Steve Barron's TMNT; More than a good comic book movie, but a good movie.

**Jester** · 12-03-2007, 06:13 PM

Hey all. I pose this question here, but it may color the opinions, heck my own opinion may be a bit biased due to my love of the 1st TMNT movie. The question at hand is: Is the original live action TMNT film more than a great comic book adaptation, but a good movie? I would argue that it is, but again I may be a little biased, but hear me out. I feel there is a subtlety to some of the performances, especially Kevin Clash in the role of Splinter, that makes me believe that TMNT should be taken a little more seriously as a film. I plan to use some video evidence to support this, once I can do so and upload to Youtube.
So look for an update with video very soon, illustrating the fact that TMNT is more than just a simple comic book adaptation film.

*Kendamu* · 12-03-2007, 06:30 PM

Well, if films which deal with teenage feelings of abandonment, alienation, loss, depression, coping, and eventual redemption from multiple points-of-view is your style of movie then I'd have to say that TMNT could almost be taken seriously as a film. The only thing that could make it be taken more seriously by the public-at-large (as opposed to us fans) would be if the movie was mostly from Danny's viewpoint with rare, vague, Ninja-like appearances from the Turtles themselves (similar to the Dreamwave comics).

**Jester** · 12-03-2007, 06:37 PM

Yeah, it's hard to take a movie with anthropomorphic Turtles seriously, but you're right the movie does touch on those themes. I read a section from a book when I was in college. I'm not sure if it was one of the "Turmoil in the Toybox" books or the "Saturday Morning Mind Control" book but one denounced the TMNT for promoting gang involvement (I think it may have been in reference to the show, not the movie,but it referenced the movie as well.) I would have to disagree with that in that the movie does the exact opposite. The true family is lifted up over the gang. I may have to add that clip to my attempt at a video refutation of my point, but in all honesty, who here is going to disagree with us? :p

*oldmanwinters* · 12-03-2007, 06:51 PM

I'd say the first movie is above average as far as most movies go.

Course, I'm really biased too.

*Mr._Mutant_Man* · 12-03-2007, 07:38 PM

As far as something that was geared for the younger crowd, I think it's one of the better ones. It involved goofy characters, but it wasn't dumbed down. Like I think stuff like Pokemon kind of lowers the bar for children's programming, because it's a blatant marketing tool. But the TMNT movie, while certainly part of a kid's franchise, has at least some kind of substance, thanks to being a relatively close adaptation of the comics. You have things such as the darker, kind of grungy atmosphere, you have topics such as anger and families (even if it is a weird family).

But yeah, it's harder to take a movie about humanoid turtles seriously. But maybe if they made it a little darker, and there wasn't as much slapstick, it would be taken a little more seriously. But then the movie wouldn't have been a fun blend of the comics and the cartoon.

*BigApple3AM* · 12-03-2007, 07:39 PM

Masterpiece.

*Kendamu* · 12-03-2007, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester

Yeah, it's hard to take a movie with anthropomorphic Turtles seriously, but you're right the movie does touch on those themes. I read a section from a book when I was in college. I'm not sure if it was one of the "Turmoil in the Toybox" books or the "Saturday Morning Mind Control" book but one denounced the TMNT for promoting gang involvement (I think it may have been in reference to the show, not the movie,but it referenced the movie as well.) I would have to disagree with that in that the movie does the exact opposite. The true family is lifted up over the gang. I may have to add that clip to my attempt at a video refutation of my point, but in all honesty, who here is going to disagree with us? :p

It's the same bullsh*t that's going on with video games now. Apparently, Jack Thompson's literally blaming video games for 9/11 now. Just shows that people were just as stupid back then as they are now and can very easily turn legitimate entertainment into a source for generating shock amongst the masses.

TheAnimatedSeries · 12-04-2007, 04:38 AM

I dont see how the first movie isnt good, especially since they could have just made anything and it would have been a success. Even if you dont pick up on the movies themes, I still cant see it not being a fully entertaining and rewarding movie experience.

~~AquaParade~~ · 12-04-2007, 11:52 AM

I'd say that the first tmnt movie, is defnitely not to be taken as a joke. Sure, it was maybe a kids movie, but if your gonna classify it as a kids movie, you better give it credit for all the atmosphere and themes you would rarely find in another kids movie. I dont know where I'm really going with this, but it is an easily enjoyable film, and one that would probably change a lot of peoples minds about tmnt if viewed for the first time.

