Does each iteration have their own 80's dimension?

*Metalwolf* · 06-18-2015, 06:56 PM

After thinking about Turtles Forever and it's portrayal of the 87 Turtles, and then later seeing the Nick idea of it, I'm wondering if each iteration actually just has it's own '87 Turtles just like they do of Dimension X.

2k3 has their own version, and it is extremely goofy.

Nick has it's own version, and it has a more different 'feel.'

The next show will probably have it's own version of it, and so on and so forth.

Maybe instead of a true 'Multiverse,' each iteration is it's own 'Prime,' and these other 'universes' are just pocket dimensions that are little more then reflections of the main universe shining back at it.

Any thoughts?

*Powder* · 06-18-2015, 07:00 PM

Nope. That's just a silly way for people who got their knickers in a twist about the OT turtles portrayal in TF to pretend that wasn't their actual precious iteration.

*turtlefanforever* · 06-18-2015, 07:06 PM

that's an interesting idea. it could be. I certainly won't come in here acting all high and mighty like i know everything and telling someone that their feelings are wrong or thoughts are dumb.

My personal opinion is no. But we can't say whats right or wrong cause it hasn't been stated candidly by Kevin or Peter.

*Jephael* · 06-18-2015, 08:08 PM

I kinda like this notion. You can take it who knows where, and not just with the original cartoon. There can be alternate versions of the movie TMNT, Archie comics TMNT and so forth.

*pennydreadful* · 06-18-2015, 08:21 PM

Don't you have anything better to do than keep stalking the guy? Leave him the f*ck alone for gods sake and let it go.

Sincerely - someone who's sick to death of the bitching about TF

~~Leo656~~ · 06-18-2015, 10:49 PM

Did I miss a meeting? What the f*ck is with all the "Suddenly I want to bitch about TF" nonsense? I thought we left that all buried ages ago. I was HOPING, anyway.

I think a few people have finally exhausted all the stale air in their basements and need to go see Mr. Sun. Or at least figure out how to not completely miss the point of things they swear they're experts on. I mean, how embarrassing for you.

*pennydreadful* · 06-18-2015, 10:57 PM

I dunno about missing a meeting, but certainly an interdepartmental memo seems to have gone astray?

*ProactiveMan* · 06-18-2015, 10:59 PM

The animation of the OT Turtles in TF is pretty damn good. When Nick do it, they use that same Flash-style, 'cut-out' animation technique that they use for the cartoons the Turtles watch, which makes it look more like Archer than the OT.

~~Leo656~~ · 06-18-2015, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

I dunno about missing a meeting, but certainly an interdepartmental memo seems to have gone astray?

"My two favorite cartoon shows are making fun of each other! How mean!"

Except not really, and what the f***.

Ceres · 06-19-2015, 03:15 AM

Interesting trail of thoughts, why not? I mean thoughts are free xD. I personally wouldn't mind such a thing, its not like they appear so often these days.

*sdp* · 06-19-2015, 05:50 PM

As much as I hate how the OT turtles were portrayed in Turtles Forever it happened and the whole "they were other turtles similar to the OT but not the actual OT turtles' is a weak argument, I actually prefer the "hit by Krang's giggle ray" theory better.

*Coola Yagami* · 06-19-2015, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProactiveMan

The animation of the OT Turtles in TF is pretty damn good. When Nick do it, they use that same Flash-style, 'cut-out' animation technique that they use for the cartoons the Turtles watch, which makes it look more like Archer than the OT.

Well... it's still a CGI show... they probably have limited traditional animation cause it's all about the CGI.

*chrisdude* · 06-19-2015, 11:21 PM

I like to think these crossovers are OT canon. That's the whole point, right? To revisit? These aren't just Family Guy cutaways. The OT turtles played a big role in Turtles Forever, and the Nick show actually rounded up the voice actors. All of that is undermined if they aren't really the turtles we know and love.

