What version did worse?

[billbot85]

Originally Posted by Jephael

Turtle Tunes and We Wish You a Turtle Christmas!

^ This. These were just so bad, even though they were meant for little kids. Let's also not forget Operation Blue Line.

Originally Posted by pferreira

Yeah I believe Turtles Forever was responsible for committing that representation of the FW Turtles which people base their judgement on.

I felt this way too. The Fred Wolf Turtles often get a bad rep due to the over-generalization that the show was too goofy/slapstick. Turtles Forever just pissed me off with their portrayal of them Fred Wolf Turtles, and just making them act like babies. Although I do agree that some of the FW seasons, like 3-5 got really silly at times, I feel that many forget what Season 1 of the show was like, and that it did have a pretty serious tone as far as 80's cartoons go.

[pferreira]

Originally Posted by billbot85

I felt this way too. The Fred Wolf Turtles often get a bad rep due to the over-generalization that the show was too goofy/slapstick. Turtles Forever just pissed me off with their portrayal of them Fred Wolf Turtles, and just making them act like babies. Although I do agree that some of the FW seasons, like 3-5 got really silly at times, I feel that many forget what Season 1 of the show was like, and that it did have a pretty serious tone as far as 80's cartoons go.

I totally agree. The FW Turtles never tried to be goofy, that's a mistake the 4Kids show made with Mikey as well. They made him act intentionally goofy on purpose in order to generate humour...and...it never really worked. Depends what you can or can't tolerate I guess.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by billbot85

I feel that many forget what Season 1 of the show was like, and that it did have a pretty serious tone as far as 80's cartoons go.

Season 1 is the first 5 episodes of 194, when you're done with season 1 it's 165 episodes of goofiness with the last 24 returning to a somewhat more serious tone.

You can't pretend season 1 represents the show as a whole. Even when put to gether with the last 3 seasons as the "serious ones", it just makes up 15% of the series.

[CyberCubed]

People need to make the distinction, the original toons plots/stories were goofy, and so were the villains. But the Turtles took themselves seriously.

Of course there were also times where Shredder was more competent than others, but that has to do with different writers. Sometimes Shredder could be beaten by having a pizza thrown at his face, other times the Turtles struggled to take him down in a fair fight.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

People need to make the distinction, the original toons plots/stories were goofy, and so were the villains. But the Turtles took themselves seriously.

Of course there were also times where Shredder was more competent than others, but that has to do with different writers. Sometimes Shredder could be beaten by having a pizza thrown at his face, other times the Turtles struggled to take him down in a fair fight.

Didn't the Turtles break the fourth wall more than Deadpool and fight with random items lying around for comedic effect?

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by neatoman

Didn't the Turtles break the fourth wall more than Deadpool and fight with random items lying around for comedic effect?

Not to the extent you're implying.

[plastroncafe]

There was an extent implied in that? Looked more like a Yes or No question to me.

Look, I get it: No one likes to have their fave knocked down a couple of pegs, but the implication that Turtles Forever some how besmirched the honor of the Wolf cartoon is just...nonsense.

The Wolf cartoon did that itself.

My favorite episode is the Cufflink Caper.
Babyface the Beaver Cleaver? Henchman Wally?
The fact that a high explosive was turned into men's formal wear that was hidden in a pizza maker's house?

That's goofy.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

People need to make the distinction, the original toons plots/stories were goofy, and so were the villains. But the Turtles took themselves seriously.

No, I don't. Using one of these a lot around memory lane lately?

[1987]

Originally Posted by Autbot_Benz

Fred Wolf & Next Mutation

Fred Wolf made everyone a bumbling Idiot and was just too goofy.I like my turtles a bit serious with a bit of humor sometimes.

