Much to ponder about one Dark Turtle?

Meira-Bates · 05-12-2003, 11:56 AM

Yes I know, this post will probably make me sound obsessed...and maybe I am ^.^ ...but anyhow...Here's the explination of his one episode appearance from the officail site... http://www.ninjaturtles.com/cartoon/guide/cart157.htm

Now for the topics...What do you all think Dark Turtle is, exactly? Is he just a momentary lapse of sanity (or a really whacked case of amnesia) on Donatello's part, or is he some deeply hidden and well controlled sort of multiple personality that was realeased due to the effects of the heavy injuries he recived from Shredder? For referance, if I remember correctly, how he got injured was that Shredder tossed him against some machine and the force was strong enough that Donatello got electricuted pretty bad...

Also...if the other turtles hadn't showed up and Dark Turtle had won the match with Shredder, how badly do you think TMNTness as we know it would be effected? Would our quiet, pacisifistic Donatello be Dark Turtle forever? Would one of the other turtles finnaly just do a repeat of the whole scene, despite how deadly it could be? Or, would Donatello just finnaly snap out of it on his own?

My only other question...why the heck did he have the little ear thingies? Hehe I can't remember how he made the costume, so I don't remember if he just grabbed a pre-made mask or if he actualy made it. If he made it I wonder about the ear thingies even more so! lol he's supposed to be Dark /turtle/ not something with pointy ears!

**Karpo_007** · 05-12-2003, 12:17 PM

I think he was just a temporary personality change. The episode was one of the better ones.

impetus · 05-12-2003, 12:43 PM

wow, that's definitely a good question... I say if it wasn't in Mirage, it never really happened anyway so don't lose any sleep over it.

Meira-Bates · 05-12-2003, 12:57 PM

hehe they are just questions that have poked at me a little now and then, and since Donatello is my favorite of favorites it doesn't go away, lol. If I could actually write a good fanfic who knows what would happen with Donatello X.x

impetus · 05-12-2003, 12:58 PM

Slash wa nan desu ka?

Meira-Bates · 05-12-2003, 01:01 PM

Nani? I don't know very much Japanese, those first two parts came from the Japanese theme.

Splinter · 05-12-2003, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by impetus

wow, that's definitely a good question... I say if it wasn't in Mirage, it never really happened anyway so don't lose any sleep over it.

Definatly a good question. But I have to disagree with the mindset that if it's not Mirage it doesn't mean anything. Mirage has had some terrible storylines as well, and the cartoon incarnations are the most well known of the TMNT. No matter what any of us think about them. Besides it lasted 10 years, they must have done somthing right.

impetus · 05-12-2003, 01:50 PM

Thus the

~~TheShredder~~ · 05-12-2003, 01:58 PM

Yeah the cartoon was different from Mirage but it was still good.

**Karpo_007** · 05-12-2003, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vintage Splinter

Quote:

Originally Posted by impetus

wow, that's definitely a good question... I say if it wasn't in Mirage, it never really happened anyway so don't lose any sleep over it.

Definatly a good question. But I have to disagree with the mindset that if it's not Mirage it doesn't mean anything. Mirage has had some terrible storylines as well, and the cartoon incarnations are the most well known of the TMNT. No matter what any of us think about them. Besides it lasted 10 years, they must have done somthing right.

Popularity does not make good art. But you are right, kids did love the show, and probably still do. Excatly what Mirage storylines are bad? Only thing I can think of are some guest artist issues, and most of those aren't part of the continuity.

Splinter · 05-12-2003, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karpo_007

Popularity does not make good art. But you are right, kids did love the show, and probably still do. Excatly what Mirage storylines are bad? Only thing I can think of are some guest artist issues, and most of those aren't part of the continuity.

Popularity means a great deal though, when it comes to show how well received good art is. Frankly, most of Mirage's stuff was less then steller, especially anything that followed the death of the Shredder the second time. Most comics would end after they kill off the main villan. And you can't shrug off anything that isn't part of the continuity as not having an impact on the series. It's all TMNT baby, and those bad issues still bring down whatever quality Mirage can be considered to have had as a whole.

**Karpo_007** · 05-12-2003, 03:51 PM

Less seller? The entire run of Mirage volume 1 was popular, but after Return to New York it probably was a little less. It had nothing to do with Shredders death, by the time of City at war the sales were very high. It seems you fail to understand that mirage is not a story about 4 turtles fighting Shredder like the old cartoon, it is a story of 4 Teenage Mutant Turtles, outsiders of society wich tend to get involved in lots of violence.

And mass marketed never means good art, but in case of TMNT, the conversion from Original TMNT to children's franchice was indeed a success. It made LOTS of money to Mirage studios, and even increased the audience of Mirage's books. Only negative thing about old cartoon is that it made general public think TMNT only as Chirlden's thing.

