Old Series Was Better

Nate6422 · 02-10-2003, 07:52 PM

I watched the new series and I was disappointed and happy at the same time. I was glad to see Ninja Turtles back on air. However, The new Ninja Turtle series is an excellent series by today's low standards and is truly good for a cartoon in any time, but the fact is the old series was better. Although many people are fans of the comic here which is popular the Ninja Turtles mass popularity and the reason I even knew about them was the cartoon. The problem with the new series is they have made the mistake of using the comics and saying that is what Ninja Turtles is. The fact is the Ninja Turtles most people love and enjoy aren't the ones from the comics, but rather the old cartoon show.

The first problem I would like to point out is the animation. It is very good by today's standards but compare it to the old series and you will see it is no where near as detailed. The fact is the new animation is popular because it is cheaper to make. Each scene is much less detailed which takes less time to draw and less time to color. It is still good compared to many other shows, but it isn't as good as the old series.

The next problem is the fact that the series have taken such a serious approach. I read up it was because it is believed kids want more serious characters now a days. I have no idea who thought that up, because in case no one has noticed the popular cartoons of late have some of the least serious characters ever. I mean how serious looking or acting our Pokemon? And Kirby is supposedly doing quite well and I don't find much serious about a pink puffball. The thing that made the first series the huge success it was was that it was not so serious. Instead it was always funny and packed with action. In the new series the turtles are still funny, but Shredder doesn't seem to be. It was always funny to see him being bossed around by Krang and to have him pick on Bebop and Rocksteady. Now, only half of the fun is there in the new series.

Finally the last major problem is the change. Change isnt' always better. I mean remember the Spider-Man storyline where Ben Reilly turned up to be the real Spider-man and no one liked it. That wasn't even near as big a deal as what they have done with the new Ninja Turtle series, getting rid of like half the characters people have enjoyed in the past and drastically changing the other half. I mean, the fact that the turtles were fighting an alien invasion made the other series exciting. Now they are just fighting evil robbers and ninjas.

That is the main problems with the new series. Just to make sure I don't sound too negative I want to say once again that the new series is the best cartoon series I have seen in a while so far, but the fact is it falls short of the old series and I see no reason to fool with something that isn't broken. I mean even when the old Ninja Turtles went off air on CBS and CBS switched to educational programming they were still getting excellent ratings. It showed that the Turtles had staying power. They weren't some two bit fad like Pokemon. They were popular all the way through. Now, the new series is a risk. My theory is the real villian is Fox though. They are just cheap. They complain about how kids don't watch cartoons as much anymore and then you look and see what there is and it is just no wonder. Even kids can see most of what is on today is junk. Fox wouldn't keep the live action Ninja Turtle series because it costed too much even though it got good ratings. It is only logical to assume that Fox is just as cheap today and that each Ninja Turtle episode also doesn't have the budget it deserves. Anyway, just one more time I want to say the series is still great, just far from being equivalent to the old series. I will be watching it next Saturday and I can only hope that in the next season Krang, Rocksteady, and Bebop show up.

Thanks for reading,

Nate

Raphael-sama · 02-10-2003, 08:17 PM

I'd just like to say that Karpo and the rest are going to tear you into little pieces in due time. I'd run while you still can.

*Stone Ill* · 02-10-2003, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Finally the last major problem is the change. Change isnt' always better. I mean remember the Spider-Man storyline where Ben Reilly turned up to be the real Spider-man and no one liked it. That wasn't even near as big a deal as what they have done with the new Ninja Turtle series, getting rid of like half the characters people have enjoyed in the past and drastically changing the other half. I mean, the fact that the turtles were fighting an alien invasion made the other series exciting. Now they are just fighting evil robbers and ninjas.

About that last comment: dude, it's the first episode! Why would you expect to see the TMNT in an alien invasion in the first episode?

