Divide and Conquer (1987) vs Wedding Bells and Bytes (2003)

[FredWolfLeonardo]

Both were the final episodes of each series. Which one do you think is better though?

[Jephael]

Kind of a toss up. On one had, the Fred Wolf cartoon's series finale wrapped up the Dregg arc in an interesting way, while still allowing room for a possible 11th season. Similarly, the 4Kids episode brought everything full circle by having nearly everybody the TMNT befriended in that iteration shoe up, (with the exception of Quarry/Sydney and the other de-mutated Foot creatures stuck in the underground city). Also keep in mind Turtles Forever itself was more the series finale than that wedding episode.

[CyberCubed]

Both were just alright. Not what I would have imagined as the series finale for either series, but they wrapped up their arcs alright. As said, Turtles Forever worked as the true finale of the 4kids series too.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

Originally Posted by Jephael

Kind of a toss up. On one had, the Fred Wolf cartoon's series finale wrapped up the Dregg arc in an interesting way, while still allowing room for a possible 11th season. Similarly, the 4Kids episode brought everything full circle by having nearly everybody the TMNT befriended in that iteration shoe up, (with the exception of Quarry/Sydney and the other de-mutated Foot creatures stuck in the underground city). Also keep in mind Turtles Forever itself was more the series finale than that wedding episode.

True, but I chose Wedding Bells and Bytes since it was an episode and not a movie, and people could also argue that TF was not just a finale to the 2k3 series, but the 80s series as well since it was a love letter to everything Turtles for its 25th anniversary.

[Ulisa]

I enjoy both but I think I tend to prefer "Divide and Conquer" because it felt more "finale" to me.

"Wedding Bells and Bytes" felt rushed to me and like they were trying to cram in as many characters as they could. While understandable for a wedding episode, it still felt a little off. If they'd split it into two episodes and could have spaced things out/slowed things down some, it probably would have flowed better to me.

"Divide and Conquer" I felt wrapped up the series well with the defeat of Dregg and it felt like how a series finale for something like TMNT would be--they don't get a huge thank-you from the city or anything, they just do what they have to do. I also LOVE that Splinter tells the turtles he is no longer their Sensei because they are now his equals. That to me is what really seals the 'finale' feeling

[Prowler]

While Divide and Conquer was a pretty good episode, back when I first watched it, I was disappointed that it was the final episode of the FW series, because I had always imagined it would have the Turtles finally defeating Shredder and Krang. Perhaps they originally planned for season eight to be the final one and Turtle Trek the very last episode. That episode had a very "final episode" vibe to it.

[oldmanwinters]

Neither episode was great, IMO. 4Kids was a big fan service with all the characters reappearing as wedding guests and Splinter finally getting saved and a big fight, but I thought having all the diverse characters together was a bit too cliche and probably diminished them a bit by having them be out of character... Karai and Chapman... really?

So I'll go with the Fred Wolf finale. The Dregg episodes aren't my favorite but it was really rare for a popular Saturday morning cartoon to receive a finale in those days, so it feels kinda special. It was also the conclusion to a rare multi-episode arc and featured some great moments like Splinter telling his turtles that they had matured enough that they no longer needed call him sensei. Very much in character, all things considered.

[CyberCubed]

Makes you wonder if the Nick cartoon's final episode will be big or important, and better than the previous cartoon finale's. I guess we'll find out by the end of this year...

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by oldmanwinters

Neither episode was great, IMO. 4Kids was a big fan service with all the characters reappearing as wedding guests and Splinter finally getting saved and a big fight, but I thought having all the diverse characters together was a bit too cliche and probably diminished them a bit by having them be out of character... Karai and Chapman... really?

So I'll go with the Fred Wolf finale. The Dregg episodes aren't my favorite but it was really rare for a popular Saturday morning cartoon to receive a finale in those days, so it feels kinda special. It was also the conclusion to a rare multi-episode arc and featured some great moments like Splinter telling his turtles that they had matured enough that they no longer needed call him sensei. Very much in character, all things considered.

Yeah, I had high hopes for the eventual final 2k3 series episode and all I got was a meh wedding episode. In comparison, the FW series had a kickass final episode.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by Prowler

Yeah, I had high hopes for the eventual final 2k3 series episode and all I got was a meh wedding episode. In comparison, the FW series had a kickass final episode.

As said, Turtles Forever is the true finale of the 4kids series anyway.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by oldmanwinters

Neither episode was great, IMO. 4Kids was a big fan service with all the characters reappearing as wedding guests and Splinter finally getting saved and a big fight, but I thought having all the diverse characters together was a bit too cliche and probably diminished them a bit by having them be out of character... Karai and Chapman... really?