*Metalwolf* · 06-20-2015, 11:00 AM

I think for me, it was something I had thought of because of how different the two portrayals of FW 'acted,' which made me speculate about them ultimately being two actual separate versions. Some of this being that I belong to another fandom (Transformers) that is used to this kind of 'multiversal' stuff, however, it gets weird in places. One theory going around is if Beast Wars is the true 'sequel' to the true 80's G1 cartoon, or if it actually is a sequel to an alternate universe version of the 80's cartoon. It has enough 'canon' elements to be considered a sequel by some, while also having enough stuff never mentioned or hinted at in the OT to be considered not a true sequel by others.

It's the theory that I am taking towards TF with these OT Turtles being just an AU version of them, an idea that I 'borrowed' off of TV Tropes and kind of liked myself.

@ Powder- If you must know my true reasons for not liking the TF movie (besides the minor one of the OT misrepresentation) it's because the movie makes it a point to destroy the 'universes' of the Turtle iterations and then beats you over the head that they are just all products of a comic book (as represented by a comic book universe.) The mashing of the OT Turtles was not nice, but this other part was the actual unpardonable sin. However, I don't mention this last part that much because it's hard, very hard to convey into words what made the movie so unfun to watch, because it is basically saying that their 'multi'-universe is so easily destroyable, their lives so easily erased, and everything about their past, present, and future so easily wiped from existence that made the movie an instant hate. Part of the fun of any universe is that it feels like a living world. When you erase all of that and point to an 'in-universe' literal comic book as the reason it's really not, then it's harder to feel as emotionally invested.

~~Leo656~~ · 06-20-2015, 03:21 PM

Wow, way to over-think it.

*chrisdude* · 06-20-2015, 03:34 PM

I have nothing against speculation or personal interpretation, but it's obvious that these were absolutely meant to be the OT turtles.

*oldmanwinters* · 06-20-2015, 04:26 PM

The multiverse is infinitely in Crisis!

*ProactiveMan* · 06-22-2015, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisdude

the Nick show actually rounded up the voice actors.

Yeah, that was pretty cool.

*Bry* · 06-22-2015, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metalwolf

If you must know my true reasons for not liking the TF movie (besides the minor one of the OT misrepresentation) it's because the movie makes it a point to destroy the 'universes' of the Turtle iterations and then beats you over the head that they are just all products of a comic book (as represented by a comic book universe.)

Except that's actually the case, in real life. Every cartoon, movie, video game, toy, etc, are all products of a comic book. The comic came first, and everything else spun out of it. Turtles Forever just acknowledged that in-story.

Besides, the universes were all restored in the end, so... what's the problem?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metalwolf

However, I don't mention this last part that much because it's hard, very hard to convey into words what made the movie so unfun to watch, because it is basically saying that their 'multi'-universe is so easily destroyable, their lives so easily erased, and everything about their past, present, and future so easily wiped from existence that made the movie an instant hate. Part of the fun of any universe is that it feels like a living world. When you erase all of that and point to an 'in-universe' literal comic book as the reason it's really not, then it's harder to feel as emotionally invested.

Maybe the problem isn't so much that plot point from the movie, but an issue you have with these kinds of crossovers in general? It's a very comic book kind of thing -- hell, right now you can barely buy a Marvel/DC superhero comic without getting an alternate-worlds crossover story involving universes being destroyed or resurrected or both. It's really a "your mileage may vary" kind of thing... some people hate that stuff, some people love it.

Maybe try to look at it a different way - the movie acknowledged that the Mirage comics are the source of the entire multiverse, which is fair and makes sense. But it made a point to show that every version spinning out of it is equally "real" and valid. That's usually the point behind these kind of stories (well, the good ones, anyway): despite where they originated from, every alternate universe is equally "real" in its own story, so that shouldn't take anything away from your enjoyment unless you choose to let it.

The plot is really clever if you get on board. Theres's a reason 2003 Shredder didn't attack the Mirage universe during "Return to New York" or "City at War" or any other point in their history... the only way for him to destroy the entire TMNT multiverse (IE, franchise) was to literally destroy the events of the first-ever comic, the thing that made it all possible. And he failed, thanks to a team-up with the longest-running, arguably most-beloved versions of those characters in the '87 and 2003 cartoon. Everything was restored, their worlds were saved, and they all parted on terms of mutual respect and brotherhood. I will always, always unequivocally love that, and I'd hate to get so caught up on one specific detail that I'd totally miss the big important point at the end.

