Japanese or English?

*Original TMNT Cartoon Fan* · 05-31-2017, 12:09 PM

When the turtles are in the lair with Splinter, do they speak Japanese or English? Even if it's English to us, can we be sure it's in-universe?

*Tetsu Deinonychus* · 05-31-2017, 12:33 PM

I do like the idea that they speak Japanese when it's just them and Splinter, but the "teen slang" they use at times suggests otherwise.

I like to think they can speak both, though.

*IndigoErth* · 05-31-2017, 12:40 PM

Hmm. Interesting question as far as '87 goes. I've assumed it for probably being like other versions that use a lot of English with some Japanese thrown in.

Would be beneficial to raise them fluent in English for their own safety in the world above them, thus using English a lot at home from the time they were little. But can't see Splinter not raising them to be by lingual in his own language, and on the other hand, being able to be fluent in a language less commonly understood around there would also be a plus if they were within earshot of anyone who shouldn't be in on what they're saying. Perfect way for Leo to give team commands around non-Japanese speaking enemies. And I'm sure good fluency probably needs to be learned at home.

I vote a solid "both."

*Utrommaniac* · 05-31-2017, 01:22 PM

For my personal take, they absolutely would speak both, and probably in the same mix of ways that most fluently bilingual families talk to each other in the exchange of their two different languages. Splinter would see the need for them to understand English, but also wouldn't want to separate them from the heritage he was raising them on. (On that subject, Splinter assumes Shredder is dead in my take, and teaches them martial arts while in the sewers because he feels it's the biggest family tradition he can pass on to them, since he lacks most of his family's possessions save for the weapons - which he of course has to teach them to use anyway. So he might as well go for the full works)

But the turtles would speak to April and Casey exclusively in English -save for Japanese grumblings if they feel the need to backtalk them without noticing. They'd also speak to Shredder and Karai in Japanese.

I can see Donatello wanting to learn more languages, and probably learns some Latin from the scientist April, who isn't exactly the best teacher in that aspect, but can give him the basics for him to pick up the rest of himself.

*Original TMNT Cartoon Fan* · 05-31-2017, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

Hmm. Interesting question as far as '87 goes."

This is for any series. It's under "General TMNT discussion".

*neatoman* · 05-31-2017, 01:27 PM

Interesting question, I can't think of any direct evidence against it.

*IndigoErth* · 05-31-2017, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Original TMNT Cartoon Fan

This is for any series. It's under "General TMNT discussion".

Why it is more an unknown for the first cartoon imo, as I don't recall much use of Japanese between Splinter and the Turtles there, so... maybe?

The two other cartoons we have (so far) already throw in some Japanese (albeit not a lot), so I take it as their spoken English really is English, not just viewer convenience; since both are already present in those series.

Edit: Although '87 Splinter's Japanese should be a little questionable, given the times he's shouted "Sacagawea!" before attacking. lol (Though I assume that is just mostly cluless late 80s/early 90s writers trying to be silly...)

*sdp* · 05-31-2017, 01:43 PM

I don't think of the turtles as knowing Japanese, at least in the animated shows, movies and few comics that I'm familiar with there has never been evidence besides that Splinter should or could know.

*CyberCubed* · 05-31-2017, 01:48 PM

This is something Pete/Kevin probably never realized when creating the franchise. You make a series where Splinter was owned by a Japanese man and thus should speak Japanese. He should also bring up the Turtles speaking Japanese as his sons. But the Turtles speak like American teenagers.

TMNT was created before the whole anime craze hit the U.S., I don't think Peter or Kevin even knew what anime was back in 1984...hell the Dragonball manga didn't even start till 1986.

*Tetsu Deinonychus* · 05-31-2017, 01:50 PM

The 4kids series had them knowing at least a little Japanese.

*sdp* · 05-31-2017, 01:53 PM

I'm sure they knew what manga was but they just didn't care enough.

Bilingual families also don't just speak both languages necessarily, I'd guess it's usually one that is spoken. My family is a test to that and I know of others that are similar.

Also Splinter was a Japanese rat but he mutated in the US, so as he mutated I guess that's where he might've learned from books or what not same with the turtles, they learned from American media. I do think Splinter would know Japanese but only him I would guess. Obviously in the OT he knew Japanese but he just didn't pass that knowledge off.

