I have good news and/or bad news.

[nimrod]

Originally Posted by FlawedCoil82

Actually I wouldn't have complained in the least if X-Men stayed the same as they were back in the 90's. There are dozens of stories I would have loved to see take places featuring the 90's X-Men but they never happened. Once Wolverine lost his adamantium in #25, X-Men was on a downward fall from that point on. I loved X-Men Adventures the best (even though it was the cartoon) only because it featured the X-Men the way that I loved them the best (until the artwork went to hell in the middle of the 3rd season). But X-Men were much more popular in the 90's because Marvel had a perfect team. Then they decided to screw themselves by doing the Age Of Apocalypse storyline and after that X-Men never recovered. Onslaught was decent but "feral" Wolverine looked ridiculous. Then when the movies came out they went to the boring black costumes...I didnt even bother buying those. Then they tried to redeem themselves with #156 onward but Rogue losing her super strength and flying ability sucked bad. But as long as she was in her normal green and yellow uniform I didn't complain, but (as Marvel always does) they decided to screw themselves over again and move her back out of that costume and put her in that ridiculous boring hooded green robe again. So I am tired of all the changes Marvel keeps making to X-Men. I either want the normal, PERFECT X-Men team back (Wolverine, Professor X, Rogue, Storm, Beast, Gambit, Jean Grey, Archangel, Iceman, Colossus, Psylocke, Cyclops, Jubilee, etc.) or else I couldn't care less where the X-Men go from here. The same for TMNT. I either want back the ones where they used real martial arts weapons (2003) or I'd rather have no TMNT at all.
Jack

The issues of X-Men with the black costumes from (I think) 116 to 154 was Grant Morrisons run. While it was completely diffferent than any standard X-Men type stuff, the writing and stories came together very well. You should give it a chance and you might be surprised. As for the stories since then, they have gone back to the more standard costumes (with some even going further back like Rogues). Most of the newer stories are faily bland though (I am enjoying the current Rise and Fall of the Shiar story though).

Anyways, as for the comparisons with the 2 X-Men series and the TMNT 2K3 and FF:
The 90s X-Men cartoon and X-Men Evolution where both good in their own ways. I will always be partial to the 90s toon because that's what I grew up with and I loved all the comic adaptations. Evolution still was done pretty well and was some nice fresh material.
FF compared to the 2k3 TMNT series however is no comparison even though some of the episodes I've really enjoyed.

Sorry for ranting but I'm also an X-Men buff.

[X]

Well I have said it before and will say it again, their are bad things people pick out about FF that may be there for a reason. Take for example, a poster who said that FF watered down the Turtles. Imagine you were a TMNT. Ok, so you've lived your life in the shadows (for the entire duration of their existance in comics and cartoons.) Now you're bunked up in a dank sewer, having to sneak out topside, or only go out when bad things happen (cliched in any form.) Now imagine you're in a place where you are not stereotyped? What would you do? Would you forget yourself, and everything you learned and mellow out, and adapt to the scenario?

If you were to go to your job one day, and saw your bosses jumping on desks, throwing footballs throughout the building, and they told you to lighten up, would you? Or would you remain a sourpuss who abides by the book? To me, the Turtles owe it to themselves to slack off. Like it or not, things needed to change, and I think that's what I love so much about FF that anytime I watch 2k3 on DVD, I end up going straight to number 386, and 387 in my 400 disc DVD player. Those two slots being FF vol. 1 discs 1 and 2. It gets seriously old after awhile. Same old **** just a different day as DMX would put it. Wake up in sewer, go to bed in sewer, fight bad guys throughout the day (which they do in FF,) make sure you stay hidden, always get the same lecture from the same rat, the crap gets very old.

FF remedied that. They get to slack off. The rat isn't such a bitchy fool, and let the sun shine on his butt for once, his lectures were getting tired, famous ninja said this, famous ninja said that, the world won't understand you - *slaps Splinter crosseyed* "HEARD IT BEFORE!" Now they get to live how normal people would. Raph gets to sit amongst a wrestling match, Mikey gets to visit a trveling museum of 20th century culture, and gets so giddy you'd think he's about to have a nosebleed. Sometimes I look at FF after multiple viewings and find it holds my interest more then 2K3 was. Sure 2K3 has some awesome stories, but when are the Turtles going to lose? Why do they always have to win, or win in time? That's where stuff gets watered down, when everything is so cliche.

