Freakishly ugly good guys

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-14-2006, 02:05 AM

You don't see a lot of freakishly ugly good guys in movies, do you? Y'know, like deformed people. I guess a lot of it's because someone who's deformed prolly doesn't get the inclination to be good as often as they do to lash out.

Still, I saw Harry Potter 4 or whatever and was hoping that the dude with the eyepatch would turn out to be good. No such luck.

I mean, there'll always be your Hunchback of Notre Dames and your Bad Santas but I feel like it's not enough of a trend.

I'd like to barely be able to look at a hero and have them still be endearing, still be the hero. I would like them to be a complete and utter failure in everything they wish to achieve and yet still eventually achieve those things. I would like to see the hero fall into an unrequited love that REMAINS unrequited, because the hero is a freakin' FREAK.

I'm just saying-- maybe it would help the image problem in America if American cinema reflected a different attitude. Maybe there'd be less focus on appearance and less bias. If it was a box-office hit, anyway.

Any thoughts?

---Josh

*damnhooligan* · 05-14-2006, 12:13 PM

Well, in Goblet of Fire's defense, Mad Eye Moody is actually a good guy. It just happened to be that a bad dude was parading around using his likeness for a while. He'll be back in the following movies, as a goodie.

I think the only movies where you're going to see really ugly heroes is where it's a major plot point, rather than a last minute add on. In the most well known tales of deformed heroes, like Phantom of the Opera (though Erik's not a terribly convincing hero), Hunchback of Notre Dame and Beauty and the Beast, the primary focus is that the character is outcast from society and falls in love with a woman who cannot love them in return. And as interesting as that is, I don't know if I could take another rehashing of that old tried and true plot.

But as far as hoping Tom Cruise will dawn a fake hump and a limp for his next action flick, or an acid-burned Will Smith romantic comedy, don't hold your breath. Movies like that are merely Hollywood vehicles to show off A-listers in all of their professional-trained, airbrushed, Prada-wearin' glory. And heaven forbid anything tarnish that.

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-14-2006, 12:41 PM

Yeah, that's a shame, isn't it?

Actually, making Will Smith and Tom Cruise ugly would be contrary to my cause. Seeing less of them in hero roles and more of Steve Buscemi and Jason Alexander (neither of which are freaks, but both of whom would be guys who, upon sleeping with them, star****er girls would say they slept with "the guy from Reservoir Dogs" or "the guy from Pretty Woman") in these roles would change everyone's viewpoint of what a hero has to be. Why should they be so glamorous? Why not average-looking people?

I dunno, it probably won't happen, and I won't hold my breath. But I can dream...

---Josh

*Katie* · 05-14-2006, 01:11 PM

hehe I guess since Hollywood is Fantasyland anyway you might as well have a nice looking fantasy.

I'm with you though. All those really Beutiful star-types just give me a complex. I'll never be skinny enough, blonde enough, or tall enough. *shrugs* I never went for the Ken-doll types anyways. I'm average...and my guy (though I think he's amazing) is average too.

Hooray for Average people!

*KROW* · 05-14-2006, 08:41 PM

What about Dark Man, Swamp Thing, Roger Daltrey?

*iris* · 05-14-2006, 09:28 PM

I think that there are a lot of examples. The first one who came to mind was Dark Man. (TMNT also comes to mind.)

Cyrano de Bergerac and La Belle et La Bete are probably a classic examples, though the love is requited in those. Heh... and then there's King Kong.

*KROW* · 05-14-2006, 09:31 PM

Well, I wouldn't consider King Kong as freakishly ugly; not even ugly at all. I mean, he's a gorilla. He's not freakish as far as gorillas are concerned. He's just really big.

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-14-2006, 09:56 PM

Examples do come along every once in a while, but it is usually a major plot point. If it was just taken as a part of the character that they aren't super attractive, and it still had an effect on the story but didn't dictate where it went, I think it could make for something interesting.

Also, if it became a trend and wasn't in only a few movies, that'd only help more.

I mean, beautiful fantasies are great-- but imagine-- if more realistic people were in your fantasies, your fantasies would be closer to being a reality. It'd be putting a resolve to change things in the hands of average man.

I dunno, it's worth a thought.

---Josh

**Jo Dawn** · 05-14-2006, 09:58 PM

Actually... In Goblet of Fire... the 'patch man' Mad Eye Moody IS a good guy. The one that was bad was using his form via a potion.

But he IS a good guy.

*iris* · 05-14-2006, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KROW

Well, I wouldn't consider King Kong as freakishly ugly; not even ugly at all. I mean, he's a gorilla. He's not freakish as far as gorillas are concerned. He's just really big.

You're right; he's not ugly/freakish in that he's a gorilla. I was just thinking that he fits the "persecuted hero" pattern. He is a monstrous beast anyway.

