Take Me To Your Leader ...

Ryzar · 08-31-2006, 09:48 AM

I was just watching that episode "Take Me To You Leader" where Shredder and Krang have this device that takes all the energy from the Sun and puts it in batteries. And meanwhile making all of Earth as cold as the North Pole. ...

Anyways, in that episode Leonardo struggles with his trust in his ability to lead. And Meanwhile leaves the other 3 Turtles to swap Leader responsibilities on each other.

I was just wondering how you thought each Turtle dealt with it and if it changed your opinion of your favorite Turtles.

One thing that episode seemed to solidify was that Raph is really no leader. I mean he says it at the end "It's easier to make wise cracks than decisions". But this actually doesn't give me a worse opinion of Raph because I kind of identify with it. Like I'd find it easier to be the wise cracker of a group and rarely if ever take the leadership responsiblities. And for Raph, it works well for him.

On the other hand Don and Mikey actually did some positive stuff with their leadership. And of course Leo came back in the end and showed why he is the main Leader of the turtles.

What do you think?

Ryzar · 09-01-2006, 09:26 AM

I see...

Apparently talking about leaders among the Turtles is not very popular...

But ask why a techno-geek mutant turtle who wears purple doesn't have a girlfriend and get 2 pages and almost 30 posts.

Leonardo_ · 09-01-2006, 09:52 AM

Be patient. I am sure you will get some answers sooner or later...

I myself never saw the ep...sadly... so I can't say much to it.

*Buslady* · 09-01-2006, 10:41 AM

The "real" Raph (mirage) would take leader position if he needed to and may not be as great as Leo, but he's competant.

*discordiatookie* · 09-01-2006, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryzar

I see...

Apparently talking about leaders among the Turtles is not very popular...

But ask why a techno-geek mutant turtle who wears purple doesn't have a girlfriend and get 2 pages and almost 30 posts.

that was class!

i thought it was a pretty cool question, but like leo the 2nd, i've never seen it!!

I too would say Raph, Mirage version would go after Leo, only cos he managed to get the turtles' fingers outta their asses and get after the shredder in 'return to new york'. but he's not really a team player though..

and besides, thats the comics, and not the old toon!

so sorry...

*Sage Ninja* · 09-02-2006, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryzar

I was just watching that episode "Take Me To You Leader" where Shredder and Krang have this device that takes all the energy from the Sun and puts it in batteries. And meanwhile making all of Earth as cold as the North Pole. ...

Anyways, in that episode Leonardo struggles with his trust in his ability to lead. And Meanwhile leaves the other 3 Turtles to swap Leader responsibilities on each other.

I was just wondering how you thought each Turtle dealt with it and if it changed your opinion of your favorite Turtles.

One thing that episode seemed to solidify was that Raph is really no leader. I mean he says it at the end "It's easier to make wise cracks than decisions". But this actually doesn't give me a worse opinion of Raph because I kind of identify with it. Like I'd find it easier to be the wise cracker of a group and rarely if ever take the leadership responsiblities. And for Raph, it works well for him.

On the other hand Don and Mikey actually did some positive stuff with their leadership. And of course Leo came back in the end and showed why he is the main Leader of the turtles.

What do you think?

don't get discouraged threads about the old toon are seldom takin' seriously, some times. But i don't think enough people have seen it to make an opinion on it.

But to answer your question I thought the episode was rather interesting in exploring the other turtles possiable leading qualites. And your right, I felt that out of the three turtles Raphael didn't seem to be given a fair chance to shine. He gave up to easily and that dissapointed me. Donatello I felt acted a little out of character in this episode. Out of all the old toon turtles I would think that Donatello would be the most natural choice as leader after Leonardo. Half the time he acts like the unoficial leader any way. But when given the official reigns of leader he became to reliant on mathamatics and facts to go through with a definate plan of action. Which although true to form for him, went a little over board in this instant. He acted like he was afraid to amke a mistake, which is un-like him. So I can only attribute that as him getting a little nervous with his position and doubting him self as a result. I think with given more time to get used to being leader he would have made a kick-ass leader.