Splinter · 05-12-2003, 06:34 PM

Please, don't have the arrogance to tell me what I "Don't Understand". That is really demeaning, and extremly arrogant of you. I understand the classic Mirage stuff as well as you do. I know it wasn't focused on the Shredder, but the series did get less intresting after he was offed the second time.

Not saying that it's bad by any means. Just that I think it's far less stellar and intresting then any of the incarnations that followed. And how is making the general public think of TMNT as a Children's thing, negative. The mention of comic books as a whole, would be consider a "Children's Thing" back then.

**Nturtle** · 05-12-2003, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by impetus

wow, that's definitely a good question... I say if it wasn't in Mirage, it never really happened anyway so don't lose any sleep over it.

I'm suprise nobody caught this!!

"it never really happened anyway"

sorry folks but I don't think TMNT are real....

Pepzi · 05-13-2003, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nturtle

sorry folks but I don't think TMNT are real....

*PepZ, runs into his room and cries*

**Karpo_007** · 05-13-2003, 04:31 AM

Yes, I can tell you what you don't understand if you sound like it. The TMNT does not have or never have had a main enemy, nor did it get less intresting after he was defeated for the second time. City at War is probably the best story arc the series has, and had the best sales if Im not mistaken. Most of the guest artist issues between are very good to, Like Michael Zulli's or A.C. Farleys for example. Of course everyone can have their own opinions about that, but it does not by any means make Mirage volume 1 any less quality.

If correcting you makes me arrogant, then fine I am, but thse are not even my own theories. This is what Eastman and Laird have said on the letters page when asked why they won't resurrect Shredder again.

One other thing. No one tought Mirage as a children't thing back then, many fans were complaining to mirage how they had sold out the TMNT when the cartoon premiered. Some parents even complained how violent Mirage was and they should make it more kid friendly! Of course it's a negative thing.

But today it's not that big deal what ignorant majority thinks, we have ongoing Mirage TMNT book series later to be followed by another, and a new show on TV.

Meira-Bates · 05-13-2003, 08:50 AM

Urrr...guys it was suggested I hose you all off my topic, but I'm gonna just tell ya to stop arguing and /then/ I'll use the hose if it continues...errr...as soon as I find the directions for the thing.... Where did I leave that paper? *goes searching about* This topic has gotten way off topic X.x.

**Karpo_007** · 05-13-2003, 09:37 AM

Sorry, back to the topic then. Like I said, The Dark Turtle is just a divided personality, of course it might have something to do with Don letting out some deep hate emotions...

*Jephael* · 05-13-2003, 08:45 PM

I remember the first time I watched that episode when Don said "I could fight Shredder by myself if I had to!" He looked so eager to prove himself to the others that he was just as much a badass as his bros, and I got the feeling the electric shock triggered the heroic portion of his ego and pushed him over the limit.

05-12-2003, 11:56 AM	#1
Meira-Bates Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2003 Location: an abandoned wearhouse Posts: 1,057	Much to ponder about one Dark Turtle? Yes I know, this post will probably make me sound obsessed...and maybe I am ^.^ ...but anyhow...Here's the explination of his one episode appearance from the officail site... http://www.ninjaturtles.com/cartoon/guide/cart157.htm Now for the topics...What do you all think Dark Turtle is, exactly? Is he just a momentary lapse of sanity (or a really whacked case of amnesia) on Donatello's part, or is he some deeply hidden and well controlled sort of multiple personality that was realeased due to the effects of the heavy injuries he recived from Shredder? For referance, if I remember correctly, how he got injured was that Shredder tossed him against some machine and the force was strong enough that Donatello got electricuted pretty bad... Also...if the other turtles hadn't showed up and Dark Turtle had won the match with Shredder, how badly do you think TMNTness as we know it would be effected? Would our quiet, pacisifistic Donatello be Dark Turtle forever? Would one of the other turtles finnaly just do a repeat of the whole scene, despite how deadly it could be? Or, would Donatello just finnaly snap out of it on his own? My only other question...why the heck did he have the little ear thingies? Hehe I can't remember how he made the costume, so I don't remember if he just grabbed a pre-made mask or if he actualy made it. If he made it I wonder about the ear thingies even more so! lol he's supposed to be Dark /turtle/ not something with pointy ears! __________________ I'm also the winner of the award for being least likely to receive an award! O.o

05-12-2003, 12:43 PM	#3
impetus Stone Warrior Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Kansas City Posts: 978	wow, that's definitely a good question... I say if it wasn't in Mirage, it never really happened anyway so don't lose any sleep over it. __________________

