The CONFIRMED New Season

[gobo]

Still don't appreciate the new April design. It disturbs me. :(

[ZariusTwo]

Rumour has it April's original design denied Superboy-Prime a date, he was drunk...retcon punch drunk

[Coola Yagami]

Still don't appreciate the new April design. It disturbs me. :(

new april design???? where???

[aprilsfan]

http://the-5th-turtle.blogspot.com/2007/11/2k8-sneak-peek2.html

[Spawn Guy]

Rumour has it April's original design denied Superboy-Prime a date, he was drunk...retcon punch drunk

April O'Neil: Year One. Coming soon.

[Warhorse]

here is it, basically the 2k3 version is getting a fast forward redesign it's not that bad, just very different.

http://the-5th-turtle.blogspot.com/2007/11/2k8-sneak-peek2.html

http://the-5th-turtle.blogspot.com/2007/10/sneak-peek.html


Hey, looks like the Turtles might get pupils in this new style.

[gobo]

The pupils are a maybe. I have a feeling tradition may win out on that one.

[Fledermaus]

Um... no offense, aprilsfan, but that is very old news.

It starts on page 15 (http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=22174&page=15) of this thread.

[Coola Yagami]

here is it, basically the 2k3 version is getting a fast forward redesign it's not that bad, just very different.

http://the-5th-turtle.blogspot.com/2007/11/2k8-sneak-peek2.html

http://the-5th-turtle.blogspot.com/2007/10/sneak-peek.html

I see no new April design... just the same ol Leo pic we've been seeing since last month... where's APRIL?

[Roseangelo]

I see no new April design... just the same ol Leo pic we've been seeing since last month... where's APRIL?

Click the first link, which has also been available for a month.

[Coola Yagami]

Ahhh now I saw em. Interesting... Casey looks beefier, but obviously wearing the movie design. April could have been wearing the movie outfit (not the ninja clothing mind you, but I mean the green shirt and stuff), but yeah, she needs to hit BK a few times...

[aprilsfan]

sorry for the confusion guys, i wont do it again. :)

[Ra]

Na, it's cool. These things happen. ;)

I still think April needs to go on a 100% McDonalds diet plan to get a little bit fatter...I mean...cripes, that is just unhealthy...

[Drtooth]

I still think April needs to go on a 100% McDonalds diet plan to get a little bit fatter...I mean...cripes, that is just unhealthy...

I wish I could find a picture of the April "Mighty Bean" to post a sarcastic comeback to that.... I really do....

[Ra]

Then do it man! Do it! :lol:

[BubblyShell22]

Well, these might be test designs. April does look thinner than she did before, so she does need to be fleshed out a bit.

[AquaParade]

These are probably just prototypes. I'm not saying they'll be radically different when the show hits, but I think we can all be sure, that they'll have time to change things, and they will probably come out looking just slightly different, so dont give up hope on april gaining a few pounds...and maybe casey getting some dirt on his shirt:D

[Rooish]

I hope they do get pupils. Pupils are way warmer and more expressive.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, pupils would look cool, but it doesn't matter to me whether they have them or not. Either way, they're still the TMNT.

[Splinter's Iroonna]

Posted at ninjaturtles.com today (hope I'm not double-posting)

TV News

Fall ’07: Fast Forward is 4Kids TV’s top rated show! On November 10, 2007 the show received a 2.6 for Boys 6-11 and a 2.8 for Boys 2-5 which were the highest ratings in the block!

Spring ’08: 4Kids TV will be airing a series of 12 never before seen ‘lost episodes’ called “Ninja Tribunals."

Fall ’08: 13 new episodes and a brand new toy line are in development for Season 7:

When the Turtles return from the future to their present time, Viral interferes causing Master Splinter to get trapped in cyberspace, bits of his data code scattered all throughout the digital domain. The Turtles must find a way to access the virtual realm so they can gather Splinter’s code and save their beloved father before he is lost to them forever...


Thoughts?

[Sage Ninja]

well...it looks like it could be more sci-fi than I thought, but I'm going to give it a chance before passing judgment.