Michaelangelo I was a bit impressed with, because he seemed to take the role seriously and actually imply himself more so than what he normally does. With him trying to be leader i noticed he became more agressive than what he usually is. Going so far as to attack the robot gaurd full on and was able to hold his own until Leoanrdo stabed the bot in the back. His quirk was that he seemed to cautuos and tentive at times. Like it was obvious at first that he was unsure of himself when he was looking around with Raphael for the building, and then when he got lucky his confidence boasted up. And even when the robot proved to be hostile he actually had a plan of action but quickly undermined him himself by saying he saw it in a movie once. I took that as him trying to put the blame off himself in case the plan didn't work. With more time I think Michaelangelo would have gradually become a good leader if he had more time with it, and he wasn't to tentive about his descions. Becuase it did appear as thouygh he was trying.

As far as Raphael, I don't think the writters treated him fairly in this episode.

thats my take.

Agree? Disagree?

Leonardo_ · 09-02-2006, 06:09 PM

Very interesting. *Sigh* I really would like to see this ep

**Jo Dawn** · 09-03-2006, 09:03 AM

Man, I remember this episode vividly, for the most part, heh.

I thought... well, actually, I thought that, like Sage Ninja, Don was all out of character. Because, really, I also thought Don kinda hopped in there sometimes to help lead, if only unofficially. Leo'd ask his opinion on things aLOT (especially in 2K3 series), even if a more pacifistic person such as Don wouldn't really be comfortable in the 'Leader' position, I always felt he would be the next intelligent choice.

*Ahem* Anyhow. I always thought Don would be a bit more confident in his abilities, and this episode didn't really let the rest of them shine enough to really show what they could do. It was played out of character in yet another 'Only Leo can lead' storyline.

...By the way, I love Leo... so don't get all uppity, hehe.

*Buslady* · 09-03-2006, 10:41 AM

It does sound like a "lets glorify leonardo again" episode.

*eyeroll*

*Sage Ninja* · 09-09-2006, 11:06 AM

I don't think this was a cliche "Lets glorify Leonardo" episode. Since for one thing he was barely even shown in this episode except for in the very beginning and the end. I think this was a more "Lets try out the turtles in diffrent roles" episode. Episodes like that are usaully very fun because you get to see characters that you like in other roles that are different to the traditonal ones that their genrally show cased in.

with Don, Mike, and Raph, I think even in the old toon universe have potentcial to lead the team if Leonardo was ever permentally put out of the picture. they would just need more than a couple of hours to used to it. And in the old toon, I would have to say Donatello is the most legitimate choice of the four to lead.

*BigApple3AM* · 09-10-2006, 03:50 PM

I'll admit Leo gets a lot of attention in the 2003 toon, but the old toon he wasn't very prominent. He had like a handful of episodes based around him, but all the turtles did, mike meets bugman, don gets a degree (or something like that), raph meets his match, etc...

I loved this episode when I saw it. Haven't seen it in a while, which dvd volume is it on (if it's on one yet)?

*Drtooth* · 09-13-2006, 12:07 PM

I must swing the conversation to something else, since it's the same episode.

Does anyone else think that Leo's dream sequence was parodying how light hearted the action was in the series, as opposed to the comics? The bit where Shredder wanted to destroy cheese danish and whatnot?

*Sage Ninja* · 09-13-2006, 01:54 PM

I think Leonardo's dream sequance signifies how insecure Leonardo has become. Think about it, in the earlier part of the series Leonardo started out so strongly and commanding. Then as the series goes on he gets more and more insecure. If you notice most episodes that spot light him are ones where he is angynisting over his abilites, or how he feels that he can't have fun like the others.

Also his dream sequence could mean that Leonardo is frustrated with the whole TMNT vs. Shredder saga,and really just how stupid Shredder is (like his plan to steal the worlds cheese danishes). I think it might be depressing to think that your life revolves around stopping a glorified idiot.

Raphael_Fan · 09-20-2006, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryzar

I was just watching that episode "Take Me To You Leader" where Shredder and Krang have this device that takes all the energy from the Sun and puts it in batteries. And meanwhile making all of Earth as cold as the North Pole. ...