*Mr. Snackpants* · 02-10-2003, 08:41 PM

I like the animation and color. Its a lot better than the old toon. I like more serious cartoons, fighting evil aliens and stuff every episode gets old. But fighting gangs and ninjas and makes a better cartoon. Shredder is how he should be serious, not the whiny guy has was in the old toon. By the way Krang, Bebop, and Rocksteady won't show up if there is another season, so you can stop hoping

(the way the the toon should be

)

lhb412 · 02-10-2003, 08:56 PM

I'm diggin' the new show, although I enjoyed the old show when it was on, I'd have to say that it was the first movie that really made me a fan, during kindergarden I must have watched that movie at least 3 or 4 times a week! So the darker, more ninja-like Turtles are natuarally real appealing to me,

**azure turtle** · 02-10-2003, 09:19 PM

Just a couple of things... I'll throw in my two cents.

I believe that 4 Kids bought the morning block from Fox, so I don't know how much influence Fox has on the new show. I'm pretty sure 4 Kids has more pull on what gets shown on Saturday mornings.

Also, I can understand why old cartoon fans would be upset. It's a drastic change from what we all grew up with. But you have to realize that we're no longer in the target audience. This new show is aimed at a new generation of turtle fans, not us. We're just here for the ride. If they were targeting our age group, there wouldn't be sweepstakes about "Name that Turtle" or "Match the Turtle with his mask and weapon" because that's common knowledge for us. And you've gotta be 18 or under just to enter.

I'm pleased with the new show, and hopefully, it'll become as legendary as the old one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raphael-sama

I'd just like to say that Karpo and the rest are going to tear you into little pieces in due time. I'd run while you still can.

I don't wanna see any flame wars. Share your opinions, but please do not attack any posters. This is just a general statement, and not aimed at anyone in particular. Thanks.

**DarthRaphael** · 02-10-2003, 09:24 PM

You must all accept the fact that the TMNT started as a comic. The toon made it a cultural icon.

I'm sorry you are disapointed with the new cartoon. You can always download the old episodes and watch them on Saturdays!

*Skeletoncrew* · 02-10-2003, 09:25 PM

Nate, I think its a bit premature to make a judgement over whether or not the new or old show are better. From what I've seen so far though, I'm shocked you'd consider the old show to be MORE detailed in animation than this one.

*Kid Icarus* · 02-10-2003, 09:26 PM

I'll add my opinions as it goes. I don't mean to slam you too hard, just counter your points

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate6422

I watched the new series and I was disappointed and happy at the same time. I was glad to see Ninja Turtles back on air. However, The new Ninja Turtle series is an excellent series by today's low standards and is truly good for a cartoon in any time, but the fact is the old series was better. Although many people are fans of the comic here which is popular the Ninja Turtles mass popularity and the reason I even knew about them was the cartoon. The problem with the new series is they have made the mistake of using the comics and saying that is what Ninja Turtles is. The fact is the Ninja Turtles most people love and enjoy aren't the ones from the comics, but rather the old cartoon show.

If they dident take the time to look in to the comics that would be their problem, NOT Mirage's. So far the responses I've heard from kids at my local card leauges is that the cartoon rocks, and is the best they have ever seen, so I don't see how them being based on Mirage's comics is a bad thing.

Quote:

The first problem I would like to point out is the animation. It is very good by today's standards but compare it to the old series and you will see it is no where near as detailed. The fact is the new animation is popular because it is cheaper to make. Each scene is much less detailed which takes less time to draw and less time to color. It is still good compared to many other shows, but it isn't as good as the old series.

And the old show having too many coloring mistakes to count is quality work then? The new animation has more fluid movements, sharper color and seperation between those colors, and has a STYLE. I'm an art student. Style is important in anything that involves creativity, cartoons included.

Quote:

The next problem is the fact that the series have taken such a serious approach. I read up it was because it is believed kids want more serious characters now a days. I have no idea who thought that up, because in case no one has noticed the popular cartoons of late have some of the least serious characters ever. I mean how serious looking or acting our Pokemon? And Kirby is supposedly doing quite well and I don't find much serious about a pink puffball. The thing that made the first series the huge success it was was that it was not so serious. Instead it was always funny and packed with action. In the new series the turtles are still funny, but Shredder doesn't seem to be. It was always funny to see him being bossed around by Krang and to have him pick on Bebop and Rocksteady. Now, only half of the fun is there in the new series.