If I ever write a cartoon, which I am in the process of doing, I actually have it so one of the members of the team I am putting together, actually *GASP* dies. Yes, it isn't bad to make someone care for something and take it away. You can't win them all. Ok I'm rambling there. Point blank, FF is a fresh breath of air, and a good relaxer for what I hope is more 2k3 episodes. Had 2k3 aired this season, I would've gotten bored with the same old crap. Turtles win, Karai whines, Bishop continues to sound like a queer who frequents the Blue Oyster Bar from Police Academy (even though Bishop is more badass then Shredder,) Stockman wishing he could die but whines, and Hun, HA! OH CRUD! How many times does he have to use that? That's what I would've thought had 2k3 aired this season. With FF giving something different, I want 2k3 back, knowing I got to see what the otherside of the road can be like.

-X-

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by X

If you were to go to your job one day, and saw your bosses jumping on desks, throwing footballs throughout the building, and they told you to lighten up, would you? Or would you remain a sourpuss who abides by the book? To me, the Turtles owe it to themselves to slack off. Like it or not, things needed to change, and I think that's what I love so much about FF that anytime I watch 2k3 on DVD, I end up going straight to number 386, and 387 in my 400 disc DVD player. Those two slots being FF vol. 1 discs 1 and 2. It gets seriously old after awhile. Same old **** just a different day as DMX would put it. Wake up in sewer, go to bed in sewer, fight bad guys throughout the day (which they do in FF,) make sure you stay hidden, always get the same lecture from the same rat, the crap gets very old.

...Errrm...to YOU perhaps, but not to anyone else. Don't like it, switch the heck off.

[VaughnMichael]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

...Errrm...to YOU perhaps, but not to anyone else. Don't like it, switch the heck off.

I really agree and why would anyone complain about that it's not like it's anything new it's been happening from the very start of tv tmnt.
It happend in the comics, it happend in the 80's-90's, it happend in 2k3, and now FF, And I'm sure all the same stuff is bound to happen when the next show comes along also.

[tOkKa]

-->> ..guess i am kinda scared..

[Kunoichi_Haruko]

Originally Posted by Ratchet

You might joke, but I'm serious. I think too many people get wound up in the TV series. The comics have always had just as good, if not better story arcs and they're geared towards the general demographic that visits this board. Even the stories the cartoons are based on are better in the comics. Everyone complains about how FF kiddified the Turtles, but it's a cartoon show aimed at a particular demographic. Our age group has the comics, which are floundering in sales because we all get too wound up in a TV show!

I agree that for the most part, the comics indeed have better stories. However, I'm going to have to disagree about the reason why the comics are failing. It's not that we are too wrapped up in the TV shows, it's just that TV shows are just more accessible. Do you know how many people here complain of the comic shops not bothering to even carry the comics anymore? Quite a few. Also, not everyone is a comicbook reader. And to the casual viewer of the show, they may think the cartoon IS all there is to the franchise. I'll be honest with you, before I found this site, I didn't know that there were comics, and I certainly didn't know they were still being printed. All I had to go on was a cartoon. Maybe the comics would do better if there was a better way to let the general public know they still exist.

[tOkKa]

Originally Posted by Kunoichi_Haruko

I agree that for the most part, the comics indeed have better stories. However, I'm going to have to disagree about the reason why the comics are failing. It's not that we are too wrapped up in the TV shows, it's just that TV shows are just more accessible. Do you know how many people here complain of the comic shops not bothering to even carry the comics anymore? Quite a few. Also, not everyone is a comicbook reader. And to the casual viewer of the show, they may think the cartoon IS all there is to the franchise. I'll be honest with you, before I found this site, I didn't know that there were comics, and I certainly didn't know they were still being printed. All I had to go on was a cartoon. Maybe the comics would do better if there was a better way to let the general public know they still exist.

-->> ..well isn't the comic industry as a whole.. a very shakey enterprise within' itself..

.. how many factors is everyone waging ??

.. Turtles is Global .. everywhere ..

..10 x more accessible in places like India than it was say even 10 years ago..

.. i'm so confused by all this..

too many variables.. too too many ..

..my head is spinnin' again ..

[Sparvid]

Originally Posted by Ratchet

Okay, what if nothing changed? What if it was all exactly the same as it was back in the 90's? Just think about that. What if the last 15 years of X-Continuity had all been based around the 90's Xmen and didn't change? Or hang on, how about if Gwen Stacy wasn't killed in Spider-man, or if they never decided to give Spidey the black costume? What if Shadow was never brought into the Turtles? What if House of M never happened? You see a pattern forming? Repetition is a tiresome thing, and without change, stories and characters can't progress. You might not like it, but that's not saying everyone else thinks the same way, and clearly they don't otherwise they wouldn't've changed. It's like people blowing chunks when Spidey unmasked, the story opportunities expand immensely when you do something like that, but fans don't ever seem to see that.