Anyways, in that episode Leonardo struggles with his trust in his ability to lead. And Meanwhile leaves the other 3 Turtles to swap Leader responsibilities on each other.

I was just wondering how you thought each Turtle dealt with it and if it changed your opinion of your favorite Turtles.

One thing that episode seemed to solidify was that Raph is really no leader. I mean he says it at the end "It's easier to make wise cracks than decisions". But this actually doesn't give me a worse opinion of Raph because I kind of identify with it. Like I'd find it easier to be the wise cracker of a group and rarely if ever take the leadership responsiblities. And for Raph, it works well for him.

On the other hand Don and Mikey actually did some positive stuff with their leadership. And of course Leo came back in the end and showed why he is the main Leader of the turtles.

What do you think?

I think that Raph was a kinda good leader,I would see hi as leader if Leo wasn't,But The reason I don't want Raph to be the leader is that he,Don't use his Brain .But I think that Raph is very very cool else.I was Raph when I was younger

I know I am a girl,but we are the same in person

one question? which TMNT are you talking about the new one or the old????

*Sewer Bull* · 09-20-2006, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raphael_Fan

one question? which TMNT are you talking about the new one or the old????

Everything in this section concerns the old show. Or the movies sometimes.

But not the new show - we've got a separate section for it.

Raphael_Fan · 09-20-2006, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sewer Bull

Everything in this section concerns the old show. Or the movies sometimes.

But not the new show - we've got a separate section for it.

okey

I loove the old tmnt movies the real thing tmnt the secret of the ooze!!! I just love that movie so much,I have double dvd with 2 and 3 when they are in japan.I wish they would do a movie like that again
with the costumes

that this movie in 2007 would be like that

*Sage Ninja* · 09-26-2006, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raphael_Fan

I think that Raph was a kinda good leader,I would see hi as leader if Leo wasn't,But The reason I don't want Raph to be the leader is that he,Don't use his Brain .But I think that Raph is very very cool else.I was Raph when I was younger

I know I am a girl,but we are the same in person

one question? which TMNT are you talking about the new one or the old????

This is based on a classic toon episode. In the old toon I think Raphael (despite his habit of making snide remarks about everything) could possiably step up to the plate and make a good leader. I think Raphael in the old toon had good observational skills, and if he just used this skill to the teams advantage instead of to just point out how dumb every one is behaving, he could make a good leader.

that is why I was a little miffed that out of the three turtles he seemed to get gyped when he was getting portrayed at his shot at being leader.

Ryzar · 11-07-2006, 06:41 PM

Ok cool. I've been away from the fourm for a while, for various reasons, but I always like to come back here and check it with the best TMNT fans and sources of information.

Anyways, thanks everyone for your input, a lot of good points made!

I agree with the setiment that Raph actually had very good observational skills and that's why he was best at making the quick wise cracks, but actually he could have used them to become a great leader, when in need. But I also think Don and Mikey, especially Mikey showed that they have leadership skills and aren't completely dependant on the others to make good decisions.

And Raph_Fan, I totally agree, I LOVED the old toons and the real-life based movies. As a 21-year-old guy it's perhaps sad that I still think of all 3 of those movies (TMNT 1, TMNT: Secret of the Ooze, and TMNT III (In Japan)) as my Favorite Movies of all time.

I'm pretty interested in this new CGI based TMNT movie for 2007.. I don't know much about it though, so I hope it doesn't meander toooo far from classic TMNT stuff.

*Sage Ninja* · 11-15-2006, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Ok cool. I've been away from the fourm for a while, for various reasons, but I always like to come back here and check it with the best TMNT fans and sources of information.

Anyways, thanks everyone for your input, a lot of good points made!

I agree with the setiment that Raph actually had very good observational skills and that's why he was best at making the quick wise cracks, but actually he could have used them to become a great leader, when in need. But I also think Don and Mikey, especially Mikey showed that they have leadership skills and aren't completely dependant on the others to make good decisions.

The one thing that I regret about the classic toon is how Raphael at times was down played in several instances. I think out of all of them he got the least amount of stand alone episodes (until about season five), and even then it didn't really scratch the serface of his character. When ever I think back to the old toon turtles they each seem to have some gripe or nuance about them selves that they had to deal with which would usally get adressed when they had the spot light on them.