Actually, it had much more humor in this one episode than the first season of the old toon. Jokes were going off ever few minutes (check out the main discussion board). And yeah, most kids DO want a more serious cartoon. Why do you think DBZ is so high in raitings? And Shredder never was meant to be funny. He was supposed to be a serious villian, and thats what he is now.

Quote:

Finally the last major problem is the change. Change isnt' always better. I mean remember the Spider-Man storyline where Ben Reilly turned up to be the real Spider-man and no one liked it. That wasn't even near as big a deal as what they have done with the new Ninja Turtle series, getting rid of like half the characters people have enjoyed in the past and drastically changing the other half. I mean, the fact that the turtles were fighting an alien invasion made the other series exciting. Now they are just fighting evil robbers and ninjas.

They got rid of the other characters because this is a NEW universe for them. The other half diden't get changed... they simply used the ORIGINAL characters that Laird and Eastman created. In the first cartoon, the characters were seperated by their catch phrases, in this one it actually seems like there are 4 diffrent turtles instead of 4 of the same one with a diffrent mask and weapon.

And evil robbers and ninjas can't be exciting? like its been said on here already, this was only the first episode. No one really know just how its going to be like.

Quote:

That is the main problems with the new series. Just to make sure I don't sound too negative I want to say once again that the new series is the best cartoon series I have seen in a while so far, but the fact is it falls short of the old series and I see no reason to fool with something that isn't broken.

If it wasn't broken, why did it go off air?

Quote:

I mean even when the old Ninja Turtles went off air on CBS and CBS switched to educational programming they were still getting excellent ratings. It showed that the Turtles had staying power. They weren't some two bit fad like Pokemon.

Pokemon is still going strong in Japan btw, where Ruby and Sahpire were the 2 best selling games of 2002, with only 2 months to sell copies. i hardly call that a "two bit fad".

Quote:

They were popular all the way through. Now, the new series is a risk. My theory is the real villian is Fox though. They are just cheap. They complain about how kids don't watch cartoons as much anymore and then you look and see what there is and it is just no wonder. Even kids can see most of what is on today is junk. Fox wouldn't keep the live action Ninja Turtle series because it costed too much even though it got good ratings. It is only logical to assume that Fox is just as cheap today and that each Ninja Turtle episode also doesn't have the budget it deserves. Anyway, just one more time I want to say the series is still great, just far from being equivalent to the old series. I will be watching it next Saturday and I can only hope that in the next season Krang, Rocksteady, and Bebop show up.

As far as I've heard, 4Kids are the people in charge of production, not Fox. 4Kids bought air time and needed a cartoon to fill the 30 min block, and Mirage wanted a new cartoon, and it all just fit.

Quote:

Thanks for reading,

Nate

No problem

. Again, sorry if this was a little harsh, it wasn't meant to be.

blank · 02-10-2003, 09:37 PM

I think a lot of people are quick to say that the past was better. I'm sure sometimes it is. I wish I was six years old again and watching the old ninja turtles before everyone went and died, but "Things Change", you know?

The animation? Sure, it's a leap from the olden days. The turtles look so cute anymore. Aww. I think it's just the style of today, all the cartoons are like that now and it's not that bad. It's a little bit more edgy, I feel. Sure, the backgrounds (like in Jacky Chan Adventures) are pretty lacking and sketchy at times, but it's not too bad. It's nice and I think it adds to the over all feel of the show. The old style was great too, I loved it, but "Things Change", right?

I like how it's more action and adventure based but still maintaining some good comedy bits. If that's what makes it more like the comic book, then I hope they keep it up! I mean, sure, it's nice to have a laughs but boys will be boys and boys (and girls) love ass kicking turtles. Am I right? I hope so, damit. This series seems to be a bit more serious, but it's nice for a change.