~~Leo656~~ · 06-22-2015, 11:15 PM

Bry: Keep in mind, TMNT fans in general have a nasty habit of over-emphasizing the importance of TMNT, or how "unique" and "different" or "special" it is. Ultimately, it's just another sci-fi action/adventure comic book story. It's a good one, but it puzzles me greatly how so many fans - many of whom aren't even fans of that kind of fiction AT ALL, oddly enough - will try and elevate it beyond that.

It's unique and special TO THEM, but... it's JUST a comic book action/adventure story, the same as any other. I think that disconnect is why some fans misread the material, or get overly hung up on trivial things, which in turn hampers their enjoyment of it.

But yeah, you hit the nail on the head with just about everything you said.

06-18-2015, 06:56 PM	#1
Metalwolf Mad Scientist Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,563	Does each iteration have their own 80's dimension? After thinking about Turtles Forever and it's portrayal of the 87 Turtles, and then later seeing the Nick idea of it, I'm wondering if each iteration actually just has it's own '87 Turtles just like they do of Dimension X. 2k3 has their own version, and it is extremely goofy. Nick has it's own version, and it has a more different 'feel.' The next show will probably have it's own version of it, and so on and so forth. Maybe instead of a true 'Multiverse,' each iteration is it's own 'Prime,' and these other 'universes' are just pocket dimensions that are little more then reflections of the main universe shining back at it. Any thoughts?

06-18-2015, 07:06 PM	#3
turtlefanforever Foot Elite Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 3,098	hmm that's an interesting idea. it could be. I certainly won't come in here acting all high and mighty like i know everything and telling someone that their feelings are wrong or thoughts are dumb. My personal opinion is no. But we can't say whats right or wrong cause it hasn't been stated candidly by Kevin or Peter.

06-18-2015, 08:08 PM	#4
Jephael That whack job behind you Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Carlisle, Pennsylvania Posts: 8,142	I kinda like this notion. You can take it who knows where, and not just with the original cartoon. There can be alternate versions of the movie TMNT, Archie comics TMNT and so forth. __________________ "I like it. Simple, but effective!" Raphael; The Mean Machines - 1988 Last edited by Jephael; 06-18-2015 at 08:35 PM.

06-18-2015, 08:21 PM	#5
pennydreadful trash Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Australia Posts: 4,546	Don't you have anything better to do than keep stalking the guy? Leave him the fck alone for gods sake and let it go. Sincerely - someone who's sick to death of the bitching about TF __________________ Creator of the Technodrome After Dark Discussion Group. PM for an invite (must be over 18 - no exceptions).*

06-18-2015, 10:57 PM	#7
pennydreadful trash Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Australia Posts: 4,546	I dunno about missing a meeting, but certainly an interdepartmental memo seems to have gone astray? __________________ Creator of the Technodrome After Dark Discussion Group. PM for an invite (must be over 18 - no exceptions).

06-18-2015, 07:00 PM	#2
Powder 40 Years of TMNT Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Shell-Ri-La Posts: 26,945	Nope. That's just a silly way for people who got their knickers in a twist about the OT turtles portrayal in TF to pretend that wasn't their actual precious iteration.

06-18-2015, 10:49 PM	#6
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	Did I miss a meeting? What the f*ck is with all the "Suddenly I want to bitch about TF" nonsense? I thought we left that all buried ages ago. I was HOPING, anyway. I think a few people have finally exhausted all the stale air in their basements and need to go see Mr. Sun. Or at least figure out how to not completely miss the point of things they swear they're experts on. I mean, how embarrassing for you.

06-18-2015, 10:59 PM	#8
ProactiveMan Spooky ghost Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Western Australia Posts: 2,266	The animation of the OT Turtles in TF is pretty damn good. When Nick do it, they use that same Flash-style, 'cut-out' animation technique that they use for the cartoons the Turtles watch, which makes it look more like Archer than the OT. __________________ ProactiveMan!