Stand alone episodes based on Leonardo usally dealt with him trying to to better him self as a leader or a warrior and how he felt he fell short of his goals at times.

Stand alone episodes about Michaelangelo usally dealt with him wanting to be normal or trying to assert himself over his brothers or his surroundings and not being left behind. Or hinted at a an insecurity about him self in genreal.

Stand alone epsiodes about Donatello usally dealt with his role of techno guy and being taken advatage at times by his brothers.

With Raphael I can't really think of any nusances that makde him stand out in episodes dedicated to him, other than being the wise ass. Except with maybe the episode with Mona Lisa where he shows some intrest in a gilr mutant. I wish the old series had gone into his nusances a bit more.

themaxonline · 02-20-2007, 12:09 PM

I just watched this one alittle while ago. There wasn't much emphasis put on either of them and when Mikey was in charge, he was only in charge of Donatello as he was gone back to the layer to get something so it wasn't really a fair comparison. It was Mikey that found the laser though but I'm also biased.

So many of these episodes could have been made into 2 or 3 parters!

08-31-2006, 09:48 AM	#1
Ryzar Random Punk Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 31	Take Me To Your Leader ... I was just watching that episode "Take Me To You Leader" where Shredder and Krang have this device that takes all the energy from the Sun and puts it in batteries. And meanwhile making all of Earth as cold as the North Pole. ... Anyways, in that episode Leonardo struggles with his trust in his ability to lead. And Meanwhile leaves the other 3 Turtles to swap Leader responsibilities on each other. I was just wondering how you thought each Turtle dealt with it and if it changed your opinion of your favorite Turtles. One thing that episode seemed to solidify was that Raph is really no leader. I mean he says it at the end "It's easier to make wise cracks than decisions". But this actually doesn't give me a worse opinion of Raph because I kind of identify with it. Like I'd find it easier to be the wise cracker of a group and rarely if ever take the leadership responsiblities. And for Raph, it works well for him. On the other hand Don and Mikey actually did some positive stuff with their leadership. And of course Leo came back in the end and showed why he is the main Leader of the turtles. What do you think? __________________

09-01-2006, 09:26 AM	#2
Ryzar Random Punk Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 31	I see... Apparently talking about leaders among the Turtles is not very popular... But ask why a techno-geek mutant turtle who wears purple doesn't have a girlfriend and get 2 pages and almost 30 posts. __________________

09-01-2006, 09:52 AM	#3
Leonardo_ Stone Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 813	Be patient. I am sure you will get some answers sooner or later... I myself never saw the ep...sadly... so I can't say much to it. __________________

09-01-2006, 10:41 AM	#4
Buslady WingsOfDarkness! Perkele! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: In 7803... Posts: 4,366	The "real" Raph (mirage) would take leader position if he needed to and may not be as great as Leo, but he's competant. __________________

09-02-2006, 06:09 PM	#7
Leonardo_ Stone Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 813	Very interesting. Sigh I really would like to see this ep __________________

09-03-2006, 09:03 AM	#8
Jo Dawn Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Authority On All Things Don Posts: 5,190	Man, I remember this episode vividly, for the most part, heh. I thought... well, actually, I thought that, like Sage Ninja, Don was all out of character. Because, really, I also thought Don kinda hopped in there sometimes to help lead, if only unofficially. Leo'd ask his opinion on things aLOT (especially in 2K3 series), even if a more pacifistic person such as Don wouldn't really be comfortable in the 'Leader' position, I always felt he would be the next intelligent choice. Ahem Anyhow. I always thought Don would be a bit more confident in his abilities, and this episode didn't really let the rest of them shine enough to really show what they could do. It was played out of character in yet another 'Only Leo can lead' storyline. ...By the way, I love Leo... so don't get all uppity, hehe. __________________

09-03-2006, 10:41 AM	#9
Buslady WingsOfDarkness! Perkele! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: In 7803... Posts: 4,366	It does sound like a "lets glorify leonardo again" episode. eyeroll __________________