One minor note is that we should all be very glad we don't see Splinter shouting "Leonardo, I choose you!" and throwing out a Turtle-Ball to duel the Shredder. I hope somethings don't change.

darthsmozers · 02-10-2003, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate6422

I watched the new series

No, you didn't. You watched one episode of the new series. And, in any case, the first episode of the old series goes to show how different the show became over the months and years.

But, in this case, its back to its roots, as are the movies and the new Mirage comics. So, most likely, this series will continue to be close to this episode we just saw, and not like the old cartoon that broke away from the roots.

You're entitled to your opinion, however, which is cool

Just, reserve your judgment until we have more to go on

**Nturtle** · 02-10-2003, 10:02 PM

Well, the old cartoon was as Peter Laird said was comedy with some action and the new one is action with some comedy. I really love both. They both have their ups and downs of course but I also think its too early to draw to any conclusions.
However I think the old cartoon was focused on humor because the idea of these four huge teenage turtles in New York living in the sewers that know Ninjitsu and fight evil is a perfect setting for a comedy type show! The turtles were originally a joke, Peter and Kevin never expected to make such a hit, the whole serious side of the comics was a kind of parody off of bigger comic series. Of course that changed later on but still I give equal respect to both old and new toons.

Shellfox · 02-10-2003, 10:13 PM

I hate their eyes, I said it, Its bothered me constantly, they need pupils, they look scary with out them, some how they just look wrong, monsterous really.

tmntpower2003 · 02-10-2003, 10:21 PM

they are monsters if you think about it, they are 5'6 NINJA turtles that can kick practically every humans ass

**Kali** · 02-10-2003, 10:37 PM

Well, they will have pupils, when they take their bandannas off. And they have said they will be taking their bandannas off periodically. (*guves a fangirl WHOOP!*) It's pretty common for the turtle to be drawn without pupils with their bandannas on, and with pupils when they're off.

**Karpo_007** · 02-10-2003, 11:26 PM

Old cartoon had better animation?

Il say you this, No It didn't! Well everyone is entitled to their opinion... If you want goofy Turtles, Go watch the old cartoon. 95% of the people are happy with the serious aproach, and It comes very close to original TMNT's feeling

Next guy might say "I like Next mutation better". To each his own.

Mondo_Gecko · 02-10-2003, 11:50 PM

What most people always forget is the old series is why the new series is around today. Not only was it the most popular TMNT but it's the most recognisable. That's the TMNT i grew up with and that's the TMNT i know. The Mirage comics are great too, there darker, gritty, they have good stories. But i think Laird forgets why he's gotten anoather show it's because the cartoon was MEGA Popular. And they're bringing back all these poular shows (He-Man TMNT, Transformers, Thundercats, Ghostbusters etc) Not only to introduce new fans but hopefully make alot of money again. You don't see shows like Bucky O'Hare, Toxic Crusaders and Mighty Max being remade. If the Old cartoon wasn't as popular i'd highly doubt they'd bring back it back even if its a good comic book.

Now Bebop, Rocksteady & of course Krang. They're not in the new show. Mainly because they're not Mirage. They woulden't fit in people say. Well BELIEVE IT OR NOT they were in almost all the episodes of the cartoon. You can't just forget them like that. Even if there not from Mirage. I say Make them fit in. They're not dark? Well make em dark, tough scary whatever. But i refuse to believe that they're gone forever they wreren't one shot guys like Muckman or Mutagen Man. They're History and there what most people remember. I say bring em back, update em.

The other thing why do cartoons have be so dark and serious? I think the reason people want that is they're grown up now there not kids they want a more realistic TMNT. Your thinking this is an Adult show, i'm an adult not a kid. I want a new tmnt for me. Dark shows/movies are cool i enjoy em too. But i rather have Saturday Morning Cartoons they same they always been. If you want an adult cartoon maybe get HBO to do one like Spawn. That's an adult show. But Saturday Morning Cartoon's dark nah . It's for kids remember not us.

