What type of ninjitsu/ninjutsu do the TMNT practice?

trexmaster · 09-23-2005, 09:22 PM

It's certainly a unique brand. For example, in the new toon's episode "Darkness on the Edge of Town", Leo and Splinter disguise the values of Bushido. However, ninja practiced Ninpo, not Bushido.

Looking at Splinter's meditation room, there's also a mix of religions. Splinter has both a Taoist "Yin 'n Yang" design and a rock design with Zen Buddhist influence. Splinter is mixing Taoism and Buddhism!

What kind of ninjitsu (or is it "ninjutsu"?) are our beloved Turtles practicing, anyway?

*Buslady* · 09-23-2005, 10:41 PM

it's a new style... CheloniDo... way of the turtle
hahaha just kidding.

*Tetsu Deinonychus* · 09-24-2005, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trexmaster

It's certainly a unique brand. For example, in the new toon's episode "Darkness on the Edge of Town", Leo and Splinter disguise the values of Bushido. However, ninja practiced Ninpo, not Bushido.

Yeah, they screwed up there. Heretic has pointed that out alot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by trexmaster

Looking at Splinter's meditation room, there's also a mix of religions. Splinter has both a Taoist "Yin 'n Yang" design and a rock design with Zen Buddhist influence. Splinter is mixing Taoism and Buddhism!

Zen Buddhism IS a mixture of Buddhism and Taoism. Also, it's not uncommon in Japan to be multi-religious. Most Japanese are both Shintô and Zen Buddhist.

Quote:

Originally Posted by trexmaster

What kind of ninjitsu (or is it "ninjutsu"?) are our beloved Turtles practicing, anyway?

I would say "B-movie" Ninjutsu since their Martial Arts seem to be more of an homage to old Kung-fu movies than actual Ninpo. And yeah, It's Ninjutsu.

Good Thread.

Vincent · 09-25-2005, 10:40 AM

They practice Fictional Ninjutsu.
Real ninjas were spies. Not martial artists (only some of them). And they did not use nunchakus.

Leonardo_ · 09-25-2005, 04:19 PM

I agree with you, Vincent, about fictional ninjutsu.
But even ninjas are material artists and in some classes they use chucks, too.
In a few countrys they are forbidden like here in germany, so we don't train with them, but this doesn't mean that we are no material artists.

*heretic888* · 10-26-2005, 08:40 PM

Oy vey.

Whatta mess...

1) The dichotomy between ninpo and bushido is not as clear-cut as many would have you believe, especially during the Tokugawa shogunate's Edo Jidai. In the second volume of his Bansenshukai, Fujibayashi Yasutake discusses the significance of seishin and the meaning of the character shinobi (which is also pronounced nin during the 19th century onward). In his essay, Fujibayashi expounds many virtues and moral qualities that are later associated with bushido --- "When there is no Faith in Loyalty, or Virtue, or Chivalry, Loyalty is no more, Virtue is no more, and Chivalry is no more."

2) As others have pointed out, the Japanese are known for their religious syncretism. As such, Splinter drawing symbolism from many religious traditions is not all that surprising. Historically, ninpo seems to have drawn most stronly on elements from the Amatsu Tatara tradition of Shinto and Mikkyo Buddhism (a la the Tendai-shu and Shingon-shu). Togakure Ryu in particular is known for its connections to shugendo.

3) The proper transliteration of the word into English is ninjutsu.

4) To claim the historical shinobi no mono were not 'martial artists' is, in my opinion, a quite curious position. Methinks somebody might want to research a bit on the Iga and Koga warriors' battles with shogun Ashikaga Yoshihisa's troops in the 1480's and Oda Nobuo's troops in the 1580's. They were famous for their skill in guerilla warfare and commando tactics. I also find it curious that, since the 'ninja' were non-combatants, that the historical ninjutsu treatise called the Shoninki advises its audience to carry "a long wakizashi" during covert operations.

5) The Japanese shinobi no mono did not use the Okinawan nunchaku, it is true. However, there are variations on the manrikigusari that are extremely nunchaku-esque in design --- albeit with a slightly longer chain than you see in most nunchaku.

6) By any account, the TMNT in the new animated series practice a highly dramatized and fantastical version of ninjutsu. The Mirage TMNT, at least during the early Eastman & Laird days, seemed to have stayed much truer to authentic ninpo (more than once I saw the TMNT assume what looked like an ichimonji no kamae).

Hope that clears some things up. Laterz.

*Tetsu Deinonychus* · 10-27-2005, 12:57 AM

Heretic, I have SO been waiting for you to post in this thread.