06-19-2015, 03:15 AM	#10
Ceres Stone Warrior Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Germany Posts: 601	Interesting trail of thoughts, why not? I mean thoughts are free xD. I personally wouldn't mind such a thing, its not like they appear so often these days. __________________ "Shredder, why don't you make love to me anymore?"

06-19-2015, 05:50 PM	#11
sdp Detoxed Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Tokio, Italy Posts: 11,117	As much as I hate how the OT turtles were portrayed in Turtles Forever it happened and the whole "they were other turtles similar to the OT but not the actual OT turtles' is a weak argument, I actually prefer the "hit by Krang's giggle ray" theory better.

06-19-2015, 11:21 PM	#13
chrisdude Foot Elite Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: North Carolina Posts: 2,708	I like to think these crossovers are OT canon. That's the whole point, right? To revisit? These aren't just Family Guy cutaways. The OT turtles played a big role in Turtles Forever, and the Nick show actually rounded up the voice actors. All of that is undermined if they aren't really the turtles we know and love.

06-20-2015, 11:00 AM	#14
Metalwolf Mad Scientist Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,563	I think for me, it was something I had thought of because of how different the two portrayals of FW 'acted,' which made me speculate about them ultimately being two actual separate versions. Some of this being that I belong to another fandom (Transformers) that is used to this kind of 'multiversal' stuff, however, it gets weird in places. One theory going around is if Beast Wars is the true 'sequel' to the true 80's G1 cartoon, or if it actually is a sequel to an alternate universe version of the 80's cartoon. It has enough 'canon' elements to be considered a sequel by some, while also having enough stuff never mentioned or hinted at in the OT to be considered not a true sequel by others. It's the theory that I am taking towards TF with these OT Turtles being just an AU version of them, an idea that I 'borrowed' off of TV Tropes and kind of liked myself. @ Powder- If you must know my true reasons for not liking the TF movie (besides the minor one of the OT misrepresentation) it's because the movie makes it a point to destroy the 'universes' of the Turtle iterations and then beats you over the head that they are just all products of a comic book (as represented by a comic book universe.) The mashing of the OT Turtles was not nice, but this other part was the actual unpardonable sin. However, I don't mention this last part that much because it's hard, very hard to convey into words what made the movie so unfun to watch, because it is basically saying that their 'multi'-universe is so easily destroyable, their lives so easily erased, and everything about their past, present, and future so easily wiped from existence that made the movie an instant hate. Part of the fun of any universe is that it feels like a living world. When you erase all of that and point to an 'in-universe' literal comic book as the reason it's really not, then it's harder to feel as emotionally invested.

06-20-2015, 03:21 PM	#15
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	Wow, way to over-think it.

06-20-2015, 03:34 PM	#16
chrisdude Foot Elite Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: North Carolina Posts: 2,708	I have nothing against speculation or personal interpretation, but it's obvious that these were absolutely meant to be the OT turtles.

06-20-2015, 04:26 PM	#17
oldmanwinters Overlord Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Between yesterday and tomorrow! Posts: 15,449	The multiverse is infinitely in Crisis! __________________ Experience the TMNT Fan Commentaries! Check out my TMNT fan comic, "Nothing to Fear"! View my sketch work! I'm selling some of my hard-to-find TMNT items!

06-22-2015, 11:15 PM	#20
~~Leo656~~ Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,703	Bry: Keep in mind, TMNT fans in general have a nasty habit of over-emphasizing the importance of TMNT, or how "unique" and "different" or "special" it is. Ultimately, it's just another sci-fi action/adventure comic book story. It's a good one, but it puzzles me greatly how so many fans - many of whom aren't even fans of that kind of fiction AT ALL, oddly enough - will try and elevate it beyond that. It's unique and special TO THEM, but... it's JUST a comic book action/adventure story, the same as any other. I think that disconnect is why some fans misread the material, or get overly hung up on trivial things, which in turn hampers their enjoyment of it. But yeah, you hit the nail on the head with just about everything you said.