.

*heretic888* · 02-11-2003, 12:12 AM

The new cartoon is darker and those characters you mentioned are gone because Laird wanted it that way. He is the one pulling MOST of the strings.

And it is wrong to believe kids are the ONLY target audience of the new show. Laird pointed out very clearly this show is trying to target older fans (like yours truly) and new fans as well. Kinda like X-men evolution in that regard: yah gots the peeps in their teens and twenties (and even *gasp!* thirties!) watching the show alongside the kids.

Sparvid · 02-11-2003, 12:51 AM

I wonder if some people complained this much when Batman started in 1992... "Hey, this doesn't look like Super Friends! Why don't they get Adam West to be Batmans voice?"

And what's wrong with a serious cartoon? Isn't Justice League serious? Or X-Men Evolution?

*That Matt Guy* · 02-11-2003, 03:36 AM

Personally, I think the new TMNT is just a suped up version of the old toon.

02-10-2003, 07:52 PM	#1
Nate6422 New Recruit Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 1	Old Series Was Better I watched the new series and I was disappointed and happy at the same time. I was glad to see Ninja Turtles back on air. However, The new Ninja Turtle series is an excellent series by today's low standards and is truly good for a cartoon in any time, but the fact is the old series was better. Although many people are fans of the comic here which is popular the Ninja Turtles mass popularity and the reason I even knew about them was the cartoon. The problem with the new series is they have made the mistake of using the comics and saying that is what Ninja Turtles is. The fact is the Ninja Turtles most people love and enjoy aren't the ones from the comics, but rather the old cartoon show. The first problem I would like to point out is the animation. It is very good by today's standards but compare it to the old series and you will see it is no where near as detailed. The fact is the new animation is popular because it is cheaper to make. Each scene is much less detailed which takes less time to draw and less time to color. It is still good compared to many other shows, but it isn't as good as the old series. The next problem is the fact that the series have taken such a serious approach. I read up it was because it is believed kids want more serious characters now a days. I have no idea who thought that up, because in case no one has noticed the popular cartoons of late have some of the least serious characters ever. I mean how serious looking or acting our Pokemon? And Kirby is supposedly doing quite well and I don't find much serious about a pink puffball. The thing that made the first series the huge success it was was that it was not so serious. Instead it was always funny and packed with action. In the new series the turtles are still funny, but Shredder doesn't seem to be. It was always funny to see him being bossed around by Krang and to have him pick on Bebop and Rocksteady. Now, only half of the fun is there in the new series. Finally the last major problem is the change. Change isnt' always better. I mean remember the Spider-Man storyline where Ben Reilly turned up to be the real Spider-man and no one liked it. That wasn't even near as big a deal as what they have done with the new Ninja Turtle series, getting rid of like half the characters people have enjoyed in the past and drastically changing the other half. I mean, the fact that the turtles were fighting an alien invasion made the other series exciting. Now they are just fighting evil robbers and ninjas. That is the main problems with the new series. Just to make sure I don't sound too negative I want to say once again that the new series is the best cartoon series I have seen in a while so far, but the fact is it falls short of the old series and I see no reason to fool with something that isn't broken. I mean even when the old Ninja Turtles went off air on CBS and CBS switched to educational programming they were still getting excellent ratings. It showed that the Turtles had staying power. They weren't some two bit fad like Pokemon. They were popular all the way through. Now, the new series is a risk. My theory is the real villian is Fox though. They are just cheap. They complain about how kids don't watch cartoons as much anymore and then you look and see what there is and it is just no wonder. Even kids can see most of what is on today is junk. Fox wouldn't keep the live action Ninja Turtle series because it costed too much even though it got good ratings. It is only logical to assume that Fox is just as cheap today and that each Ninja Turtle episode also doesn't have the budget it deserves. Anyway, just one more time I want to say the series is still great, just far from being equivalent to the old series. I will be watching it next Saturday and I can only hope that in the next season Krang, Rocksteady, and Bebop show up. Thanks for reading, Nate

02-10-2003, 08:17 PM	#2
Raphael-sama Foot Soldier Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cah-nah-dah Posts: 155	I'd just like to say that Karpo and the rest are going to tear you into little pieces in due time. I'd run while you still can. __________________ -Badabing.