*Andrew NDB* · 05-31-2017, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

This is something Pete/Kevin probably never realized when creating the franchise. You make a series where Splinter was owned by a Japanese man and thus should speak Japanese.

Doubtful. Any kind of language would have had to have been developed in New York, just from hearing people talk, TV, and stringing sentences together. I doubt Splinter or the Turtles even ever knew how to speak full-on Japanese. Maybe later in life.

*Tetsu Deinonychus* · 05-31-2017, 01:55 PM

They were fans of the classic Samurai manga "Lone Wolf and Cub" at least.

And, if Splinter can pick up Ninjutsu from Yoshi, I think he can pick up Japanese from Yoshi (even if it didn't make sense until after he mautated).

*plastroncafe* · 05-31-2017, 01:58 PM

Splinter is usually portrayed as speaking accented English, which makes me think his first language is something other than English. Where as the turtles don't get the same affectation.

I've always assumed Splinter to be bilingual, with the turtles being varying levels of bilingual depending, but that at home they're likely to speak more English than anything.

*Andrew NDB* · 05-31-2017, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

Splinter is usually portrayed as speaking accented English, which makes me think his first language is something other than English. Where as the turtles don't get the same affectation.

Splinter doesn't have an accent in the comics. And I'm pretty sure he has a Japanese accent in the cartoons and movies because Fred Wolf did it, and Fred Wolf wanted him to be Mr. Miyagi. Now everyone expects him to sound like that.

Quote:

I've always assumed Splinter to be bilingual, with the turtles being varying levels of bilingual depending, but that at home they're likely to speak more English than anything.

I figure in his spare time when he wasn't whipping the Turtles into killing shape he probably read up on Japan, the culture, the history, and maybe began to learn the language... but I hardly think it was his first language or this thing that's embedded in him.

*CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy* · 05-31-2017, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Splinter doesn't have an accent in the comics. And I'm pretty sure he has a Japanese accent in the cartoons and movies because Fred Wolf did it, and Fred Wolf wanted him to be Mr. Miyagi. Now everyone expects him to sound like that.

I figure in his spare time when he wasn't whipping the Turtles into killing shape he probably read up on Japan, the culture, the history, and maybe began to learn the language... but I hardly think it was his first language or this thing that's embedded in him.

Depends on if he was Splinter the normal rat or Hamato Yoshi before mutation.

The normal rat? Then seeing how he only understood language in America, he shouldn't have an accent. (Mirage, 4Kids.)

Everything else, he is Hamato Yoshi first... so definitely Japanese as his first language.

*Andrew NDB* · 05-31-2017, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

Everything else, he is Hamato Yoshi first... so definitely Japanese as his first language.

That goes without saying.

DisKosh · 05-31-2017, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tetsu Deinonychus

I do like the idea that they speak Japanese when it's just them and Splinter, but the "teen slang" they use at times suggests otherwise.

Not necessarily, sometimes people blend languages or speak in one language most of the time but break it for certain phrases. For instance, if you watch the Korean TV show Boys Over Flowers, they speak in Korean but occasionally an English phrase will slip in.

I imagine it's similar for the turtles.

*Original TMNT Cartoon Fan* · 05-31-2017, 03:13 PM

Not to mention the how it would rock with more of the man against man-fights between Shredder and Splinter in Japanese.

*plastroncafe* · 05-31-2017, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Splinter doesn't have an accent in the comics. And I'm pretty sure he has a Japanese accent in the cartoons and movies because Fred Wolf did it, and Fred Wolf wanted him to be Mr. Miyagi. Now everyone expects him to sound like that.

Not like say Banshee in X-Men, but I'd say an argument for accented English could be made from the cadence of his speech patterns.

Splinter might be a riff on Miller's Stick, but he's got more in common with the tropes Old Master and Magical Asian.

05-31-2017, 12:09 PM	#1
Original TMNT Cartoon Fan Overlord Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sweden Posts: 10,481	Japanese or English? When the turtles are in the lair with Splinter, do they speak Japanese or English? Even if it's English to us, can we be sure it's in-universe?

05-31-2017, 12:33 PM	#2
Tetsu Deinonychus The Iron Dinosaur Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Studio Snowlion HQ Posts: 3,021	I do like the idea that they speak Japanese when it's just them and Splinter, but the "teen slang" they use at times suggests otherwise. I like to think they can speak both, though. __________________ (Image hosting by Postimage.org) And here's a list of all my old wacky threads!

