Poor Michelangelo

[RaphaelinSTL]

I'll admit, I'm fairly new to the Nick Toon series. I caught a couple random episodes here and there and really wasn't digging on it for the first year or so. I decided to give it a better chance and I started watching them from the beginning and now I've been excited for the series and how they're bringing in the characters I know and love.

However, the more I watch it...the more frustrating it is with how they're handling Michelangelo and sadly...I know based on things I've read and how popular the show is with kids that Mikey's character doesn't really go through any big changes.

I get it that he's the youngest, I know he's there to make the kids laugh...I know this IS a show for children, but as a fan of Michelangelo I really don't like the way they write him as inferior and much more of a comic relief role. I don't get why so many people here harp on 2K3 Mike as besides the Mirage and 1990 versions...that was up there as my favorite interpretation of the character. I just don't like how he's played for gags and it just takes me out of the show the entire time.

Any other Michelangelo fans feel this way?

[CyberCubed]

No, he's fine.

[RaphaelinSTL]

I don't know man, I just prefer Michelangelo as someone who isn't a klutz or the "idiot" butt of the jokes.

With a third season on the way, it's not like my gripe with Mikey is going to get any better...but alas.

[plastroncafe]

If you think he's bad now...and I agree with you, he's often times face-palmingly bad, just imagine what he'd be like without the Michaelangelo Test that Ciro assured us was in place.

Apparently what we see is heavily toned down.

[RaphaelinSTL]

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

If you think he's bad now...and I agree with you, he's often times face-palmingly bad, just imagine what he'd be like without the Michaelangelo Test that Ciro assured us was in place.

Apparently what we see is heavily toned down.

Heavily toned down? Wow, I wasn't aware of this...please explain!

Glad you agree. He's just clumsy and silly...which I just can't find myself enjoying. Especially my brother whose favorite growing up was Mikey now just rolls his eyes like I do since we started watching the series.

He shines in some moments and he does have funny quips (I was laughing out loud during the Rat King episode where a rat bites his head and he yells "THEY'VE GOT A TASTE FOR TURTLE" with a straight face) but overall, I don't like his little kid writing style. As I mentioned, I just get taken right out of the show.

[Shark_Blade]

2k7 Mikey got it worse if we're being entirely honest.

[Leo656]

One of the things that bugs me with this series is, when the characterization is good, it's good, but when it's bad, like some of Mikey and Donnie's "lesser" moments, it's baaaaaaaaad.

I don't think we're ever going to get another portrayal of Mikey that's elevated beyond "Team Idiot", sadly. He's not a character anymore, he's a "type".

[RaphaelinSTL]

Originally Posted by Shark_Blade

2k7 Mikey got it worse if we're being entirely honest.

That whole movie got it worse IMO.

It wouldn't be so outside of the 2012 realm for Mikey to make a "HUH HUH LOOKS LIKE YOUR MOM" kind of joke though really either. =(

Originally Posted by Leo656

One of the things that bugs me with this series is, when the characterization is good, it's good, but when it's bad, like some of Mikey and Donnie's "lesser" moments, it's baaaaaaaaad.

I don't think we're ever going to get another portrayal of Mikey that's elevated beyond "Team Idiot", sadly. He's not a character anymore, he's a "type".

And that's a damn shame. I'd love for kids to see the more mellow, writer aspect of Michelangelo as opposed to the ADHD version. =/

[BabyTurtles]

I feel your pain

I'm also a Mikey fan...he's always been my favorite turtle...he always WILL be.

I just wish they developed him more in the show...I know they can do it..and I know it won't detour kids from him.