09-09-2006, 11:06 AM	#10
Sage Ninja Band of the Hawk Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: USA Posts: 3,924	I don't think this was a cliche "Lets glorify Leonardo" episode. Since for one thing he was barely even shown in this episode except for in the very beginning and the end. I think this was a more "Lets try out the turtles in diffrent roles" episode. Episodes like that are usaully very fun because you get to see characters that you like in other roles that are different to the traditonal ones that their genrally show cased in. with Don, Mike, and Raph, I think even in the old toon universe have potentcial to lead the team if Leonardo was ever permentally put out of the picture. they would just need more than a couple of hours to used to it. And in the old toon, I would have to say Donatello is the most legitimate choice of the four to lead. __________________ Cassandra: You won't fight me, but will you fight--for him! Cassandra's Revenge ~Tangled the Series ________________________________ http://frankviola.org/2012/01/30/godsviewofawoman/ _______________________________ http://nox-artemis.tumblr.com/post/4...k-and-feminism

09-10-2006, 03:50 PM	#11
BigApple3AM Mad Scientist Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Supermarket Aisle Posts: 1,635	I'll admit Leo gets a lot of attention in the 2003 toon, but the old toon he wasn't very prominent. He had like a handful of episodes based around him, but all the turtles did, mike meets bugman, don gets a degree (or something like that), raph meets his match, etc... I loved this episode when I saw it. Haven't seen it in a while, which dvd volume is it on (if it's on one yet)?

09-13-2006, 12:07 PM	#12
Drtooth Foot Elite Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 4,439	I must swing the conversation to something else, since it's the same episode. Does anyone else think that Leo's dream sequence was parodying how light hearted the action was in the series, as opposed to the comics? The bit where Shredder wanted to destroy cheese danish and whatnot? __________________ [Insert mildly amusing banner here]

09-13-2006, 01:54 PM	#13
Sage Ninja Band of the Hawk Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: USA Posts: 3,924	I think Leonardo's dream sequance signifies how insecure Leonardo has become. Think about it, in the earlier part of the series Leonardo started out so strongly and commanding. Then as the series goes on he gets more and more insecure. If you notice most episodes that spot light him are ones where he is angynisting over his abilites, or how he feels that he can't have fun like the others. Also his dream sequence could mean that Leonardo is frustrated with the whole TMNT vs. Shredder saga,and really just how stupid Shredder is (like his plan to steal the worlds cheese danishes). I think it might be depressing to think that your life revolves around stopping a glorified idiot. __________________ Cassandra: You won't fight me, but will you fight--for him! Cassandra's Revenge ~Tangled the Series ________________________________ http://frankviola.org/2012/01/30/godsviewofawoman/ _______________________________ http://nox-artemis.tumblr.com/post/4...k-and-feminism

11-07-2006, 06:41 PM	#18
Ryzar Random Punk Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 31	Ok cool. I've been away from the fourm for a while, for various reasons, but I always like to come back here and check it with the best TMNT fans and sources of information. Anyways, thanks everyone for your input, a lot of good points made! I agree with the setiment that Raph actually had very good observational skills and that's why he was best at making the quick wise cracks, but actually he could have used them to become a great leader, when in need. But I also think Don and Mikey, especially Mikey showed that they have leadership skills and aren't completely dependant on the others to make good decisions. And Raph_Fan, I totally agree, I LOVED the old toons and the real-life based movies. As a 21-year-old guy it's perhaps sad that I still think of all 3 of those movies (TMNT 1, TMNT: Secret of the Ooze, and TMNT III (In Japan)) as my Favorite Movies of all time. I'm pretty interested in this new CGI based TMNT movie for 2007.. I don't know much about it though, so I hope it doesn't meander toooo far from classic TMNT stuff. __________________

02-20-2007, 12:09 PM	#20
themaxonline Hench Mutant Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 278	I just watched this one alittle while ago. There wasn't much emphasis put on either of them and when Mikey was in charge, he was only in charge of Donatello as he was gone back to the layer to get something so it wasn't really a fair comparison. It was Mikey that found the laser though but I'm also biased. So many of these episodes could have been made into 2 or 3 parters!