Mirage Turtle personalities compared to the other mediums?

[Warhorse]

I was just wondering, to those who read the comics, can you all give a description of how much more different the Mirage Turtles are compared to the other mediums like Fred Wolf, 1990 toon, 2k3, 2012? What is it about those particular Mirage characters you find yourself loving more than other incarnations, or vice versa? Maybe it's the personalities or the way they handled certain challenges or something? Thanks.

[miru]

Overall, they're much more ruthless and less heroic.

[Powder]

I'd say Leo & Raph are more or less consistent across the turtleverse (with the two being a bit more extreme- Raph being more violent, Leo more serious & brooding with stronger spiritual themes). Donnie & Mikey are the two who really differ from their mainstream personalities. Mikey starts off as sort of the generic turtle, later becoming the heart of the team. He is sometimes used to comedic effect, but in a mostly more innocent way, rather than being outright goofy or idiotic. But later in the series, particularly in vol. 3, he gets a lot of development & maturity thrown his way, as he takes to writing poetry & romance novels in his spare time. He was even published! He was Shadow's babysitter, & the first to get a girlfriend (an alien or mutant dinosaur-esque chick named Horridus [or Sara]). But he's still brutal when he fights. One book's opening page is him choking a foot elite to death with his chuck chains. Donnie does sort of have the intellectual thing going on, but he's far more reserved, & the thinking is done in his own head, rather than out loud. The loner angle that is often played up with Raph in the films & cartoons is moreso Donnie's role in the comics. He's quite a dark guy, actually. He's killed animals in the name of science, beat up a drunk Casey Jones, kept Baxter Stockman in a dungeon for like 2 years without his brothers knowledge, cloned Splinter, built a robot version of April after she died, when he was a cyborg and struggling to deal with it he threatened to kill his brothers before pulling the trigger to his own head (though the suit had an override that prevented self-harm). Like I said, dark.

[CyberCubed]

Mirage Michelangelo is the most drastically different. Instead of always trying to be funny and into videogames/comics like the other versions, he's more of a laid back guy who occasionally makes a joke but is also a writer and quite thoughtful.

Mirage Mikey is still fun and playful as seen in his one-shot, but he's not as overboard as the cartoons.

[Warhorse]

Thank you guys for the responses.

[Casey]

Originally Posted by Powder

I'd say Leo & Raph are more or less consistent across the turtleverse (with the two being a bit more extreme- Raph being more violent, Leo more serious & brooding with stronger spiritual themes). Donnie & Mikey are the two who really differ from their mainstream personalities. Mikey starts off as sort of the generic turtle, later becoming the heart of the team. He is sometimes used to comedic effect, but in a mostly more innocent way, rather than being outright goofy or idiotic. But later in the series, particularly in vol. 3, he gets a lot of development & maturity thrown his way, as he takes to writing poetry & romance novels in his spare time. He was even published! He was Shadow's babysitter, & the first to get a girlfriend (an alien or mutant dinosaur-esque chick named Horridus [or Sara]). But he's still brutal when he fights. One book's opening page is him choking a foot elite to death with his chuck chains. Donnie does sort of have the intellectual thing going on, but he's far more reserved, & the thinking is done in his own head, rather than out loud. The loner angle that is often played up with Raph in the films & cartoons is moreso Donnie's role in the comics. He's quite a dark guy, actually. He's killed animals in the name of science, beat up a drunk Casey Jones, kept Baxter Stockman in a dungeon for like 2 years without his brothers knowledge, cloned Splinter, built a robot version of April after she died, when he was a cyborg and struggling to deal with it he threatened to kill his brothers before pulling the trigger to his own head (though the suit had an override that prevented self-harm). Like I said, dark.

To be fair, many of those things are referencing Image's Vol. 3, but I think the overall tone of Donnie and Mikey are as you described. I know you know all of this Powder and I'm not sure if the user who started this thread cares about the distinction or not, but I personally don't consider it canon although I do enjoy it.