[Leo656]

Mikey's only ever been at best my second-favorite (first movie version), generally third-favorite (not a big Donnie guy, definitely not the Nick version), but the only thing I ever really disliked about him was how in so many versions he's less a "character" than a walking punchline. The Nick show really amplifies all the traits I don't care for, for the sake of being the one that overly-caffeinated little nose-pickers can "relate" to, and that's a shame. It bothers me when people defend it by saying "The guys act like teenagers in this show!" because to me, he acts more like he's 10. Even as a high school freshman, literally the only kids I knew who acted like Nick Mikey were the ones who smoked way, waaaaaay too much pot.

First movie Mikey is always the "real" one, in my eyes. He had so much more depth than any other film or cartoon portrayal of the character. Still had the familiar "jokester" elements without being a complete imbecile or man-child. I guess the OT version is my second-favorite, but even then, those pizza jokes got old soooooooo fast.

[RaphaelinSTL]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Mikey's only ever been at best my second-favorite (first movie version), generally third-favorite (not a big Donnie guy, definitely not the Nick version), but the only thing I ever really disliked about him was how in so many versions he's less a "character" than a walking punchline. The Nick show really amplifies all the traits I don't care for, for the sake of being the one that overly-caffeinated little nose-pickers can "relate" to, and that's a shame. It bothers me when people defend it by saying "The guys act like teenagers in this show!" because to me, he acts more like he's 10. Even as a high school freshman, literally the only kids I knew who acted like Nick Mikey were the ones who smoked way, waaaaaay too much pot.

First movie Mikey is always the "real" one, in my eyes. He had so much more depth than any other film or cartoon portrayal of the character. Still had the familiar "jokester" elements without being a complete imbecile or man-child. I guess the OT version is my second-favorite, but even then, those pizza jokes got old soooooooo fast.

Gotta agree with everything you say man. The original film's version of Mike was a perfect combination of the original cartoon and the Mirage elements. He just was so real.

The Nick show really DOES over amplify Mike's more "jokey" elements to the point to where it's like nails on a chalkboard to me.

[BabyTurtles]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Mikey's only ever been at best my second-favorite (first movie version), generally third-favorite (not a big Donnie guy, definitely not the Nick version), but the only thing I ever really disliked about him was how in so many versions he's less a "character" than a walking punchline. The Nick show really amplifies all the traits I don't care for, for the sake of being the one that overly-caffeinated little nose-pickers can "relate" to, and that's a shame. It bothers me when people defend it by saying "The guys act like teenagers in this show!" because to me, he acts more like he's 10. Even as a high school freshman, literally the only kids I knew who acted like Nick Mikey were the ones who smoked way, waaaaaay too much pot.

First movie Mikey is always the "real" one, in my eyes. He had so much more depth than any other film or cartoon portrayal of the character. Still had the familiar "jokester" elements without being a complete imbecile or man-child. I guess the OT version is my second-favorite, but even then, those pizza jokes got old soooooooo fast.

The main reason 2012 Mikey is still my favorite version is because he's so darn cute XD (the way they designed him!)

.....I know....that's not a good reason......

[Leo656]

Well, to be fair, it's not an entirely irrelevant reason, either. Some of the animation and how they hyper-exaggerate some things for effect is kind of neat, sometimes. It's just that the words coming out of the character's mouth sometimes makes me want to smack him... or the writers who really ought to know better.

It's just more symptomatic of the larger problem, that being that the TMNT franchise has been around for so long now that the characters are devolving into archetypes defined by only one or two dominant traits. Now, granted, it's kind of always been that way, to a point... but at times, like in the movies, we got to see some extra layers to each of them, beyond being "the Jokester", "The Nerd", "The Angry One", etc. And the show doesn't exactly avoid showing depth, but rather, it leans too heavily on some of those simplistic traits at times for comedic effect. They're cheap jokes, and they can do better (and have). They can have Mikey be "funny" without having him act like he's hopped up on Ritalin half the time, y'know?