If nothing changed, there would be five X-Men, going to school at Xavier's mansion...

[The Shelf]

Originally Posted by Sparvid

If nothing changed, there would be five X-Men, going to school at Xavier's mansion...

And I think we can all agree that would be a terrible thing.

[iris]

Originally Posted by Kunoichi_Haruko

Maybe the comics would do better if there was a better way to let the general public know they still exist.

Well, that's a given. Mirage has no marketing other than the website and word of mouth, so increasing publicity would increase demand at least to some extent. My marketing company actually focuses on stuff like that for small studios and indie artists. But like Tokka said, the most of the comic industry is halfway onto the backburner. (The puppies are very expressive, btw, tokka. lol )

[VaughnMichael]

ok can you guys seriously take the x-men talk to another thread...

[NoPressApril]

Originally Posted by X

Well I have said it before and will say it again, their are bad things people pick out about FF that may be there for a reason. Take for example, a poster who said that FF watered down the Turtles. Imagine you were a TMNT. Ok, so you've lived your life in the shadows (for the entire duration of their existance in comics and cartoons.) Now you're bunked up in a dank sewer, having to sneak out topside, or only go out when bad things happen (cliched in any form.) Now imagine you're in a place where you are not stereotyped? What would you do? Would you forget yourself, and everything you learned and mellow out, and adapt to the scenario?
Bishop continues to sound like a queer who frequents the Blue Oyster Bar from Police Academy

-X-

I don't know what I would do in a place that I wasn't stereotyped but dude if your gonna use big ole original terms like queer ya don't need to be preaching about sterotypes. Thanks.

[X]

Actually I got the whole idea of Bishop being gay from a friend who watches the episodes as I record them each week. He thinks Bishop sounds like a homo. We laugh about it at times, he'll start talking like Bishop but say fruity stuff homosexuals would say, as if he's talking to the Turtles. So I would guess he's actually stereotyping.

I used to go fagbashing when I was younger with some friends, but hey, everyone was young and stupid at one point in time. Being 28 you kinda look back at the dumb stuff you do, and laugh, or regret your actions. So back then I stereotyped, but now I'm just quoting my friend. I think Bishop kicks ass even though my friend has a point about his voice.

Actually I did think of the Police Academy (any Blue Oyster scene,) films when making that post, so maybe I did stereotype a bit. However, my point is, the Turtles aren't labled freaks by the outside world, because the outside world is a mix of everything in 2105. So they for once, aren't going to be stereotyped. As for the real world, everyone will be stereotyped. Heck I even stereotype myself at times for fun.

-X-

[VaughnMichael]

Originally Posted by X

Actually I got the whole idea of Bishop being gay from a friend who watches the episodes as I record them each week. He thinks Bishop sounds like a homo. We laugh about it at times, he'll start talking like Bishop but say fruity stuff homosexuals would say, as if he's talking to the Turtles. So I would guess he's actually stereotyping.

I used to go fagbashing when I was younger with some friends, but hey, everyone was young and stupid at one point in time. Being 28 you kinda look back at the dumb stuff you do, and laugh, or regret your actions. So back then I stereotyped, but now I'm just quoting my friend. I think Bishop kicks ass even though my friend has a point about his voice.

Actually I did think of the Police Academy (any Blue Oyster scene,) films when making that post, so maybe I did stereotype a bit. However, my point is, the Turtles aren't labled freaks by the outside world, because the outside world is a mix of everything in 2105. So they for once, aren't going to be stereotyped. As for the real world, everyone will be stereotyped. Heck I even stereotype myself at times for fun.

-X-

I'm sorta looking now right here at this post and seeing the dumbs tuff you're doing now...

[NoPressApril]

Originally Posted by X

Actually I got the whole idea of Bishop being gay from a friend who watches the episodes as I record them each week. He thinks Bishop sounds like a homo. We laugh about it at times, he'll start talking like Bishop but say fruity stuff homosexuals would say, as if he's talking to the Turtles. So I would guess he's actually stereotyping.

I used to go fagbashing when I was younger with some friends, but hey, everyone was young and stupid at one point in time. Being 28 you kinda look back at the dumb stuff you do, and laugh, or regret your actions. So back then I stereotyped, but now I'm just quoting my friend. I think Bishop kicks ass even though my friend has a point about his voice.