[Powder]

Mikey's stuff, yeah, but only maybe half for Donatello. Besides, vol. 3 was written to be a canon continuation of vol. 2, with Eastman & Laird approving every single move Gary Carlson made in scripting the series. Laird is the one who decided 10 years later he no longer wanted it to be canon, but never wrote anything that contradicted the events of that volume, leaving it open to interpretation. I think most fans still consider it canon, & there are even select Tales issues that seem to insert themselves in or around that era. Plus you've got the finisher books, featuring the original creative team, which tie it into vol. 4.

[Xav]

Originally Posted by Powder

Laird is the one who decided 10 years later he no longer wanted it to be canon, but never wrote anything that contradicted the events of that volume, leaving it open to interpretation.

Well except for the fact that the turtles aren't mutilated in vol 4.

[Powder]

Yeah, but there's a decent gap in time between the volumes, which makes it fair to assume the turtles healed on their own. There's a lot of blank spots in the timeline, anyway. We dunno where Mikey ended up in old age, what happened between Shadow & Donnie, etc.

[Rooish]

Volume 3 may have been considered canon at the time but I can see why Laird disowned it. The personalities are just messed up. After reading mostly Lawson's and Laird's scripts for the final parts of Volume 1 and Volume 2, the turtles have all become fairly cerebral and thoughtful--well especially Leo and Don. The Volume 3 turtles are simply too rough and callous. They get better as the series goes, I guess. Maybe the endless stream of Image crossovers mellowed them out. I liked Mike's development in the series, but I don't think his relationship with Horridus helped any, since she was considered a "retard".

It should be noted that in Mirage, Raph was sometimes--often--as goofy as Mike, especially when Eastman wrote him.

Also of note is that Don beat up a drunk Casey Jones because Casey was berating him, but well, it was mean anyway.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by Rooish

Also of note is that Don beat up a drunk Casey Jones because Casey was berating him, but well, it was mean anyway.

Yeah, Casey comes up and starts telling Donnie about how he thinks he's better then everyone because he's so smart. Donnie tells him to go away and come back when he's sober. And when he continues to bug him he gets Donnie's wrath.

[Rooish]

Granted, Don does think he's better than anyone else, at least according to Vol. 4.

Also of note: in Mirage it's Don and Mike. Not this Donnie and Mikey bull.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by miru

Overall, they're much more ruthless and less heroic.

That... Is correct, but it's worth noting that even though they're anti-heroes they're not the humorless super dark people some detractors seem to claim. Just expect the lighter stuff is more likely to involve beer rather than pizza...

[Cipher]

Originally Posted by Rooish

Granted, Don does think he's better than anyone else, at least according to Vol. 4.

Even more of note is that on both occasions (and these came from Laird and the rest of the core Mirage team), Don doesn't really deny the accusations. He just brushes them off.

As others have mentioned: Leonardo is pretty consistent with what you'd see in other media. Raph starts out nearly psychotically vicious, but cools off in later volumes and is very into the idea of protecting the innocent and being proactive. Mike loves human culture and is the most extroverted; he's not a goofball as portrayed in other versions; he just likes to have fun. Don's smart but has a bit of a superiority complex. But can you blame him? His life's being wasted in a sewer until the Utroms show up.

Don also, despite sometimes engaging in some morally questionable things, dislikes violence the most of the four (though all will kill if necessary).

Here's what we know of their future: Donatello goes blind at some point and lives alone as an old Turtle in a futuristic setting. Leonardo loses a girlfriend in middle age and swears off killing. He travels the world and is seen at 100-plus-years-old in various settings, including a futuristic apartment and a period Japanese-style house. Raph loses an eye and ends up going on the lamb on a post-apocalyptic Earth (global warming causes catastrophic flooding across at least parts of the earth at the end of the Mirage timeline, much like the TMNT Adventures one). We don't know what happens to Mike.