[MsMarvelDuckie]

YES!!! Agreed, Leo. I keep wishing they would treat him more like he was in the 90 movies (more-so the first and third, since he was more developed in those two) than he is now. I actually liked the new movie for that aspect, in that even though some of his jokes were bad, he KNEW they were bad, and it was part of his "schtick". He was funny, but not dumb. Much closer to the "real" Mikey, as you put it, than any version I've seen since possibly the early seasons of 2K3. He felt like an actual character again- April crush and all.

[IndigoErth]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Even as a high school freshman...

Hmm.. that's a good reference point right there.

Looking at them from the age I am at this point, I've just seen it as, well, they're kids.. they act like kids... And I like that this set actually feels like they're young compared to the other versions who's ages seem pretty vague.

But taking into consideration that they're high school age, yeah... Mikey acts more like he's emotionally stuck back in the 6th grade.

I hope maybe the Nick show will grow them in maturity over time a bit, esp Mikey, assuming the series is hopefully around for a long time. (Would be incredible if a series like this aged them as well visually.) Can't lose him being the jokester, but perhaps morph him into a bit more of a somewhat sophisticated smartass (in a good way)... rather than a dumbass or jackass...

[Leo656]

I think it also bothers me that I've seen SO many shows fall into the "Characters As Types" trap over the years that I've gotten kind of cynical about it (I know, I know, perish the thought. ). Especially when they have a character go far against their established portrayal, simply to fit one of those predetermined "roles" that makes them easier to market.

One of the ones that bothered me the most, despite it being a really good show, was Young Justice, and the way they handled Superboy. They turned him into a "Raph Type", despite that being almost nothing like his established character, and they did it because Kid Flash was already in the "Mikey" role and they figured you don't need two of those. Superboy was always the jokester type in the comics, though, except for a few brief exceptions, and his relationship with Superman was always, always solid. I get that it's "just a different take", but it never really paid off in anything satisfactory, and flew SO far against the grain of the character's established personality, that it was pretty jarring at times. Don't get me wrong, by far one of the better DCU cartoons, but completely changing a major character's personality just because "We already have a clown and we don't need two" rubbed me the wrong way.

It's the same with Mikey, they've decided he's "the village idiot" and structure his role in the stories entirely around that, rather than giving him an actual personality and letting the humor come through more naturally.

[Werecat]

Mikey was always written as comic relief. It is Mikey's character to be silly and lovable. Nick is portraying his character accurately.

[RaphaelinSTL]

Originally Posted by Werecat

Mikey was always written as comic relief. It is Mikey's character to be silly and lovable. Nick is portraying his character accurately.

I think there's a huge difference between silly and lovable and incompetent and borderline idiotic.

Sure, it's lovable...but in the way Rocksteady and Bebop were lovable. Nick is just playing him up for laughs in wrong ways at time.

[Leo656]

Yeah, it's not that the role of being the jokester is bad, just that at times this show overdoes it for the worse. 2K3 was guilty of it at times, too, but not as consistently or noticeably. That show had its own issues with over-playing Raphael as the "angry one" with little to no deeper motivation than that.

Like, in this show, Mikey sometimes doesn't come off as "goofy" as much as just, like, plain stupid. As in unintelligent, which I don't agree with for his portrayal in any media. Now, that's not the case all the time, but sometimes it definitely is, and while I have no problem with him having a little bit of a "relaxed brain", as Rocky would say, I don't like how sometimes they write him as though he's incapable of actual meaningful thought. They do it just often enough so that the rest of the time his goofiness is less funny and more frustrating.

I think overall they're just a step too far left of center, and they wouldn't lose any of the humor if they dialed it down a little bit.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

I know exactly what you mean. One example that really stands out for me is a scene where they were searching in the sewers for something (I forget what, but it was way back early in season 1) and he commented on the smell, and when told what it was, he had no idea what was IN the sewers- even though he'd lived there for 15 years!! That's not humor, that's just stupidity or ignorance- take your pick. He's said things on several occasions that clearly show his lack of intelligence or even basic knowledge that the others all know. It's almost sad.