Actually I did think of the Police Academy (any Blue Oyster scene,) films when making that post, so maybe I did stereotype a bit. However, my point is, the Turtles aren't labled freaks by the outside world, because the outside world is a mix of everything in 2105. So they for once, aren't going to be stereotyped. As for the real world, everyone will be stereotyped. Heck I even stereotype myself at times for fun.

-X-

Yeah i'm stereotyping you a little bit myself right now. I'm seeing a mix between one of those banjo playing possums from Tiny Toon Adventures and Corky from Life Goes On and i'll "laugh about that from time to time" how you durrin. I'm glad to hear that you can look back at your "young and stupid" days but from the things that you say here you must not have to look too far back to find the latter. Oh and as far as your quotable little friend is concerned, the only point he's ever going to have is the one that he gets while watching wrestling, the one that he covers up with a throw pillow while running to the bathroom. How you durrin.

[CyberCubed]

Isn't it great to see what this thread has turned into?

We went from news about FF ending, to random conspiracy theories, to the show becoming more like the movie, to Murphy coming here and setting things straight, to talk about X-men cartoons, and now we're talking about stereotypes and hated-filled posts.

Makes you wonder what Murphy thinks if he ever comes back to this thread.

[VaughnMichael]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Isn't it great to see what this thread has turned into?

We went from news about FF ending, to random conspiracy theories, to the show becoming more like the movie, to Murphy coming here and setting things straight, to talk about X-men cartoons, and now we're talking about stereotypes and hated-filled posts.

Makes you wonder what Murphy thinks if he ever comes back to this thread.

I asked Murphy to come here, I've asked people to stop the moronic bashing poor choice of word posts as well as the x-men ones. I must be on ignore or something but maybe I should just start typing in all caps.
Maybe then People will notice..

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Isn't it great to see what this thread has turned into?

We went from news about FF ending, to random conspiracy theories, to the show becoming more like the movie, to Murphy coming here and setting things straight, to talk about X-men cartoons, and now we're talking about stereotypes and hated-filled posts.

Makes you wonder what Murphy thinks if he ever comes back to this thread.

Welcome to the Drome leave your common sense at the door.

[Sunshine]

I hate to break all this up by doing a silly thing like getting back on topic *gasp* but yeah I didn't really like FF at first and I agree that 2k3 was better but I wouldn't want it to end without closure. If/when FF ends I hope they make the smart/better choice and send the boys home. I also hope that they continue the story when they get back to their own time. I love the turtles and even though I don't have a tv I still watch everything I can get my hands on. I'd hate to see it end and have to wait years for another series like we had to do between the old show and 2k3. I still haven't seen the movie but I am pretty sure we'll be getting it the day it comes out on dvd. And I'd love to see it get a sequel. Beyond that I don't really want to fan the "what if" flames. It'd be nice if things were more certain but since they aren't not much we can do but sit back, wait, hope, and continue tossing feedback at the people in charge whenever we can. ^_^

[X]

Hey I have no probs with people stereotyping me, I gave up caring about names people called me, or any type of bashing when I was in the sixth grade brother.

I love the banjo playing part that was actually awesome. When a friend of mine who I talk to online asked to see what my camaro looked like, and I showed him, he said, "nice dirt." Meaning since I live in Oklahoma City, it must be filled with rednecks and cow slappin hicks, and nothing but dirt roads. It's to be expected, thank god I don't sound like I have a southern accent.

Here's that pic. http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a3...1/IMGP0170.jpg

Gotta love our "dirt roads eh"

Look honestly, I was just posting to post. Offer my advice and opinions, and to converse, which I suppose the last couple of posts against me being slightly negative is in the same light, don't look for me to come back with some witty arguement. I don't do internet fighting, or act - what is the internet term - Emo? However, me stating that the Turtles aren't stereotyped in regards to the topic at hand, is totally on point with my opinions based on this topic. I guess people think I am contradicting myself in some form, even though I am talking about stereotyping in a cartoon and never mentioned the real world. Well until someone (forgot who above,) brought it to real world level, which is when I mentioned my days as a young punk.

Again though, your opinion is your own, can't deny you your freedom of speech, and I think it's kind of awesome when everyone thinks the south (specially OKC,) is full of cowboys and rodeos, when really we have some of the best damn nightclubs this side of Corpus Christi.

To stay on topic, I wouldn't mind the changes FF implimented if they get back (i.e. everything isn't so cliched, and they wouldn't be afraid of having more filler episodes, and a lighter tone.)

EDIT: OH SNAPS! Forgot Corpus is down south (way down.) Doh!

-X-