Deep down, do you think Shredder and Krang cared for Bebop and Rocksteady?

*CyberCubed* · 11-11-2013, 07:59 AM

Bebop and Rocksteady failed and fouled up Shredder/Krang's plans over a hundred times in the original toon...yet every single time Shredder/Krang forgave them and let them live in the Technodrome and used them again the next time.

While there are a lot of episodes where Shredder and Krang insult them and even get really angry with them, it was like two parents reprimanded their children. Otherwise Shredder/Krang would have kicked Bebop/Rocksteady out of the Technodrome a long time ago and let them be abandoned on either Earth or Dimension X.

Do you think Shredder and Krang had a soft spot for Bebop and Rocksteady?

DonatelloNinja82 · 11-11-2013, 08:07 AM

That's an interesting question. Of the two, I would lean more toward Shredder actually caring about them, if at all. There were a few times where Shredder could have left them to their doom and didn't. But could Shredder really care for anything?

Type 97 Chi-ha · 11-11-2013, 08:36 AM

I wondered about that myself. But when you think about it, if Shredder had a caring side to him, would he be the sort to openly show it. He is supposed to be a villain, after all. (Of course, there are all the James Bond-type villains who are holding white long-haired cats.)

pingclang · 11-11-2013, 08:45 AM

Funny you should ask this. I've been going through the whole series and I've been picking up on the fact that, yeah, the two annoy the crap out of Shredder and Krang, but every time they get into deep trouble, Shredder seems to always go out of his way to help them. Krang has only shown concern once that I can remember, but it is mostly Shredder. I would say that yeah, they care, even if they are really annoyed by them.

~~Davetello~~ · 11-11-2013, 08:50 AM

I think they both just viewed them as numbers; something to aid in the battle against the turtles. Even if they were incompetent they generally had their uses from time to time, and that's why they kept them around.

Shredder became comic relief pretty quickly, but he and Krang were essentially trying to take over the world. They weren't nice individuals, and I doubt they really cared about anything other than their villainous goals.

Shredder was the guy who mutated Bebop and Rocksteady from humans into animals, after all. Essentially he's responsible for their plight, and the fact that they can no longer live in the human world. I suppose the argument could be made that he feels some guilt over that, but I don't really believe that he had a caring bone in his body so I wouldn't subscribe to that theory.

For me, the two mutants were just like every other life-form to Krang and Shredder: to be exploited, coerced and manipulated for the greater evil. The two mutants were depicted as two of the show's less intelligent characters, so this was easily achieved, and a big part of why they are very prominent in aiding (or attempting to aid) Shredder and Krang's plans. From time to time we see them attempt some form of mutiny, but for the most part they were pretty loyal.

*Zachatello00* · 11-11-2013, 09:12 AM

I don't know about Bebop and Rocksteady, but in the season ten storyarc "a turtle in time" and "turtles to the second power", Shredder really did seem to care for Krang.

*Prowler* · 11-11-2013, 11:40 AM

Well, I certainly don't recall them ever trying to sacrifice or abandon them, so I'm sure that they did care about them to some degree. They most likely just kept them around because they couldn't get anyone else to replace them.

*Mzx10484* · 11-11-2013, 12:20 PM

Shredder and Krang have certainly expected higher achievements from Bebop and Rocksteady, concerning the fight against the Turtles. Although they were mostly disappointed in this regard, they have always appeared lenient towards them. Or do I remember wrong ? So deep down, I think they cared a little bit for their companions - Bebop and Rocksteady.

RaphAndDonnie · 11-11-2013, 01:01 PM

I think that they did, even if only a little bit. I can especially see this in the case of Shredder.

alliance · 11-11-2013, 01:11 PM

shredder -Yes
krang - No

*Cipher* · 11-11-2013, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zachatello00

I don't know about Bebop and Rocksteady, but in the season ten storyarc "a turtle in time" and "turtles to the second power", Shredder really did seem to care for Krang.

I was going to pop in and say this. I'm guessing it's one-hundred percent unintentional (because there was no show-runner actually checking for consistent character growth or anything), but Shredder and Krang develop quite a bromance over the course of the series.

*CyberCubed* · 11-11-2013, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cipher

I was going to pop in and say this. I'm guessing it's one-hundred percent unintentional (because there was no show-runner actually checking for consistent character growth or anything), but Shredder and Krang develop quite a bromance over the course of the series.

Kinda funny because in some of the Season 3 episodes Shredder talks about turning on Krang or betraying him.

cammy85 · 11-11-2013, 02:48 PM

Without Bebop and Rocksteady, what else doe Shredder have? This became evident big time in Season 2 when the Technodrome was in Dimension X and Krang wouldn't let him have his Foot Soldiers. That was a big test of their usefulness and after all that, how COULD he abandon them? Aside from the wave modulator incident, of course.

*Icebot* · 11-11-2013, 03:26 PM

For Shredder, I would say no. In Mutagen Monster, when he was pulling Rocksteady's ear, he said his ears were sensative and Shredder asked him "Why do you think I'm pulling on them?"

