot has been done to death.

The timeline has been splintered after T2 (the original ending), to T3/Salvation, to Genesis and Dark Fate, which is 4 different branches in the timeline now, 5 if you count the Sarah Conner Chronicles TV show. I can buy all this happening as multiple branches of the timeline, but there's almost no point to do this anymore.

Just show John Conner in the future winning the war and be done with it.

[Wildcat]

Sorry for repeating myself but I thought of a couple new ideas. Thought I’d post them all together.

Terminator: Future Blood
John Connor travels back in time to recruit John Rambo.

Terminator: Fate of the Galaxy
Skynet sends back machines to instead take over other planets to ensure it’s existence and gain dominance over earth.

Terminator: The New Judgement Day
The original events were only delayed...to the far off future where Skynet must contend with Judge Dredd.

Terminator: War for Cyberdyne
After Skynet is launched and war breaks out earth is detected by someone who wants to form an alliance. Now John Connor must wage his battle to destroy the evil forces of the Decepticons...but he won’t do it alone. Roll Out!

Terminator: Clash of the Timelines
The overuse of time travel causes a rip in the fabric of time where Skynet, Genisys and Legion along with their heroes are thrown together in an all out fight for survival. Only the T-Infinity https://terminator.fandom.com/wiki/T-Infinity has the power to restore order

[Andrew NDB]

Cameron says there is "more than a plan" for T7 and beyond.

https://www.darkhorizons.com/james-c...inator-future/

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

There's literally no point for any other movies at this point other than John Conner winning the war in the future. They basically altered the timeline 3-4 times already sending a Terminator back in time over and over again, the plot has been done to death.

You are, of course, right. But if I had to guess from the blurbs from Cameron in the link in this post above, it sounds like T7 will do a bit of a "Dark Fate" in that it'll wipe away everything since probably T2 again and introduce a new AI threat that isn't SkyNET or LEGION. Which makes me wonder now if LEGION was one of Cameron's few own ideas for "Dark Fate" and now he feels that the director bungled that in the movie. I just hope it's not like some kind of Terminator movie that borrows from stuff like the Child's Play remake and MEGAN where there isn't really Terminators walking around as much as its all of our household Amazon Alexas and Siris coming to kill us all.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Cameron says there is "more than a plan" for T7 and beyond.

https://www.darkhorizons.com/james-c...inator-future/



You are, of course, right. But if I had to guess from the blurbs from Cameron in the link in this post above, it sounds like T7 will do a bit of a "Dark Fate" in that it'll wipe away everything since probably T2 again and introduce a new AI threat that isn't SkyNET or LEGION. Which makes me wonder now if LEGION was one of Cameron's few own ideas for "Dark Fate" and now he feels that the director bungled that in the movie. I just hope it's not like some kind of Terminator movie that borrows from stuff like the Child's Play remake and MEGAN where there isn't really Terminators walking around as much as its all of our household Amazon Alexas and Siris coming to kill us all.

Wasn't literally every movie since the second one meant to restart the franchise with a bunch of new sequels that never panned out? For that matter, aren't basically all of them meant to be sequels to the first two and ignoring the rest? Not that you could tell because they keep going back in time and changing the timeline, which means it literally doesn't matter if these movies are somehow connected or not.

And is there literally no plot imaginable that doesn't just a repeat of the first one's premise of sending a killer robot back in time? There's been six movies and two shows in this franchise, only one of which is not about a Terminator being sent back to kill someone important. Humanity rebuilding after Skynet was defeated or something might not sound all that exciting at first, but is it really too much to ask for some fresh ideas than just remaking the first one under the pretense of being a sequel for the seventh time?

[member_removed]

Salvation, Genisis and Dark Fate are a trilogy of failed trilogy starters.

All were heralded as the beginning of new Terminator trilogy. All failed, sucked and flopped.

I have no idea why Hollywood has a hard-on for trilogies. Just make one good movie, then keep making good sequels.

As a franchise Terminator can eat a bag robodicks!

[Andrew NDB]

It doesn't sound like this would be "A sequel" in the way that we would traditionally think of one. Not even a "requel."

[Wildcat]

I honestly like all of my ideas I posted before but realistically the last one, the timelines all crossing over, is definitely doable and would be awesome imo.

Sounds like he’s talking a full reboot but in terms of iconography being dropped I highly doubt he’d drop the general design of the terminator robots.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Wildcat

I honestly like all of my ideas I posted before but realistically the last one, the timelines all crossing over, is definitely doable and would be awesome imo.

I honestly thought what probably most people thought when they read that post. That it was a joke.

Originally Posted by neatoman

Wasn't literally every movie since the second one meant to restart the franchise with a bunch of new sequels that never panned out?

Salvation reasonably works as a direct sequel to T3, and I don't think T3 was ever poised as any sort of trilogy starter. But both as a result of and following Salvation is where everything drove off the cliff for no reason.

Salvation was BAD and neutered when it should have been the most brutal of all Terminator movies (we finally get to the Future War and it's PG-13? are you kidding me?) but it at least moved things forward and in a new direction. It's been "greatest hits" since then.

[Wildcat]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

I honestly thought what probably most people thought when they read that post. That it was a joke.

The comics have done major crossovers including Transformers. I don’t see why they’re too ridiculous for movies. I know they can’t really be done because of licensing though.

Still just keeping things Terminator...crossing the timelines works perfectly to tie everything together and has a unique twist that a specific Terminator has the power to fix everything. This is not over-the-top for this franchise. I mean it’s basically about the multiverse and the T-Infinity is an official character.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Wildcat

The comics have done major crossovers including Transformers. I don’t see why they’re too ridiculous for movies. I know they can’t really be done because of licensing though.

Still just keeping things Terminator...crossing the timelines works perfectly to tie everything together and has a unique twist that a specific Terminator has the power to fix everything. This is not over-the-top for this franchise. I mean it’s basically about the multiverse and the T-Infinity is an official character.

I would never have thought that Wendy's could ever be compared to a Super Nintendo... but then I tried their capers.

[Wildcat]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

I would never have thought that Wendy's could ever be compared to a Super Nintendo... but then I tried their capers.

I don't get the metaphor. I understand why crossovers with other franchises would be viewed as silly but a standalone Terminator movie about it's own multiverse is a legitimately viable idea.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Wildcat

I don't get the metaphor.

You made a ridiculous post. So I did the same thing.

[Andrew NDB]

Cameron's still writing it, but he's having a tough time of it:

https://www.darkhorizons.com/james-c...inator-issues/

[IMJ]

Terminator: Salvation was actually a pretty solid movie. They should have continued with that and kept Christian Bale to be honest.