**Jester** · 12-04-2007, 08:03 PM

Well here it is, as promised, the video evidence plus my own lame attempt at commentary. Enjoy.
Part 1:

Part 2:

*Coola Yagami* · 12-04-2007, 08:12 PM

Coulda been taken a lil more seriously if the TMNT weren't shouting out lame-ass slang every five minutes... even having this lil 'slang contest' whenever they did something cool. I know it was closer to the cartoon, but even in the old cartoon Mikey was the one with all the surfer talk, not all 4 of them. LOL And yeah... too much slapstick fighting. The only real serious fighting was between Raph and Casey, Raph and the Foot before he lost, and the fight with the Shredder. Everything else was.... banging a turtle's head on a piano... hitting them with cymbals... stuff like that...

**Jester** · 12-04-2007, 08:28 PM

Well, it was at it's heart a children's movie, but I know as an adult TMNT fan I can look past that and see the character stuff.

Fledermaus · 12-04-2007, 08:53 PM

For a TMNT movie, the first is good.

Is it cinematic greatness?

N. O.

I love TMNT to death but I won't let it blind me to quality. Nice suits and stunts, but that's not enough to warrant cinematic greatness.

Doesn't mean it's not highly enjoyable to us fans, but it is not a great film by a longshot.

I'm speaking from an artistic point of view -- it doesn't do anything profound in the story or the cinematography or the script -- all it is is a feat for puppetry, and a fix for ninja turtles.

*Slap-Happy* · 12-04-2007, 10:45 PM

This movie has taught me many things. But mostly... I learned that it's not that hard to cross two universes that barely have anything in common. But the movies the best of the series. yeah I know some don't agree but i don't understand why this isn't a TMNT fans favorite movie of the series.2 3 & TMNT shall bow down to this movies supieriority over their's. This movie will live on as a fan and cult favorite. No one can change that. The title of this thread says it all. If you don't like the movie DO NOT POST HERE! Us fans of the movie don't wanna here about your "endless whining" OK i'm ranting sorry. just wanna get my opinion out

sorry!

**Jester** · 12-04-2007, 10:56 PM

Actually, I want opinions. If you think it's just a good comic book adaptation or not even that then go ahead and voice your opinion. Who am I to stop your freedom of speech just because I disagree with you on a flipin' movie.

*Spitfire* · 12-04-2007, 11:32 PM

By personal standards I don't consider any turtles movie to be a great piece of cinema. I like them but as far as being GOOD movies I can't call them that.

I don't feel motivated enough to go into more detail.

TheAnimatedSeries · 12-05-2007, 05:44 PM

I do think its a great piece of cinema. Its funny, heartwarming and the characters, despite being turtles, are realistic and believeable and interact in manner which any of us who have brothers can relate too. It is astonishing and it MOVES ME TO TEARS on a regular basis.

Ninja Turtles II, III and TMNT are enjoyable, but are trash in comparison.

*Mr._Mutant_Man* · 12-05-2007, 06:15 PM

It depends on what definition of a great movie you're working with.

It's of course going to pale in comparison to the Citizen Kanes and Gone With the Winds.

But if you're comparing it to other "fun" movies it can hold its own. It may not be as impressive as some other comic movies like Spider-Man or X-Men, but it still stands out as one of the better comic book adaptations, especially considering how much can go wrong when a comic book movie is being made (like making the movie cheesier than the television series was...I'm looking at you Batman and Robin!).

*Mecha Cow* · 12-05-2007, 06:23 PM

It's not exactly a cinematic masterpiece, but it's a decent enough movie in the sense that you don't have to be a hardcore TMNT fan to enjoy it.

The sequels, not so much.

*Mr._Mutant_Man* · 12-05-2007, 06:26 PM

I haven't watched TMNT III in a long time. Fox Family doesn't play it. Maybe it's just that bad.

TMNT II I can stomach for the sake of nostalgia, but if I was watching it for the first time now I'm not sure I would like it as much, with the more cartoony fight scenes and Vanilla Ice.

12-03-2007, 06:13 PM	#1
Jester Rat-faced Dude-guy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 26,298	Steve Barron's TMNT: More than a good comic book movie, but a good movie. Hey all. I pose this question here, but it may color the opinions, heck my own opinion may be a bit biased due to my love of the 1st TMNT movie. The question at hand is: Is the original live action TMNT film more than a great comic book adaptation, but a good movie? I would argue that it is, but again I may be a little biased, but hear me out. I feel there is a subtlety to some of the performances, especially Kevin Clash in the role of Splinter, that makes me believe that TMNT should be taken a little more seriously as a film. I plan to use some video evidence to support this, once I can do so and upload to Youtube. So look for an update with video very soon, illustrating the fact that TMNT is more than just a simple comic book adaptation film. __________________ "Clearly, you're Ninja Turtling incorrectly." - Leo656 Last edited by Jester; 12-03-2007 at 06:22 PM.