02-10-2003, 09:24 PM	#7
DarthRaphael Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Charlotte, NC USA Posts: 913	You must all accept the fact that the TMNT started as a comic. The toon made it a cultural icon. I'm sorry you are disapointed with the new cartoon. You can always download the old episodes and watch them on Saturdays! __________________ I edit your posts

02-10-2003, 09:25 PM	#8
Skeletoncrew Foot Elite Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Bearing in on your spicy brains Posts: 3,275	Nate, I think its a bit premature to make a judgement over whether or not the new or old show are better. From what I've seen so far though, I'm shocked you'd consider the old show to be MORE detailed in animation than this one. __________________ Adult TMNT fan art and fiction contest Now accepting entries!

02-10-2003, 09:37 PM	#10
blank Random Punk Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 23	I think a lot of people are quick to say that the past was better. I'm sure sometimes it is. I wish I was six years old again and watching the old ninja turtles before everyone went and died, but "Things Change", you know? The animation? Sure, it's a leap from the olden days. The turtles look so cute anymore. Aww. I think it's just the style of today, all the cartoons are like that now and it's not that bad. It's a little bit more edgy, I feel. Sure, the backgrounds (like in Jacky Chan Adventures) are pretty lacking and sketchy at times, but it's not too bad. It's nice and I think it adds to the over all feel of the show. The old style was great too, I loved it, but "Things Change", right? I like how it's more action and adventure based but still maintaining some good comedy bits. If that's what makes it more like the comic book, then I hope they keep it up! I mean, sure, it's nice to have a laughs but boys will be boys and boys (and girls) love ass kicking turtles. Am I right? I hope so, damit. This series seems to be a bit more serious, but it's nice for a change. One minor note is that we should all be very glad we don't see Splinter shouting "Leonardo, I choose you!" and throwing out a Turtle-Ball to duel the Shredder. I hope somethings don't change. __________________ o r a n g e . . .

02-10-2003, 08:41 PM	#4
Mr. Snackpants Keep cool my babies! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mount Pleasant Posts: 2,239	I like the animation and color. Its a lot better than the old toon. I like more serious cartoons, fighting evil aliens and stuff every episode gets old. But fighting gangs and ninjas and makes a better cartoon. Shredder is how he should be serious, not the whiny guy has was in the old toon. By the way Krang, Bebop, and Rocksteady won't show up if there is another season, so you can stop hoping (the way the the toon should be )

02-10-2003, 08:56 PM	#5
lhb412 Foot Soldier Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 246	I'm diggin' the new show, although I enjoyed the old show when it was on, I'd have to say that it was the first movie that really made me a fan, during kindergarden I must have watched that movie at least 3 or 4 times a week! So the darker, more ninja-like Turtles are natuarally real appealing to me,

02-10-2003, 10:02 PM	#12
Nturtle Ninja Master Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Technodrome Airducts Posts: 5,215	Well, the old cartoon was as Peter Laird said was comedy with some action and the new one is action with some comedy. I really love both. They both have their ups and downs of course but I also think its too early to draw to any conclusions. However I think the old cartoon was focused on humor because the idea of these four huge teenage turtles in New York living in the sewers that know Ninjitsu and fight evil is a perfect setting for a comedy type show! The turtles were originally a joke, Peter and Kevin never expected to make such a hit, the whole serious side of the comics was a kind of parody off of bigger comic series. Of course that changed later on but still I give equal respect to both old and new toons. __________________ Fil rules. If Fil takes your 5 bucks then you should be eternally grateful that Fil would even borrow your money. Fil.

02-10-2003, 10:13 PM	#13
Shellfox Mad Scientist Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,234	I hate their eyes, I said it, Its bothered me constantly, they need pupils, they look scary with out them, some how they just look wrong, monsterous really.