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-14-2006, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo Dawn

Actually... In Goblet of Fire... the 'patch man' Mad Eye Moody IS a good guy. The one that was bad was using his form via a potion.

But he IS a good guy.

Yeah, I picked that up... but the good one wasn't in the movie. He never really showed up til the end. Ah, well. Does the real guy have a significant role in the 5th one? I kinda stopped reading the books after the 3rd one... in 9th or 10th grade everyone started calling me "Harry Potter" and I kinda developed a vengeance complex towards the whole thing.

---Josh

*Hannah* · 05-14-2006, 10:07 PM

But Tom Cruise IS a horribley disfigured and ugly "hero".

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-14-2006, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alice.ever.falling.

But Tom Cruise IS a horribley disfigured and ugly "hero".

I guess that'd explain why no one's going to see MI:III. (Oooh, burn. Recover from THAT one, you Last Samurai, you!)

---Josh

**Jo Dawn** · 05-14-2006, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Space Lieutenant Josh

Yeah, I picked that up... but the good one wasn't in the movie. He never really showed up til the end. Ah, well. Does the real guy have a significant role in the 5th one? I kinda stopped reading the books after the 3rd one... in 9th or 10th grade everyone started calling me "Harry Potter" and I kinda developed a vengeance complex towards the whole thing.

---Josh

Yes, and the Sixth, also. An even bigger one.

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-14-2006, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo Dawn

Yes, and the Sixth, also. An even bigger one.

Well, that's a step in the right direction! However, I don't think I'll be satisfied til Harry, Ron, and Hermione all get out of a burn ward and still save the day.

That's actually what I figured "Goblet of Fire" would be about. Boy, was there egg on my face!

---Josh

**Barkworm** · 05-15-2006, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Space Lieutenant Josh

I guess that'd explain why no one's going to see MI:III. (Oooh, burn. Recover from THAT one, you Last Samurai, you!)

---Josh

I went to see it! J.J. ABRAMS!!!

**Jo Dawn** · 05-15-2006, 01:28 AM

I actually saw it, too.

...

And I liked it.

Philip Seymour Hoffman rules, by the way. Okay? Hehe.

**Barkworm** · 05-15-2006, 01:30 AM

Yeah, he ruled. The way he was killed off didn't though.

Space Lieutenant Josh · 05-15-2006, 01:32 AM

Hey, I'm just saying that from a box office perspective, it's making less than expected. No personal offense intended.

Except to Tom Cruise.

---Josh

Serp · 05-15-2006, 01:46 PM

I like the Story of Frankenstien. And its cool that a character like Mario isn't whats considerd to be a vision of Beauty, but he is the hero, and he got the girl. Though in the live action Mario, they made Luigi a handsome guy and he got the Princess instead of Mario.

But I see where Josh is coming from.

05-14-2006, 02:05 AM	#1
Space Lieutenant Josh Hench Mutant Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Village of Rock'n Kick-Ass Posts: 492	Freakishly ugly good guys You don't see a lot of freakishly ugly good guys in movies, do you? Y'know, like deformed people. I guess a lot of it's because someone who's deformed prolly doesn't get the inclination to be good as often as they do to lash out. Still, I saw Harry Potter 4 or whatever and was hoping that the dude with the eyepatch would turn out to be good. No such luck. I mean, there'll always be your Hunchback of Notre Dames and your Bad Santas but I feel like it's not enough of a trend. I'd like to barely be able to look at a hero and have them still be endearing, still be the hero. I would like them to be a complete and utter failure in everything they wish to achieve and yet still eventually achieve those things. I would like to see the hero fall into an unrequited love that REMAINS unrequited, because the hero is a freakin' FREAK. I'm just saying-- maybe it would help the image problem in America if American cinema reflected a different attitude. Maybe there'd be less focus on appearance and less bias. If it was a box-office hit, anyway. Any thoughts? ---Josh

05-14-2006, 12:13 PM	#2
damnhooligan Mad Scientist Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Dorksville, USA Posts: 1,745	Well, in Goblet of Fire's defense, Mad Eye Moody is actually a good guy. It just happened to be that a bad dude was parading around using his likeness for a while. He'll be back in the following movies, as a goodie. I think the only movies where you're going to see really ugly heroes is where it's a major plot point, rather than a last minute add on. In the most well known tales of deformed heroes, like Phantom of the Opera (though Erik's not a terribly convincing hero), Hunchback of Notre Dame and Beauty and the Beast, the primary focus is that the character is outcast from society and falls in love with a woman who cannot love them in return. And as interesting as that is, I don't know if I could take another rehashing of that old tried and true plot. But as far as hoping Tom Cruise will dawn a fake hump and a limp for his next action flick, or an acid-burned Will Smith romantic comedy, don't hold your breath. Movies like that are merely Hollywood vehicles to show off A-listers in all of their professional-trained, airbrushed, Prada-wearin' glory. And heaven forbid anything tarnish that. __________________