12-03-2007, 06:37 PM	#3
Jester Rat-faced Dude-guy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 26,298	Yeah, it's hard to take a movie with anthropomorphic Turtles seriously, but you're right the movie does touch on those themes. I read a section from a book when I was in college. I'm not sure if it was one of the "Turmoil in the Toybox" books or the "Saturday Morning Mind Control" book but one denounced the TMNT for promoting gang involvement (I think it may have been in reference to the show, not the movie,but it referenced the movie as well.) I would have to disagree with that in that the movie does the exact opposite. The true family is lifted up over the gang. I may have to add that clip to my attempt at a video refutation of my point, but in all honesty, who here is going to disagree with us? :p __________________ "Clearly, you're Ninja Turtling incorrectly." - Leo656

12-04-2007, 04:38 AM	#8
TheAnimatedSeries Foot Soldier Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 158	I dont see how the first movie isnt good, especially since they could have just made anything and it would have been a success. Even if you dont pick up on the movies themes, I still cant see it not being a fully entertaining and rewarding movie experience. __________________ ...but thats just one black mans opinion. Whats yours? Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III is better than SOTO and the 2007 movie. You would know that if you were a gangster.

12-04-2007, 08:03 PM	#10
Jester Rat-faced Dude-guy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 26,298	Well here it is, as promised, the video evidence plus my own lame attempt at commentary. Enjoy. Part 1: Part 2: __________________ "Clearly, you're Ninja Turtling incorrectly." - Leo656

12-04-2007, 08:28 PM	#12
Jester Rat-faced Dude-guy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 26,298	Well, it was at it's heart a children's movie, but I know as an adult TMNT fan I can look past that and see the character stuff. __________________ "Clearly, you're Ninja Turtling incorrectly." - Leo656

12-03-2007, 06:30 PM	#2
Kendamu Sewerhead Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 2,890	Well, if films which deal with teenage feelings of abandonment, alienation, loss, depression, coping, and eventual redemption from multiple points-of-view is your style of movie then I'd have to say that TMNT could almost be taken seriously as a film. The only thing that could make it be taken more seriously by the public-at-large (as opposed to us fans) would be if the movie was mostly from Danny's viewpoint with rare, vague, Ninja-like appearances from the Turtles themselves (similar to the Dreamwave comics).

12-03-2007, 06:51 PM	#4
oldmanwinters Overlord Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Between yesterday and tomorrow! Posts: 15,489	I'd say the first movie is above average as far as most movies go. Course, I'm really biased too.

12-03-2007, 07:38 PM	#5
Mr._Mutant_Man Mad Scientist Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,340	As far as something that was geared for the younger crowd, I think it's one of the better ones. It involved goofy characters, but it wasn't dumbed down. Like I think stuff like Pokemon kind of lowers the bar for children's programming, because it's a blatant marketing tool. But the TMNT movie, while certainly part of a kid's franchise, has at least some kind of substance, thanks to being a relatively close adaptation of the comics. You have things such as the darker, kind of grungy atmosphere, you have topics such as anger and families (even if it is a weird family). But yeah, it's harder to take a movie about humanoid turtles seriously. But maybe if they made it a little darker, and there wasn't as much slapstick, it would be taken a little more seriously. But then the movie wouldn't have been a fun blend of the comics and the cartoon.

12-03-2007, 07:39 PM	#6
BigApple3AM Mad Scientist Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Supermarket Aisle Posts: 1,635	Masterpiece.

12-04-2007, 11:52 AM	#9
~~AquaParade~~ Banned Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 8,450	I'd say that the first tmnt movie, is defnitely not to be taken as a joke. Sure, it was maybe a kids movie, but if your gonna classify it as a kids movie, you better give it credit for all the atmosphere and themes you would rarely find in another kids movie. I dont know where I'm really going with this, but it is an easily enjoyable film, and one that would probably change a lot of peoples minds about tmnt if viewed for the first time.