Next Mutation was just Blah

total bs. were you one of the writers behind "turtles forever"?

im tired of people being ignorant and judging the fred wolf series based on their ridiculous representation in "turtles forever" which was a mockery done by 4kids. ok so bebop&rocksteady were portrayed as incompetent and idiotic yea i get that, it was part of their gimmick. but "turtles forever" portrayed everyone in the series that way.

the nick series is the stupid one. c'mon, its a nicktoon! mikey and donny are really stupid in the nick series, mikey looks like an infant and is obnoxious and makes fart jokes and his voice is annoying and hes a midget compare to the other turtles. and donny, the gap in his teeth makes him look soooooo stupid! raph and leo are ateast somewhat decent. though its hard to take leo seriously knowing he's the "pie guy". so this version did worse.

if the fred wolf series lost it's serious tone after season 1 it can be blamed on europe's banning of the word "ninja" and nunchucks, which ruined it for the rest of us too.

either way the fred wolf series is the BEST tmnt cartoon period. the most memorable. the logo is still iconic to this day. the ot is even more successful than the mirage comics. mirage fans who bash the fred wolf series are just mad that it gets more attention nick and 4kids will be forgotten, but the fred wolf series will always be remembered.

[Mew]

Originally Posted by 1987

the nick series is the stupid one. c'mon, its a nicktoon! mikey and donny are really stupid in the nick series, mikey looks like an infant and is obnoxious and makes fart jokes and his voice is annoying and hes a midget compare to the other turtles. and donny, the gap in his teeth makes him look soooooo stupid! raph and leo are ateast somewhat decent. though its hard to take leo seriously knowing he's the "pie guy". so this version did worse.

You're a Nick hater? Nice to know.

[Ninturtle]

Originally Posted by 1987

total bs. were you one of the writers behind "turtles forever"?

im tired of people being ignorant and judging the fred wolf series based on their ridiculous representation in "turtles forever" which was a mockery done by 4kids. ok so bebop&rocksteady were portrayed as incompetent and idiotic yea i get that, it was part of their gimmick. but "turtles forever" portrayed everyone in the series that way.

the nick series is the stupid one. c'mon, its a nicktoon! mikey and donny are really stupid in the nick series, mikey looks like an infant and is obnoxious and makes fart jokes and his voice is annoying and hes a midget compare to the other turtles. and donny, the gap in his teeth makes him look soooooo stupid! raph and leo are ateast somewhat decent. though its hard to take leo seriously knowing he's the "pie guy". so this version did worse.

if the fred wolf series lost it's serious tone after season 1 it can be blamed on europe's banning of the word "ninja" and nunchucks, which ruined it for the rest of us too.

either way the fred wolf series is the BEST tmnt cartoon period. the most memorable. the logo is still iconic to this day. the ot is even more successful than the mirage comics. mirage fans who bash the fred wolf series are just mad that it gets more attention nick and 4kids will be forgotten, but the fred wolf series will always be remembered.

The Fred Wolf show isn't the best cartoon. It rarely ever had a running story and most episodes are meh compared to the Nick and 4 kids show. At least those shows have a running plot. Just because a show is more successful doesn't mean it's better, I can't tell you how many times I've heard people who grew up with the 87 cartoon re watch it and realized how the show wasn't all that good.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by 1987

im tired of people being ignorant

Way to continue the trend, sleepy.

[Ninturtle]

Originally Posted by Powder

Way to continue the trend, sleepy.

I love irony sometimes.

[GoldMutant]

Worst of all: Probably got skipped over at the beginning of the thread, but the Coming Out of Our Shells Tour has got to be the worst thing of the Ninja Turtles. The costumes are some of the worst to grace the franchise, a majority of the songs are intolerable to listen to, and it's overall just a disgusting waste of time. Essentially, any spin off such as the Christmas special, Operation: Blue Line, and the Turtle Tunes. Heaven forbid they actually do a musical of all things during that time frame.

Otherwise, Turtles 3 for the movies.

Also, I just want to say that though I'm not a fan of the Fred Wolf series, I do respect it for putting the franchise into motion. I really enjoyed the Red Sky seasons and do enjoy the cast and wacky adventures, even if a little too goofy for me personally at times. Each show I feel should be looked at differently as their own and not be compared.

