My Mirage timeline

[ToTheNines]

1373 - The Foot Clan is founded.

1941 - Hamato Yoshi and Oroku Nagi are born.

1950 - Karai is born.

1952 - Oroku Saki is born.

1958 - April O’Neil is born.

1959 - Oroku Nagi is killed by Hamato Yoshi.

1963 - Casey Jones is born.

~1968 - Tales v2 #44

1970 - Shredder is sent to NYC.

1971 - Hamato Yoshi and Tang Shen are murdered by Shredder.

1972 - Splinter and the turtles are mutated.

1984 -
The turtles turn 12
Vol. 1 #9

1985 -
Tales v2 #1
The turtles turn 13
TMNT #1
TMNT #2
TMNT #3
Raphael #1
TMNT #4
Fugitoid #1
TMNT #5
TMNT #6
TMNT #7
TMNT x Stranger Things
Michaelangelo #1

1986 -
TMNT #8
Usagi crossovers
Donatello #1
Tales v1 #5
The turtles turn 14
Tales v1 #7
Tales v1 #3
Leonardo #1
TMNT #10

1987 -
TMNT #11
Tales v1 #1
The turtles turn 15
Michael Dooney’s “Challenges”
TMNT #12
TMNT #13
TMNT #14
TMNT #15
TMNT #17
Tales v1 #2
Tales v1 #4

1988 -
The turtles turn 16
TMNT #19
Tales v2 #70
TMNT #20
TMNT #21

1989 -
Tales v2 #3-4
Tales v1 #6
TMNT #45
Tales v2 #8
Tales v2 #23
Tales v2 #34
First Savage Dragon crossover
Tales v2 #11
Tales v2 #50
Tales v2 #63

TMNT vs. Predator
“The River”
TMNT #28
TMNT #27
TMNT# 37
TMNT# 42
TMNT# 43
TMNT# 46
TMNT# 47
Tales v2 #19
Tales v2 #22

The turtles turn 17

TMNT #48
TMNT #49
TMNT #50
TMNT #51
TMNT #52
TMNT #53
TMNT #54

1990 -
TMNT #55
TMNT #56
Tales v2 #46
TMNT #57
TMNT #58
TMNT #59
TMNT #60
TMNT #61
TMNT #62

TMNT Volume 2 #1-13
Tales v2 #43
Second Savage Dragon crossover
“Gang Wars”
The turtles turn 18
Image TMNT Volume 3 #1-16

1991 -
Image TMNT Volume 3 #17-23
The turtles turn 19
TMNT: Unfinished Business

Tales v2 #53
Tales v2 #65

1992 -
Tales v2 #9
Tales v2 #5
Leonardo: Blindsight
The turtles turn 20
A Christmas Carol/Ghosts of Christmas Past short stories

1993-2000: “The lost years”

2001 -
Tales v2 #69
Tales v2 #7
Raphael: Bad Moon Rising
Tales v2 #6
The turtles turn 29
Tales v2 #42
Tales v2 #66

2002 -
TMNT Volume 4 #1-5
Michelangelo: The Third Kind
The turtles turn 30
TMNT Volume 4 #6-11
Tales v2 #39
TMNT Volume 4 #12-28
Tales v2 #27
TMNT Volume 4 #29-32

2003 -
Tales v2 #31
The turtles turn 31

2006 -
“Night of the Ninja Girl” 30th anniversary special
The turtles turn 34
TMNT: Origin

2007 -
The turtles turn 35
TMNT: Origin epilogues

2008 -
The turtles turn 36
TMNT: 2030

2009 -
The turtles turn 37
TMNT: The Shredder

2030 -
TMNT: 2030 epilogue (58 years old)

2058 -
Michelangelo disappears and is presumed dead after leaving Earth via transmat (Mike is 86)

2060 -
Tales v2 #40 (Raph is 88.)

2081 -
Raphael is killed by poachers (Raph is 109)

2099 -
Tales v2 #41 (Leo is 127 years old)

2105 -
Tales of the TMNT Treasury Edition TPB front pieces and epilogue (Don is 133)
TMNT: Odyssey

[ToTheNines]

(Placeholder post for notes)

Somewhat different than Spengler’s timeline, which is an exhaustive chronological reading order, this is more of an actual timeline that just includes the broad strokes and tracks the turtles’ age throughout the story. I was hesitant to even share, since most people don’t like the idea of the guys being 13 at the begging, but it’s the only way that works for me. Here’s a rough breakdown of the 4 main volumes:

1985: no one debates this year. There is a line in #1 about them training for 13 years, I think Splinter means they didn’t start until they were 2, but it helps my case a little.

1986: also not contested, and confirmed on-panel several times.

1987: April’s journal in True Stories.

1988: here’s where people start disagreeing. You have Christmas 1988 confirmed on a newspaper, Laird has stated that they are 16 in RTNY, Shredder tells Leo he died 3 years ago, which logically makes them 13 during #1.