05-31-2017, 01:22 PM	#4
Utrommaniac Resident overthinker Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: what is going on.......... Posts: 5,318	For my personal take, they absolutely would speak both, and probably in the same mix of ways that most fluently bilingual families talk to each other in the exchange of their two different languages. Splinter would see the need for them to understand English, but also wouldn't want to separate them from the heritage he was raising them on. (On that subject, Splinter assumes Shredder is dead in my take, and teaches them martial arts while in the sewers because he feels it's the biggest family tradition he can pass on to them, since he lacks most of his family's possessions save for the weapons - which he of course has to teach them to use anyway. So he might as well go for the full works) But the turtles would speak to April and Casey exclusively in English -save for Japanese grumblings if they feel the need to backtalk them without noticing. They'd also speak to Shredder and Karai in Japanese. I can see Donatello wanting to learn more languages, and probably learns some Latin from the scientist April, who isn't exactly the best teacher in that aspect, but can give him the basics for him to pick up the rest of himself. __________________ DeviantART

05-31-2017, 01:43 PM	#8
sdp Detoxed Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Tokio, Italy Posts: 11,216	I don't think of the turtles as knowing Japanese, at least in the animated shows, movies and few comics that I'm familiar with there has never been evidence besides that Splinter should or could know. __________________ *Trapt* *urself Page MiscRave!!!* Click to join The Drome Discord server

05-31-2017, 01:50 PM	#10
Tetsu Deinonychus The Iron Dinosaur Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Studio Snowlion HQ Posts: 3,021	The 4kids series had them knowing at least a little Japanese. __________________ (Image hosting by Postimage.org) And here's a list of all my old wacky threads!

05-31-2017, 12:40 PM	#3
IndigoErth Team Blue Boy Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: U.S., East Coast Posts: 16,295	Hmm. Interesting question as far as '87 goes. I've assumed it for probably being like other versions that use a lot of English with some Japanese thrown in. Would be beneficial to raise them fluent in English for their own safety in the world above them, thus using English a lot at home from the time they were little. But can't see Splinter not raising them to be by lingual in his own language, and on the other hand, being able to be fluent in a language less commonly understood around there would also be a plus if they were within earshot of anyone who shouldn't be in on what they're saying. Perfect way for Leo to give team commands around non-Japanese speaking enemies. And I'm sure good fluency probably needs to be learned at home. I vote a solid "both."

05-31-2017, 01:48 PM	#9
CyberCubed Overlord Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 43,872	This is something Pete/Kevin probably never realized when creating the franchise. You make a series where Splinter was owned by a Japanese man and thus should speak Japanese. He should also bring up the Turtles speaking Japanese as his sons. But the Turtles speak like American teenagers. TMNT was created before the whole anime craze hit the U.S., I don't think Peter or Kevin even knew what anime was back in 1984...hell the Dragonball manga didn't even start till 1986.

05-31-2017, 01:53 PM	#11
sdp Detoxed Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Tokio, Italy Posts: 11,216	I'm sure they knew what manga was but they just didn't care enough. Bilingual families also don't just speak both languages necessarily, I'd guess it's usually one that is spoken. My family is a test to that and I know of others that are similar. Also Splinter was a Japanese rat but he mutated in the US, so as he mutated I guess that's where he might've learned from books or what not same with the turtles, they learned from American media. I do think Splinter would know Japanese but only him I would guess. Obviously in the OT he knew Japanese but he just didn't pass that knowledge off. __________________ *Trapt* *urself Page MiscRave!!!* Click to join The Drome Discord server

05-31-2017, 01:55 PM	#13
Tetsu Deinonychus The Iron Dinosaur Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Studio Snowlion HQ Posts: 3,021	They were fans of the classic Samurai manga "Lone Wolf and Cub" at least. And, if Splinter can pick up Ninjutsu from Yoshi, I think he can pick up Japanese from Yoshi (even if it didn't make sense until after he mautated). __________________ (Image hosting by Postimage.org) And here's a list of all my old wacky threads!

05-31-2017, 03:13 PM	#19
Original TMNT Cartoon Fan Overlord Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sweden Posts: 10,481	Not to mention the how it would rock with more of the man against man-fights between Shredder and Splinter in Japanese.