[billbot85]

Originally Posted by neatoman

Season 1 is the first 5 episodes of 194, when you're done with season 1 it's 165 episodes of goofiness with the last 24 returning to a somewhat more serious tone.

You can't pretend season 1 represents the show as a whole. Even when put to gether with the last 3 seasons as the "serious ones", it just makes up 15% of the series.

Never said that Season 1 represents the show as a whole, just saying that it was a great first season to kick off the series. My point is that the FW series doesn't deserve the amount of criticism that it often gets. Seasons 1 and 2 had a lot of great moments. And yes, seasons 3-6 and the European Vacation got really goofy and ridiculous most of the time. There are plenty of episodes in Season 5 alone that I can't stand ("Raphael Vs. the Volcano" among others).

Still, I think all the goofiness was just part of the charm of the FW cartoon that a lot of us enjoyed as kids. I absolutely love all of the dark moments of TMNT in the 2k3 series, Nick series, Mirage, and the 1990 movie. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't like some of the goofy moments in the FW series, it's just a guilty pleasure.

If Turtle Toons and We Wish You a Turtle Christmas don't count as any part of the series, then I'd say it's Turtles III that's considered the worst for me.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by Ninturtle

The Fred Wolf show isn't the best cartoon. It rarely ever had a running story and most episodes are meh compared to the Nick and 4 kids show. At least those shows have a running plot. Just because a show is more successful doesn't mean it's better, I can't tell you how many times I've heard people who grew up with the 87 cartoon re watch it and realized how the show wasn't all that good.

It was the 80s. The 90s seemed to start doing ongoing story arcs and stuff with their animated shows and you have to take syndication into consideration too. It had to be set up so that viewers could start watching at any point and understand what's going on...so that's not really the show's fault, but more so the time, even though it carried over into the 90s for this particular series. Of course now, the show wouldn't be considered good since ongoing stories are now the norm and people have easier access to catch up on what they missed. Back then, we were just glad to see the show and if you missed an ep, no problem. No ongoing story other than Krang and Shredder causing trouble trying to free the Technodrome.

So yeah, I feel it's unfair to compare the ongoing story thing, given that practically everything was done in that way at the time...especially shows that were syndicated or started off in syndication.

[pferreira]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

It was the 80s. The 90s seemed to start doing ongoing story arcs and stuff with their animated shows and you have to take syndication into consideration too. It had to be set up so that viewers could start watching at any point and understand what's going on...so that's not really the show's fault, but more so the time, even though it carried over into the 90s for this particular series. Of course now, the show wouldn't be considered good since ongoing stories are now the norm and people have easier access to catch up on what they missed. Back then, we were just glad to see the show and if you missed an ep, no problem. No ongoing story other than Krang and Shredder causing trouble trying to free the Technodrome.

So yeah, I feel it's unfair to compare the ongoing story thing, given that practically everything was done in that way at the time...especially shows that were syndicated or started off in syndication.

Plus the Fred Wolf cartoon has something the 4Kids and Nick version doesn't have...it's fun! Maybe that's why it's the most successful version. It's like the old argument that people have about the old Battlestar Galactica being better than the remake. You can add as much serialization and realism as you like but if you suck all the fun out of it are you still going to be watching it years to come?

[Ceres]

Originally Posted by pferreira

Plus the Fred Wolf cartoon has something the 4Kids and Nick version doesn't have...it's fun! Maybe that's why it's the most successful version. It's like the old argument that people have about the old Battlestar Galactica being better than the remake. You can add as much serialization and realism as you like but if you suck all the fun out of it are you still going to be watching it years to come?

Just have to agree with this. The humour and goofyness were the good things that made the FW Cartoon much more enjoyable as the Nick one currently.

[plastroncafe]

When the Nick Version is on its game? It is fun. I'd go so far as to say more fun than the FW version, because it's got better production values on its side.

Time will tell if the cg animation weathers well, but it's leaps and bounds better than the Wolf animation, which hasn't aged well at all.

[Netkeeper]

I personally feel 2k12 is worse than 87. I'd much rather watch 87 if given the choice.