02-10-2003, 10:21 PM	#14
tmntpower2003 Hench Mutant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Gotham City Posts: 418	they are monsters if you think about it, they are 5'6 NINJA turtles that can kick practically every humans ass

02-10-2003, 10:37 PM	#15
Kali Inactive Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: California! Posts: 11,101	Well, they will have pupils, when they take their bandannas off. And they have said they will be taking their bandannas off periodically. (guves a fangirl WHOOP!) It's pretty common for the turtle to be drawn without pupils with their bandannas on, and with pupils when they're off.

02-10-2003, 11:26 PM	#16
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	Old cartoon had better animation? Il say you this, No It didn't! Well everyone is entitled to their opinion... If you want goofy Turtles, Go watch the old cartoon. 95% of the people are happy with the serious aproach, and It comes very close to original TMNT's feeling Next guy might say "I like Next mutation better". To each his own.

02-10-2003, 11:50 PM	#17
Mondo_Gecko Stone Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 670	What most people always forget is the old series is why the new series is around today. Not only was it the most popular TMNT but it's the most recognisable. That's the TMNT i grew up with and that's the TMNT i know. The Mirage comics are great too, there darker, gritty, they have good stories. But i think Laird forgets why he's gotten anoather show it's because the cartoon was MEGA Popular. And they're bringing back all these poular shows (He-Man TMNT, Transformers, Thundercats, Ghostbusters etc) Not only to introduce new fans but hopefully make alot of money again. You don't see shows like Bucky O'Hare, Toxic Crusaders and Mighty Max being remade. If the Old cartoon wasn't as popular i'd highly doubt they'd bring back it back even if its a good comic book. Now Bebop, Rocksteady & of course Krang. They're not in the new show. Mainly because they're not Mirage. They woulden't fit in people say. Well BELIEVE IT OR NOT they were in almost all the episodes of the cartoon. You can't just forget them like that. Even if there not from Mirage. I say Make them fit in. They're not dark? Well make em dark, tough scary whatever. But i refuse to believe that they're gone forever they wreren't one shot guys like Muckman or Mutagen Man. They're History and there what most people remember. I say bring em back, update em. The other thing why do cartoons have be so dark and serious? I think the reason people want that is they're grown up now there not kids they want a more realistic TMNT. Your thinking this is an Adult show, i'm an adult not a kid. I want a new tmnt for me. Dark shows/movies are cool i enjoy em too. But i rather have Saturday Morning Cartoons they same they always been. If you want an adult cartoon maybe get HBO to do one like Spawn. That's an adult show. But Saturday Morning Cartoon's dark nah . It's for kids remember not us. .

02-11-2003, 12:12 AM	#18
heretic888 Foot Elite Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,344	ahem The new cartoon is darker and those characters you mentioned are gone because Laird wanted it that way. He is the one pulling MOST of the strings. And it is wrong to believe kids are the ONLY target audience of the new show. Laird pointed out very clearly this show is trying to target older fans (like yours truly) and new fans as well. Kinda like X-men evolution in that regard: yah gots the peeps in their teens and twenties (and even gasp! thirties!) watching the show alongside the kids. __________________ "Ninpo began as training to become a moral people and to learn to endure in whatever social condition one is in; to know and accept one's fate, and to live for human beings and all other creatures. The person who masters all of these is a Ninja." (Masaaki Hatsumi)

02-11-2003, 12:51 AM	#19
Sparvid Stone Warrior Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Östersund, Sweden Posts: 860	I wonder if some people complained this much when Batman started in 1992... "Hey, this doesn't look like Super Friends! Why don't they get Adam West to be Batmans voice?" And what's wrong with a serious cartoon? Isn't Justice League serious? Or X-Men Evolution?

02-11-2003, 03:36 AM	#20
That Matt Guy Honey Bunches Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Lone Star State Posts: 5,840	Personally, I think the new TMNT is just a suped up version of the old toon.