Shredder fired Bebop and Rocksteady and got tired of them always failing in The Foot Soldiers Are Revolting. Then at the end of the episode, Shredder only rehired them because he said it's so hard to find good help these days and he said he might regret it later.

*Refractive Reflections* · 11-11-2013, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icebot

Shredder fired Bebop and Rocksteady and got tired of them always failing in The Foot Soldiers Are Revolting. Then at the end of the episode, Shredder only rehired them because he said it's so hard to find good help these days and he said he might regret it later.

"The Foot Soldiers Are Revolting" episode, is probably the most revealing as to why Shredder and Krang kept Bebop and Rocksteady all the time. I don't think Krang or Shredder had any inherent caring attitude toward them, but I do think Shredder appreciated their devotion even though those two were dumb as bricks. It made Shredder realize that Bebop and Rocksteady's stupidity was actually the greatest ally in his plans, and not worry about mutiny (despite very few occurrences). (As Davetello was referring to earlier.)

As for Krang, I usually got the impression that Krang merely saw them as the cumbersome labor in getting things done for his plans.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cipher

I was going to pop in and say this. I'm guessing it's one-hundred percent unintentional (because there was no show-runner actually checking for consistent character growth or anything), but Shredder and Krang develop quite a bromance over the course of the series.

I kind of figured that the loose association of Shredder and Krang we see in the earlier seasons (episodes such as "Beware the Lotus", "A Thing About Rats", "Peking Turtle", "Three MusketTurtles", and "Shredderville") always seemed to hint that they would betray each other at just the right time. I guess when Shredder and Krang fought the Turtles for so long and with a new villain (Dregg) threatening both of their lives, it's probably not hard to expect Shredder and Krang's alliance solidifying upon realizing their collaborative efforts are more effective than if they went their separate ways.
But I wouldn't go so far as saying they had a bromance... Rocksteady and Bebop, yeah, but not Shredder and Krang.

*pannoni1* · 11-13-2013, 08:30 AM

When Krang prevented Bebop and Rocksteady from helping Shredder in "Return of the Shredder", it wasn't due to technical problems, but the fact that Krang felt deep inside that they would lessen the chance of Shredder's success. He had no say in creating those mutants unlike Shredder.

But in "Super Bebop and Mighty Rocksteady", even though Shredder creates robotic and supposedly superior versions of them, he still allows regular Bebop and Rocksteady to assist in his work. It proves that they can be used as bait to lure the Turtles into fighting them (sometimes with Foot Soldiers) and then having Shredder take care of his minions separately.

11-13-2013, 10:28 AM

I think they cared slightly considering they always gave the grusome twosome slack about their constant incompetance. Besides, Shredder and Krang were cartoon evil, not REAL evil.

Pterobat · 11-13-2013, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cipher

I was going to pop in and say this. I'm guessing it's one-hundred percent unintentional (because there was no show-runner actually checking for consistent character growth or anything), but Shredder and Krang develop quite a bromance over the course of the series.

No, no, see, a bromance is when it's NOT gay.

Eh, otherwise, I think they were indifferent to their henchmen. They wouldn't save them if it'd be inconvenient, but as long as Bebop and Rocksteady are around, they'll use 'em.

I think Bebop and Rocksteady do at least give a damn about each other, though....

*Shark_Blade* · 11-14-2013, 12:50 AM

Of course, B&R are their babies.

*TheBlueTurtle1* · 11-14-2013, 05:41 AM

where else were they going to find 2 idiots to take their daily verbal abuse?

11-11-2013, 07:59 AM	#1
CyberCubed Overlord Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 43,835	Deep down, do you think Shredder and Krang cared for Bebop and Rocksteady? Bebop and Rocksteady failed and fouled up Shredder/Krang's plans over a hundred times in the original toon...yet every single time Shredder/Krang forgave them and let them live in the Technodrome and used them again the next time. While there are a lot of episodes where Shredder and Krang insult them and even get really angry with them, it was like two parents reprimanded their children. Otherwise Shredder/Krang would have kicked Bebop/Rocksteady out of the Technodrome a long time ago and let them be abandoned on either Earth or Dimension X. Do you think Shredder and Krang had a soft spot for Bebop and Rocksteady?

11-11-2013, 08:07 AM	#2
DonatelloNinja82 Mad Scientist Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,345	That's an interesting question. Of the two, I would lean more toward Shredder actually caring about them, if at all. There were a few times where Shredder could have left them to their doom and didn't. But could Shredder really care for anything? __________________ Michelangelo: Holy guacamole with hot sauce and jalapenos!

11-11-2013, 09:12 AM	#6
Zachatello00 On the beat! Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Hiding behind the phone booth Posts: 2,135	I don't know about Bebop and Rocksteady, but in the season ten storyarc "a turtle in time" and "turtles to the second power", Shredder really did seem to care for Krang. __________________ "You're still news!"