So I'll go with the Fred Wolf finale. The Dregg episodes aren't my favorite but it was really rare for a popular Saturday morning cartoon to receive a finale in those days, so it feels kinda special. It was also the conclusion to a rare multi-episode arc and featured some great moments like Splinter telling his turtles that they had matured enough that they no longer needed call him sensei. Very much in character, all things considered.

Well put, I agree.

[snake]

Thirding what OMW said. 4kids is a bit of a let down. Like a "that's it?" type feel.

[pferreira]

Originally Posted by Prowler

While Divide and Conquer was a pretty good episode, back when I first watched it, I was disappointed that it was the final episode of the FW series, because I had always imagined it would have the Turtles finally defeating Shredder and Krang. Perhaps they originally planned for season eight to be the final one and Turtle Trek the very last episode. That episode had a very "final episode" vibe to it.

Yeah I have to agree there.

[Yabuturtle]

I think Divide and Conquer had more of a finale feel to me. Dregg was killed, or at least it was heavily implied that he was and Splinter sees the Turtles as equals and not students.

But Shredder and Krang were never really stopped for good, just sent to Dimension X with a broken down Technodrome

I felt as if there was an 11th season it would involve Krang and Shredder returning, but this time, nearly conquering the world as they overrun the city with Rock Soldier and Foot Soldiers, old friends return to fight like Casey Jones, Usagi, Mondo Gecko and even the Punk Frogs. Even Carter would return one last time from the future to help out.

It would end with them beating the armies, Splinter finally defeating and killing Shredder and the Technodrome is destroyed and they think they defeated Krang but Krang comes out of the rubble and grows into a giant like he did before and they finally defeat and kill Krang together.

I think that would have made a more satisfying ending.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by Prowler

While Divide and Conquer was a pretty good episode, back when I first watched it, I was disappointed that it was the final episode of the FW series, because I had always imagined it would have the Turtles finally defeating Shredder and Krang.

The irony of course is that three episodes prior to "Divide and Conquer", that's kind of what we got. The Turtles of two timelines joining together to send Dregg, Shredder and Krang packing to Dimension X, destroying Dregg's starship and the teleporter, and Carter left the group too.

Yeah, Carter would have gotten the last line of the series if it ended there, but ending the series on "see you in the future" had a nice meta-ring to it

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

The irony of course is that three episodes prior to "Divide and Conquer", that's kind of what we got. The Turtles of two timelines joining together to send Dregg, Shredder and Krang packing to Dimension X, destroying Dregg's starship and the teleporter, and Carter left the group too.

Yeah, Carter would have gotten the last line of the series if it ended there, but ending the series on "see you in the future" had a nice meta-ring to it

That's cool, man. I never really looked at it that way.

[CyberCubed]

I think the only problem is "Mobster from Dimension X" had no business being the third to last ep of the series. If it was say moved to the third episode of Season 10 or something, the last few episodes would have flowed a lot better.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by ToTheNines

That's cool, man. I never really looked at it that way.

Yeah, but Carter ending the series would have been kind ov... I dunno, underwhelming?

I liked how Shredder and Krang worked well together in that 3 parter and got one last hurrah. But it was funny Krang calling Dregg "mad" for wanting to set Earth on fire... sure Krang the worst you've done was revert its gravity and provoke big ass earthquakes. What does that make you, then, huh?

Btw I've thought that the Day the Earth Disappeared could have made a good final episode. I mean doesn't Dregg's ship get sucked into a blackhole or something? How did he and Mung survive THAT?

[neatoman]

Hm... Wedding Bells and Bytes might be a bit of a letdown and combining the final fight with a wedding episode is... Odd... But I guess seeing Casey and April get married is something of a fitting ending.

Divide and Conquer is a bit rushed, Dregg's scheme seemed to come out of nowhere and the fact that it's Dregg instead of Shredder/Krang (who just kind of faded away a few episodes earlier) seems a bit wrong. Still, I don't have very high expectations of the FW show to begin with and ending it with Splinter considering the Turtles' training over seems like a decent way to end things (even if that too just kind of happens just because).

I realise neither one of these episodes were probably intended to truly be the final episode, just conclusive enough in case they weren't renewed for another season.

Seriously, go watch "Shredder Triumphant!" and "Turtle Trek" of the FW cartoon, then "Exodus, Part 2" and "Enter the Dragons, Part 2" of the 4Kids show. They all end like that.

[cammy85]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I think the only problem is "Mobster from Dimension X" had no business being the third to last ep of the series. If it was say moved to the third episode of Season 10 or something, the last few episodes would have flowed a lot better.

I don't think it was planned that way. The whole point of "Mobster" IMO was to have the Globfather work for a mysterious "alien benefactor". In other words: Krang or Dregg. The transporter energy was a big clue, however the two sides were ready to destroy each other by then, so you never know. The official site ruined it prior to its premiere, however. But really: if he was working for Shredder and Krang, that didn't give them enough time to establish a story before the season wrapped.