BTW I used to be Tetsu.

*heretic888* · 11-12-2005, 01:20 PM

09-23-2005, 09:22 PM	#1
trexmaster Thug Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 55	What type of ninjitsu/ninjutsu do the TMNT practice? It's certainly a unique brand. For example, in the new toon's episode "Darkness on the Edge of Town", Leo and Splinter disguise the values of Bushido. However, ninja practiced Ninpo, not Bushido. Looking at Splinter's meditation room, there's also a mix of religions. Splinter has both a Taoist "Yin 'n Yang" design and a rock design with Zen Buddhist influence. Splinter is mixing Taoism and Buddhism! What kind of ninjitsu (or is it "ninjutsu"?) are our beloved Turtles practicing, anyway?

09-23-2005, 10:41 PM	#2
Buslady WingsOfDarkness! Perkele! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: In 7803... Posts: 4,366	it's a new style... CheloniDo... way of the turtle hahaha just kidding. __________________

09-25-2005, 10:40 AM	#4
Vincent Hench Mutant Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 293	They practice Fictional Ninjutsu. Real ninjas were spies. Not martial artists (only some of them). And they did not use nunchakus. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHorFa22x3Q Hey, if Vanilla Ice and Partners in Kryme can do it, so can I.

09-25-2005, 04:19 PM	#5
Leonardo_ Stone Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 813	I agree with you, Vincent, about fictional ninjutsu. But even ninjas are material artists and in some classes they use chucks, too. In a few countrys they are forbidden like here in germany, so we don't train with them, but this doesn't mean that we are no material artists. __________________

10-26-2005, 08:40 PM	#6
heretic888 Foot Elite Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,344	Oy vey. Whatta mess... 1) The dichotomy between ninpo and bushido is not as clear-cut as many would have you believe, especially during the Tokugawa shogunate's Edo Jidai. In the second volume of his Bansenshukai, Fujibayashi Yasutake discusses the significance of seishin and the meaning of the character shinobi (which is also pronounced nin during the 19th century onward). In his essay, Fujibayashi expounds many virtues and moral qualities that are later associated with bushido --- "When there is no Faith in Loyalty, or Virtue, or Chivalry, Loyalty is no more, Virtue is no more, and Chivalry is no more." 2) As others have pointed out, the Japanese are known for their religious syncretism. As such, Splinter drawing symbolism from many religious traditions is not all that surprising. Historically, ninpo seems to have drawn most stronly on elements from the Amatsu Tatara tradition of Shinto and Mikkyo Buddhism (a la the Tendai-shu and Shingon-shu). Togakure Ryu in particular is known for its connections to shugendo. 3) The proper transliteration of the word into English is ninjutsu. 4) To claim the historical shinobi no mono were not 'martial artists' is, in my opinion, a quite curious position. Methinks somebody might want to research a bit on the Iga and Koga warriors' battles with shogun Ashikaga Yoshihisa's troops in the 1480's and Oda Nobuo's troops in the 1580's. They were famous for their skill in guerilla warfare and commando tactics. I also find it curious that, since the 'ninja' were non-combatants, that the historical ninjutsu treatise called the Shoninki advises its audience to carry "a long wakizashi" during covert operations. 5) The Japanese shinobi no mono did not use the Okinawan nunchaku, it is true. However, there are variations on the manrikigusari that are extremely nunchaku-esque in design --- albeit with a slightly longer chain than you see in most nunchaku. 6) By any account, the TMNT in the new animated series practice a highly dramatized and fantastical version of ninjutsu. The Mirage TMNT, at least during the early Eastman & Laird days, seemed to have stayed much truer to authentic ninpo (more than once I saw the TMNT assume what looked like an ichimonji no kamae). Hope that clears some things up. Laterz. __________________ "Ninpo began as training to become a moral people and to learn to endure in whatever social condition one is in; to know and accept one's fate, and to live for human beings and all other creatures. The person who masters all of these is a Ninja." (Masaaki Hatsumi)

10-27-2005, 12:57 AM	#7
Tetsu Deinonychus The Iron Dinosaur Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Studio Snowlion HQ Posts: 3,021	Heretic, I have SO been waiting for you to post in this thread. BTW I used to be Tetsu. __________________ (Image hosting by Postimage.org) And here's a list of all my old wacky threads!

11-12-2005, 01:20 PM	#8
heretic888 Foot Elite Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,344	__________________ "Ninpo began as training to become a moral people and to learn to endure in whatever social condition one is in; to know and accept one's fate, and to live for human beings and all other creatures. The person who masters all of these is a Ninja." (Masaaki Hatsumi)