11-11-2013, 01:11 PM	#10
alliance Hench Mutant Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 328	shredder -Yes krang - No __________________ 80's TURTLES MUCH COOLER THAN FORGOTTEN 4KIDS

11-11-2013, 03:26 PM	#14
Icebot Foot Elite Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: East Coast, US Posts: 3,225	For Shredder, I would say no. In Mutagen Monster, when he was pulling Rocksteady's ear, he said his ears were sensative and Shredder asked him "Why do you think I'm pulling on them?" Shredder fired Bebop and Rocksteady and got tired of them always failing in The Foot Soldiers Are Revolting. Then at the end of the episode, Shredder only rehired them because he said it's so hard to find good help these days and he said he might regret it later. __________________ Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@Icebot7/videos Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/Icebot251

11-11-2013, 08:36 AM	#3
Type 97 Chi-ha Mad Scientist Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Brookfield, IL Posts: 1,333	I wondered about that myself. But when you think about it, if Shredder had a caring side to him, would he be the sort to openly show it. He is supposed to be a villain, after all. (Of course, there are all the James Bond-type villains who are holding white long-haired cats.)

11-11-2013, 08:45 AM	#4
pingclang Stone Warrior Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Tennessee Posts: 552	Funny you should ask this. I've been going through the whole series and I've been picking up on the fact that, yeah, the two annoy the crap out of Shredder and Krang, but every time they get into deep trouble, Shredder seems to always go out of his way to help them. Krang has only shown concern once that I can remember, but it is mostly Shredder. I would say that yeah, they care, even if they are really annoyed by them.

11-11-2013, 08:50 AM	#5
~~Davetello~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Greater Glasgow, Scotland, The Ununited Kingdom Posts: 1,712	I think they both just viewed them as numbers; something to aid in the battle against the turtles. Even if they were incompetent they generally had their uses from time to time, and that's why they kept them around. Shredder became comic relief pretty quickly, but he and Krang were essentially trying to take over the world. They weren't nice individuals, and I doubt they really cared about anything other than their villainous goals. Shredder was the guy who mutated Bebop and Rocksteady from humans into animals, after all. Essentially he's responsible for their plight, and the fact that they can no longer live in the human world. I suppose the argument could be made that he feels some guilt over that, but I don't really believe that he had a caring bone in his body so I wouldn't subscribe to that theory. For me, the two mutants were just like every other life-form to Krang and Shredder: to be exploited, coerced and manipulated for the greater evil. The two mutants were depicted as two of the show's less intelligent characters, so this was easily achieved, and a big part of why they are very prominent in aiding (or attempting to aid) Shredder and Krang's plans. From time to time we see them attempt some form of mutiny, but for the most part they were pretty loyal.

11-11-2013, 11:40 AM	#7
Prowler Emperor Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,999	Well, I certainly don't recall them ever trying to sacrifice or abandon them, so I'm sure that they did care about them to some degree. They most likely just kept them around because they couldn't get anyone else to replace them.

11-11-2013, 12:20 PM	#8
Mzx10484 WEM Super Starfinder 200 Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Germany Posts: 2,085	Shredder and Krang have certainly expected higher achievements from Bebop and Rocksteady, concerning the fight against the Turtles. Although they were mostly disappointed in this regard, they have always appeared lenient towards them. Or do I remember wrong ? So deep down, I think they cared a little bit for their companions - Bebop and Rocksteady.

11-11-2013, 02:48 PM	#13
cammy85 Stone Warrior Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Minnedosa, MB Canada Posts: 772	Without Bebop and Rocksteady, what else doe Shredder have? This became evident big time in Season 2 when the Technodrome was in Dimension X and Krang wouldn't let him have his Foot Soldiers. That was a big test of their usefulness and after all that, how COULD he abandon them? Aside from the wave modulator incident, of course.

11-13-2013, 08:30 AM	#16
pannoni1 Foot Elite Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: USA Posts: 3,447	When Krang prevented Bebop and Rocksteady from helping Shredder in "Return of the Shredder", it wasn't due to technical problems, but the fact that Krang felt deep inside that they would lessen the chance of Shredder's success. He had no say in creating those mutants unlike Shredder. But in "Super Bebop and Mighty Rocksteady", even though Shredder creates robotic and supposedly superior versions of them, he still allows regular Bebop and Rocksteady to assist in his work. It proves that they can be used as bait to lure the Turtles into fighting them (sometimes with Foot Soldiers) and then having Shredder take care of his minions separately. __________________ http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/sho...d.php?t=37065- MY WANT LIST TMNT FAN CLUB LINK: http://sot.ag/gCjK/ 30 years of Turtle Power!

11-13-2013, 10:28 AM	#17
shreddinghead Guest Posts: n/a	I think they cared slightly considering they always gave the grusome twosome slack about their constant incompetance. Besides, Shredder and Krang were cartoon evil, not REAL evil.

11-14-2013, 12:50 AM	#19
Shark_Blade Emperor Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 7,909	Of course, B&R are their babies.

11-14-2013, 05:41 AM	#20
TheBlueTurtle1 Foot Elite Join Date: May 2012 Location: UK Posts: 2,892	where else were they going to find 2 idiots to take their daily verbal abuse? __________________ http://jandmdev.deviantart.com/ (My Brother and I have a dev page, I am J, brother is M)