In general the Mirage universe is a grittier, more surreal, and often more somber place than other versions, and its Turtles reflect that. In early issues they're generic quipping action heroes, but by the time the series has settled into its identity they're probably the most human and nuanced versions around. Mirage Mike is my favorite Turtle period. I like Mirage Leo a lot too. He's actually a little more down-to-Earth than other versions.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by Rooish

Volume 3 may have been considered canon at the time but I can see why Laird disowned it. The personalities are just messed up. After reading mostly Lawson's and Laird's scripts for the final parts of Volume 1 and Volume 2, the turtles have all become fairly cerebral and thoughtful--well especially Leo and Don. The Volume 3 turtles are simply too rough and callous.

The book starts with their lair being ambushed on their 18th birthday. After a time of peace, they thought they'd finally started to live quiet lives, but then, boom, two baddies show up, SHOOT RAPH IN THE FACE & drop Donnie out of a helicopter, KILLING HIM. If you think you can go through that without becoming sour, paranoid, edgy, & generally angry for a while, then they broke the mold when they made you. Donnie's mind is corrupted by the cyborg's influence, which is made clear. Raph is Raph. Period. But now he's got more reasons to be pissed off. Leo's perfectly normal, as is Mikey, so... & the book is not without it's somber moments.

Originally Posted by Rooish

Also of note: in Mirage it's Don and Mike. Not this Donnie and Mikey bull.

Pardon my having affection for characters I love.

[Rooish]

Oh I wasn't talking to you about the Mikey and Donnie thing, just in general--it's like the new versions have no concept that Mike and Don are possible nicknames for these characters anymore.

I meant the turtles were jerks to each other in Image, not just callous in general. They seriously brought in all this macho bravado crap that was never there before. Their reaction to Don's and Splinter's suspected deaths was to pretty much shrug it off. Except that scene where Mike cried... but yeah, not enough really. Raph was basically like so Don's a cyborg and depressed, he should get over it already. Leo then is like yeah we can't have him bringing the team down, you beat us up right now or you're not worth a damn to us. Mike's like poor baby Raph, your face melted off, let me kiss your boo boo. I'm pretty sure the Mirage Turtles would have never been like that. Their personalities got a bit better as it went though.

[Powder]

Fair enough, but it came off that way.

I think the turtles' assholishness towards one another (which wasn't present very long) was just a means of there being a more brotherly vibe, & that's what brothers do. They bust eachother's chops. In my mind, they couldn't really afford to break down seeing Don, given all the other crazy s**t going on around them, plus there's the fact that death takes time to settle within you. I think it'd be natural for the turtles to try and swallow the scenario & mourn later. Before anything else, they're warriors. They were raised to kill, & accept death for what it is. Raph has always been insensitive towards others. As for Leo, I think his attitude was rooted in the idea of reverse psychology. They challenge one another to see where they're really coming from. The Mikey part, I'll give you that, though Mike is always one to try & lighten the mood, no matter how bad the situation is... so it's not unfair to try & reason that his timing was poor & he thought he was helping, or maybe he couldn't fully grasp how bad the damage was. We've all said the wrong thing at the wrong time once or twice in our lives.

[Warhorse]

When it comes to fighting/defense, how do the Mirage Turtles stack up to, say the 1990 movie, the 2k3, and 2012 Turtles?

[Powder]

In terms of what, like, individual skill, or as a whole?

If you're looking at the big picture, one might actually argue that the 4kids turtles are strongest. They got a little Mary Sue'd towards the end there, turning into dragons & essentially battling Satan... So, they might not even be fair to compare.

But the Mirage turtles are definitely tougher than all the rest, no question. Even more so with age, as Raph has a second mutation, Mikey trains in an alien army, Donnie gets a mech suit, & Leo's just as tough on himself training-wise as ever.

[BabyTurtles]

wow the turtles sound brutal compared to now....

O_O I mean Donnie trapping Baxter for 2 years!??