Looking at it this way, there are zero stories told in 1988 other than RTNY, but I kind of like that. There is no lead up to RTNY at all, it just starts with Raph fed up with their inaction. Which makes a lot of sense if basically nothing happened for that long.

1989: Roughly a year after RTNY. Laird confirms they’re 17 now.

1990: CaW sees a winter pass. It has to be several months total, since Gabbi isn’t super-pregnant at the beginning and Mr. Buscheyev completely recovers.

Volume 2 is shortly after CaW. Donatello says Baxter has been missing for 5 years, so if they’re 17 and a half, that aligns with them being 13 in #1.

Gang Wars happens. Volume 3 starts and they’re 18.

1991: They turn 19 in Image #23.

1992: a few Tales I like to imagine happens around the time of them turning 20.

2002: Volume 4 #1 is January and the turtles are 29, likely turning 30 before #6.

#32 is still late 2002.

[TheLabRat]

My thought on Swan Song ending: Future Leo probably has parinirvana, which mean he has passed away but also get rid of the cycle of reincarnation and ascended to a higher realm.

[Andrew NDB]

The Vol. 4 stuff doesn't work since, of course, 9/11 happened in "real-time" with the early issues there. And there wasn't really any sort of big time jumps after that in the volume. And though I was originally a fan of the idea of the TMNT being 13 in Vol. 1, #1, that really doesn't work.

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

The Vol. 4 stuff doesn't work since, of course, 9/11 happened in "real-time" with the early issues there. And there wasn't really any sort of big time jumps after that in the volume. And though I was originally a fan of the idea of the TMNT being 13 in Vol. 1, #1, that really doesn't work.

Yeah, Shadow’s age wrecks the dates given in Volume 4. I guess you just have to assume she had some time-travel experience with Renet that caused her to age faster? I dunno.

And whether you say they’re 13 or 15 in #1, you have to make concessions and implement no-prizes to make anything work. I personally like the idea of them having a longer “career”, before the Lost Years period in between Vol. 3 and Vol. 4.

[ToTheNines]

Went ahead and added TMNT x Stranger Things for the hell of it. Looking at a Stranger Things timeline, if this is after season 3 that should put it right around October 1985. So it fits nicely between TMNT #7 and "The Christmas Aliens".

[ToTheNines]

Here’s some Mirage timeline stuff from our pal Andrew that was part of a letter he got published in Volume 4 #21. I know he’s changed his mind, but I want to post it here for posterity:

Originally Posted by Andrew circa 2005

1981 - The TMNT are born pet shop turtles, then exposed to TCRI mutagen
1994 - The TMNT defeat Shredder for the first time
1997 - The TMNT defeat Shredder for the second
1998 - The TMNT make peace with the Foot Clan
1999 - The TMNT confront Warlord Komodo, Donatello becomes a cyborg, Raphael becomes the Shredder
2008 - The Turtles continue the fight at age 28


Ages :
TMNT Vol. 1 #1-3 -- 13
TMNT Vol. 1 #4-? -- 15
TMNT Vol. 1 #21 - ? - 16
TMNT Vol. 1 #48 - 62+ -- 16 into 17
TNT Vol. 2 #1-13 -- 17
TMNT Vol. 3 #1-22 -- 18
TMNT Vol. 3 #23+ -- 19
TMNT Vol. 4 #1+ -- 28

The comic dates given are based on several key points.
1) Leonardo indicates directly in Vol. 1, #21 that 3 years had passed since #1. The Turtles could have been no younger than 13 in #1 (the comic was still called "Teenage," of course), and no older, in order for a cohesive timeline to work in light of all other facts.
2) The Turtles make a comment in Vol. 1, #4 that it had been fifteen years since their mutation.
3) It is indicated in "City at War" (Vol. 1, #50 - 62 + 48 & 49) that about a year had passed since the Turtles second defeat of Shredder
(#21), and that the "City at War" arc itself spans about a year itself, meaning they almost definitely made the transition from 16 to 17 throughout the story arc. Since "City at War" itself does span nearly an entire year, the Turtles would had to have been 17-and-a-half or borderline 18 throughout Vol. 2. Vol. 3, of course, cements that they are at age 18 by their eighteenth birthday party in #1 and 19 by their nineteenth birthday party in the final issue, #23. The dates themselves are based on the fact that Vol. 3 established (in lettercol) that the Turtles are now roughly moving in present-day, real-time.
Taking comic delays, short time-spanning storylines, and such into consideration, this is not always possible. For instance, though Vol. 3, #1 hit shelves in 1996, the issue the Turtles turn 18 in, it was 1999 before they turned 19 in #23. With this in mind, for every year in reality that went by without the Turtles turning 20 in the Image series, every comic event in the above timeline of events had to be bumped ahead a year. In TMNT #1, Volume 4 the Turtles make the comment that "this was easier 15 years ago" in reference to the Purple Dragon encounter of Volume 1, #1, when the Turtles were 13 years of age by this timeline - this establishes the Turtles are 28 in Volume 4. This is the best sense I can make of it all, what do you think?