05-14-2006, 01:11 PM	#4
Katie Just...way too serious. Join Date: May 2005 Location: purgatory Posts: 3,519	hehe I guess since Hollywood is Fantasyland anyway you might as well have a nice looking fantasy. I'm with you though. All those really Beutiful star-types just give me a complex. I'll never be skinny enough, blonde enough, or tall enough. shrugs I never went for the Ken-doll types anyways. I'm average...and my guy (though I think he's amazing) is average too. Hooray for Average people! __________________ THE WORLD IS JUST AWESOME

05-14-2006, 08:41 PM	#5
KROW Meat-n-Potatoes Man Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: State's Anus, NY Posts: 6,472	What about Dark Man, Swamp Thing, Roger Daltrey? __________________ - Optimus Acid Trip - Cult of a Half-Shell - Raiden's Bitter Tongue - *I don't try to be funny; I fail at it naturally.*

05-14-2006, 09:28 PM	#6
iris moddy mod mod Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: finally escaped the lab Posts: 1,886	I think that there are a lot of examples. The first one who came to mind was Dark Man. (TMNT also comes to mind.) Cyrano de Bergerac and La Belle et La Bete are probably a classic examples, though the love is requited in those. Heh... and then there's King Kong. __________________ Appeal to nobler motives. Like pie. [ life is at best bitter sweet ]

05-14-2006, 12:41 PM	#3
Space Lieutenant Josh Hench Mutant Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Village of Rock'n Kick-Ass Posts: 492	Yeah, that's a shame, isn't it? Actually, making Will Smith and Tom Cruise ugly would be contrary to my cause. Seeing less of them in hero roles and more of Steve Buscemi and Jason Alexander (neither of which are freaks, but both of whom would be guys who, upon sleeping with them, star****er girls would say they slept with "the guy from Reservoir Dogs" or "the guy from Pretty Woman") in these roles would change everyone's viewpoint of what a hero has to be. Why should they be so glamorous? Why not average-looking people? I dunno, it probably won't happen, and I won't hold my breath. But I can dream... ---Josh

05-14-2006, 09:31 PM	#7
KROW Meat-n-Potatoes Man Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: State's Anus, NY Posts: 6,472	Well, I wouldn't consider King Kong as freakishly ugly; not even ugly at all. I mean, he's a gorilla. He's not freakish as far as gorillas are concerned. He's just really big. __________________ - Optimus Acid Trip - Cult of a Half-Shell - Raiden's Bitter Tongue - *I don't try to be funny; I fail at it naturally.*

05-14-2006, 09:56 PM	#8
Space Lieutenant Josh Hench Mutant Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Village of Rock'n Kick-Ass Posts: 492	Examples do come along every once in a while, but it is usually a major plot point. If it was just taken as a part of the character that they aren't super attractive, and it still had an effect on the story but didn't dictate where it went, I think it could make for something interesting. Also, if it became a trend and wasn't in only a few movies, that'd only help more. I mean, beautiful fantasies are great-- but imagine-- if more realistic people were in your fantasies, your fantasies would be closer to being a reality. It'd be putting a resolve to change things in the hands of average man. I dunno, it's worth a thought. ---Josh

05-14-2006, 09:58 PM	#9
Jo Dawn Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Authority On All Things Don Posts: 5,190	Actually... In Goblet of Fire... the 'patch man' Mad Eye Moody IS a good guy. The one that was bad was using his form via a potion. But he IS a good guy. __________________

05-14-2006, 10:07 PM	#12
Hannah Once more, with feeling! Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 4,111	But Tom Cruise IS a horribley disfigured and ugly "hero". __________________

05-15-2006, 01:28 AM	#17
Jo Dawn Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Authority On All Things Don Posts: 5,190	I actually saw it, too. ... And I liked it. Philip Seymour Hoffman rules, by the way. Okay? Hehe. __________________

05-15-2006, 01:30 AM	#18
Barkworm Draconian leftist ruler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 6,758	Yeah, he ruled. The way he was killed off didn't though. __________________ Make ****, not kill!

05-15-2006, 01:32 AM	#19
Space Lieutenant Josh Hench Mutant Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Village of Rock'n Kick-Ass Posts: 492	Hey, I'm just saying that from a box office perspective, it's making less than expected. No personal offense intended. Except to Tom Cruise. ---Josh

05-15-2006, 01:46 PM	#20
Serp Hench Mutant Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 362	I like the Story of Frankenstien. And its cool that a character like Mario isn't whats considerd to be a vision of Beauty, but he is the hero, and he got the girl. Though in the live action Mario, they made Luigi a handsome guy and he got the Princess instead of Mario. But I see where Josh is coming from.