12-04-2007, 08:12 PM	#11
Coola Yagami Overlord Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 15,703	Coulda been taken a lil more seriously if the TMNT weren't shouting out lame-ass slang every five minutes... even having this lil 'slang contest' whenever they did something cool. I know it was closer to the cartoon, but even in the old cartoon Mikey was the one with all the surfer talk, not all 4 of them. LOL And yeah... too much slapstick fighting. The only real serious fighting was between Raph and Casey, Raph and the Foot before he lost, and the fight with the Shredder. Everything else was.... banging a turtle's head on a piano... hitting them with cymbals... stuff like that...

12-04-2007, 08:53 PM	#13
Fledermaus Mad Scientist Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: SoCal Posts: 1,115	For a TMNT movie, the first is good. Is it cinematic greatness? N. O. I love TMNT to death but I won't let it blind me to quality. Nice suits and stunts, but that's not enough to warrant cinematic greatness. Doesn't mean it's not highly enjoyable to us fans, but it is not a great film by a longshot. I'm speaking from an artistic point of view -- it doesn't do anything profound in the story or the cinematography or the script -- all it is is a feat for puppetry, and a fix for ninja turtles. __________________ We're calling it a freeway. Eight lanes of shimmering cement running from here to Pasadena. Smooth, safe, fast. Traffic jams will be a thing of the past. I see a place where people get on and off the freeway. On and off, off and on all day, all night! Soon there will be a string of gas stations, inexpensive motels, restaurants that serve rapidly prepared food! Tire salons, automobile dealerships and wonderful, wonderful billboards reaching as far as the eye can see! My God... It'll be beautiful.

12-04-2007, 10:45 PM	#14
Slap-Happy Bad Boy Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,911	This movie has taught me many things. But mostly... I learned that it's not that hard to cross two universes that barely have anything in common. But the movies the best of the series. yeah I know some don't agree but i don't understand why this isn't a TMNT fans favorite movie of the series.2 3 & TMNT shall bow down to this movies supieriority over their's. This movie will live on as a fan and cult favorite. No one can change that. The title of this thread says it all. If you don't like the movie DO NOT POST HERE! Us fans of the movie don't wanna here about your "endless whining" OK i'm ranting sorry. just wanna get my opinion out sorry!

12-04-2007, 10:56 PM	#15
Jester Rat-faced Dude-guy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 26,298	Actually, I want opinions. If you think it's just a good comic book adaptation or not even that then go ahead and voice your opinion. Who am I to stop your freedom of speech just because I disagree with you on a flipin' movie. __________________ "Clearly, you're Ninja Turtling incorrectly." - Leo656

12-04-2007, 11:32 PM	#16
Spitfire Writer • Director Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 12,035	By personal standards I don't consider any turtles movie to be a great piece of cinema. I like them but as far as being GOOD movies I can't call them that. I don't feel motivated enough to go into more detail. __________________ Check out my online portfolio http://www.christopherpelletier.com/

12-05-2007, 05:44 PM	#17
TheAnimatedSeries Foot Soldier Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 158	I do think its a great piece of cinema. Its funny, heartwarming and the characters, despite being turtles, are realistic and believeable and interact in manner which any of us who have brothers can relate too. It is astonishing and it MOVES ME TO TEARS on a regular basis. Ninja Turtles II, III and TMNT are enjoyable, but are trash in comparison. __________________ ...but thats just one black mans opinion. Whats yours? Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III is better than SOTO and the 2007 movie. You would know that if you were a gangster.

12-05-2007, 06:15 PM	#18
Mr._Mutant_Man Mad Scientist Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,340	It depends on what definition of a great movie you're working with. It's of course going to pale in comparison to the Citizen Kanes and Gone With the Winds. But if you're comparing it to other "fun" movies it can hold its own. It may not be as impressive as some other comic movies like Spider-Man or X-Men, but it still stands out as one of the better comic book adaptations, especially considering how much can go wrong when a comic book movie is being made (like making the movie cheesier than the television series was...I'm looking at you Batman and Robin!).

12-05-2007, 06:23 PM	#19
Mecha Cow Gorgeous and modest too Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 3,699	It's not exactly a cinematic masterpiece, but it's a decent enough movie in the sense that you don't have to be a hardcore TMNT fan to enjoy it. The sequels, not so much. __________________

12-05-2007, 06:26 PM	#20
Mr._Mutant_Man Mad Scientist Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,340	I haven't watched TMNT III in a long time. Fox Family doesn't play it. Maybe it's just that bad. TMNT II I can stomach for the sake of nostalgia, but if I was watching it for the first time now I'm not sure I would like it as much, with the more cartoony fight scenes and Vanilla Ice.