[Andrew NDB]

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

The Vol. 4 stuff doesn't work since, of course, 9/11 happened in "real-time" with the early issues there. And there wasn't really any sort of big time jumps after that in the volume. And though I was originally a fan of the idea of the TMNT being 13 in Vol. 1, #1, that really doesn't work.

Would you or Arseniy be willing to share the timeline you guys use? I was playing around with reworking mine since we were talking about the issue of Shadow’s age and realizing you guys have a more agreeable take for that (having RTNY be in 1987). I couldn’t get around having the turtles be 14 at the beginning of Vol. 1, which still works for me but I know most people say they’re 15. I can’t make that work though.

Anyway here’s a very rough version of me trying to match the Turtles Club timeline:

1985:

Turtles turn 14

TMNT #1 to Michelangelo #1

1986:

TMNT #8

Turtles turn 15

TMNT #10

1987:

TMNT #11

Turtles turn 16

Return to New York

1988:

Worms of madness

Bunch of stuff

Turtles turn 17

Shades of Gray

City at War begins

Shadow is born

1989:

City at War ends

Volume 2

Gang Wars

Turtles turn 18

Volume 3 begins

1990:

Turtles turn 19

Volume 3 ends

2001:

Darkness Weaves
Scars
Hell’s Blacktop (May 10th, 2001)
The Curious Case of Mr. Jones
There’s No Place Like Home (December 31st, 2001)

2002:

Volume 4 (Turtles are 30 and Shadow is 14. They are 31 and 15 by the time of #32)






Please let me know what you think!

[Andrew NDB]

That's getting closer. But I still think you need to force the beginning to them being 15. Whether it is more convenient for us to force them to be 13 or 14 in Vol. 1, #1 or not to make an airtight timeline I don't believe for a moment (anymore) that was ever the intention of Kevin or Peter for them to be that young. And that has to be paramount.

For a while because of Image/Vol. 3 I actually adopted a different timescale. Akin to DC/Marvel, since Image wasn't moving like Mirage, and was moving in real-time with other Image titles. Which is a long way of saying however many years we agree take place between Image #1 and Mirage Vol. 1 #1, that's the number of years it is ago TODAY. i.e., if they're turning 18 in Vol. 3 #1 in 1996, that means that Vol. 1, #1 took place in 1993. And then a year from then Vol. 1, #1 now takes place in 1994. And so on, because of a constantly moving "Present Day" that does not match the passing of time in the books.

Obviously this went out the window when Vol. 4 came out and re-anchored things to specific years, namely 9/11. Though you're right, Vol. 4 beginning in 2002 the way it was handled.

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

I don't believe for a moment (anymore) that was ever the intention of Kevin or Peter for them to be that young. And that has to be paramount.

Yeah, 15 was definitely their intention. Making them younger is just a retcon that allows the Image run (and a few other things) to fit better. And we know Image isn't part of Peter's intention, so I don't always take his word as gospel.

But yeah throwing the Image run out, or even just ignoring the birthday stuff, makes the whole thing less of a headache. At that point you can say f*ck it, they're 18 or even 19 during volume 2 (Don says Baxter has been gone for 5 years and Shadow quite obviously ages between #1 and #13).

But the Image run will never not be a part of the narrative to me, so we all do what mental gymnastics we must lol. I just can't reconcile all of RTNY, 25+ stories/Tales, Shades of Gray, CaW, Volume 2, Gang Wars and the first half of Volume 3 taking place in the span of one year.

A real Mirage timeline is a losing battle and there is no right answer, it just is what it is. It was always loose, and that's fine. The sane thing to do is just use the TMNTEntity reading order and not think too much about the actual years.

[Andrew NDB]

Stuff like "3 years ago I saw you die!" (like, to the day? or like two years and a few months? or what?) or Newspaper dates I don't really value too high in the grand scheme.

The important tentpoles, I think:

* The Turtles are 15 in TMNT Vol. 1, #1 in 1985.
* The Turtles turn 18 in TMNT Vol. 3, #1 in 1988.
* The Turtles turn 19 in TMNT Vol. 3, #23 in 1989.
* The Turtles are 32 in the first part of TMNT Vol. 4 in 2002.

Everything needs to be tucked in around those.

[ToTheNines]

Nitpick, but they would be 31 at the start of Vol. 4 and turn 32 later that year.

But yeah, that's a clean and simple breakdown of the few times we're really given a hard age for the guys within the story itself. It the best we can do without over scrutinizing it.

For me, I just feel like there's too much time and story content between RTNY and Vol 3. to call them that close. Karai's line alone in #57 about RTNY being "one year ago" already pushes them pretty far apart, not to mention everything after.