05-12-2003, 12:57 PM	#4
Meira-Bates Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2003 Location: an abandoned wearhouse Posts: 1,057	hehe they are just questions that have poked at me a little now and then, and since Donatello is my favorite of favorites it doesn't go away, lol. If I could actually write a good fanfic who knows what would happen with Donatello X.x __________________ I'm also the winner of the award for being least likely to receive an award! O.o

05-12-2003, 12:58 PM	#5
impetus Stone Warrior Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Kansas City Posts: 978	Slash wa nan desu ka? __________________

05-12-2003, 01:01 PM	#6
Meira-Bates Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2003 Location: an abandoned wearhouse Posts: 1,057	Nani? I don't know very much Japanese, those first two parts came from the Japanese theme. __________________ I'm also the winner of the award for being least likely to receive an award! O.o

05-12-2003, 12:17 PM	#2
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	I think he was just a temporary personality change. The episode was one of the better ones.

05-12-2003, 01:50 PM	#8
impetus Stone Warrior Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Kansas City Posts: 978	Thus the __________________

05-12-2003, 01:58 PM	#9
~~TheShredder~~ Banned Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: My Throne Room Posts: 442	Yeah the cartoon was different from Mirage but it was still good.

05-12-2003, 03:51 PM	#12
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	Less seller? The entire run of Mirage volume 1 was popular, but after Return to New York it probably was a little less. It had nothing to do with Shredders death, by the time of City at war the sales were very high. It seems you fail to understand that mirage is not a story about 4 turtles fighting Shredder like the old cartoon, it is a story of 4 Teenage Mutant Turtles, outsiders of society wich tend to get involved in lots of violence. And mass marketed never means good art, but in case of TMNT, the conversion from Original TMNT to children's franchice was indeed a success. It made LOTS of money to Mirage studios, and even increased the audience of Mirage's books. Only negative thing about old cartoon is that it made general public think TMNT only as Chirlden's thing.

05-12-2003, 06:34 PM	#13
Splinter Radical Rat Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Splinter's Dojo Posts: 1,531	Please, don't have the arrogance to tell me what I "Don't Understand". That is really demeaning, and extremly arrogant of you. I understand the classic Mirage stuff as well as you do. I know it wasn't focused on the Shredder, but the series did get less intresting after he was offed the second time. Not saying that it's bad by any means. Just that I think it's far less stellar and intresting then any of the incarnations that followed. And how is making the general public think of TMNT as a Children's thing, negative. The mention of comic books as a whole, would be consider a "Children's Thing" back then. __________________ R.I.P. Master Splinter - Mirage Comics - May 1984 / June 2003 Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles - New Episode Guide

05-13-2003, 04:31 AM	#16
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	Yes, I can tell you what you don't understand if you sound like it. The TMNT does not have or never have had a main enemy, nor did it get less intresting after he was defeated for the second time. City at War is probably the best story arc the series has, and had the best sales if Im not mistaken. Most of the guest artist issues between are very good to, Like Michael Zulli's or A.C. Farleys for example. Of course everyone can have their own opinions about that, but it does not by any means make Mirage volume 1 any less quality. If correcting you makes me arrogant, then fine I am, but thse are not even my own theories. This is what Eastman and Laird have said on the letters page when asked why they won't resurrect Shredder again. One other thing. No one tought Mirage as a children't thing back then, many fans were complaining to mirage how they had sold out the TMNT when the cartoon premiered. Some parents even complained how violent Mirage was and they should make it more kid friendly! Of course it's a negative thing. But today it's not that big deal what ignorant majority thinks, we have ongoing Mirage TMNT book series later to be followed by another, and a new show on TV.

05-13-2003, 08:50 AM	#17
Meira-Bates Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2003 Location: an abandoned wearhouse Posts: 1,057	Urrr...guys it was suggested I hose you all off my topic, but I'm gonna just tell ya to stop arguing and /then/ I'll use the hose if it continues...errr...as soon as I find the directions for the thing.... Where did I leave that paper? goes searching about This topic has gotten way off topic X.x. __________________ I'm also the winner of the award for being least likely to receive an award! O.o

05-13-2003, 09:37 AM	#18
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	Sorry, back to the topic then. Like I said, The Dark Turtle is just a divided personality, of course it might have something to do with Don letting out some deep hate emotions...

05-13-2003, 08:45 PM	#19
Jephael That whack job behind you Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Carlisle, Pennsylvania Posts: 8,143	I remember the first time I watched that episode when Don said "I could fight Shredder by myself if I had to!" He looked so eager to prove himself to the others that he was just as much a badass as his bros, and I got the feeling the electric shock triggered the heroic portion of his ego and pushed him over the limit. __________________ "I like it. Simple, but effective!" Raphael; The Mean Machines - 1988