[Fledermaus]

Digi-turd, digital turtles, Digi-turd are the CHAMPIONS! *dun! dun!*

Digi-turd, digital turtles, Digi-turd are the CHAMPIONS! *dun! dun!*

Save their beloved Master Splinter
To save the digital

WORLD.

Digi-turd, digital turtles, Digi-turd are the CHAMPIONS! *dun! dun!*

Digi-turd, digital turtles

DIGI-TURD!!

[Stephen]

Cody's decompiler obviously didn't do a very thorough job of getting rid of Viral ......

[triplexxx]

Digi-turd, digital turtles, Digi-turd are the CHAMPIONS! *dun! dun!*

Digi-turd, digital turtles, Digi-turd are the CHAMPIONS! *dun! dun!*

Save their beloved Master Splinter
To save the digital

WORLD.

Digi-turd, digital turtles, Digi-turd are the CHAMPIONS! *dun! dun!*

Digi-turd, digital turtles

DIGI-TURD!!
lmao, Oh please.

Splinter: She tore my legs out and she threw them over there, then she took my chest out and threw it up there.
Turtles: Well, that's you all over. She sure knocked the stuffing out of you didn't she?

[gobo]

Putrescent should be thrilled to hear that Viral's still alive.

[Splinter's Iroonna]

Putrescent should be thrilled to hear that Viral's still alive.

Well, that makes one of us. :P


Seriously-- they share pics that give me some hope regarding the season, then they pull a "stunt" like this-- this is just Search for Splinter all over again, only bit by rodent bit (or is it byte by rodent byte?).

[The Shelf]

Well, at least that explains why Splinter doesn't make it back and why Serling needs to go back with them. It's likely that Serling may be some sort of key to bringing Splinter back. I'm sure in the finale, the turtles will save Splinter, and Serling will be free to go back to the future where he belongs. Or perhaps the writers will keep him around just for laughs. Anyway, sounds interesting.

Heh, Digi-turds, hehe. Y'know, it's a shame Digimon didn't turn out better than it was. That show had so much potential. Oh well.

[Spitfire]

Woah cool Viral is still alive, though I wonder how they will explain that. I guess because she's a file it's possible she uploaded copies of herself into systems she's hacked into.

[VaughnMichael]

Putrescent should be thrilled to hear that Viral's still alive.
To be honest Gobo I'm not, Death has become such a joke in this series..
And Shredder is coming the F back you have to being friggin kidding me.:roll:
As much as I like Viral this is complete bull.
Woah cool Viral is still alive, though I wonder how they will explain that. I guess because she's a file it's possible she uploaded copies of herself into systems she's hacked into.
pft..thats a good idea spit but I'm sure the series wont be that smart about it...

[Cure]

How did she "die" again? I forget.

[VaughnMichael]

How did she "die" again? I forget.
Serling Decompiled her and poof she died and I cried a lone tear for Viral.:lol:

oooo and btw for anyone who was wonder what I was talking about when I brough up shredder..
Fall ’08: Two new Playmates toy lines are in development for Fall 2008 in support of the new episodes. The Sub-Sewer line features the Turtles and their underground gear while the Iron Mutant line has the Turtles armed and ready for battle with Shredder

[Jester]

EDIT: I need to learn to read...I said nothing.

[Scandia]

It could be to battle the Season 5 Shredder.

[gobo]

Oh. I thought you meant the fact that Shredder keeps coming back in one form or another. That's was a bit tiresome.

[Jester]

It could be to battle the Season 5 Shredder.
Maybe they are gonna finally release Tribunal figures! Why didn't I think of that...

[VaughnMichael]

Oh. I thought you meant the fact that Shredder keeps coming back in one form or another. That's was a bit tiresome.
it is indeed, and baxter over and over..I hope viral doesn't become the next baxter/shredder.
Maybe they are gonna finally release Tribunal figures! Why didn't I think of that...
Because that'd be to easy for them to do...they'll release 20 more motor cycle figures and maybe some more dinos when the ninja tribunal episodes are on tv.:lol:

[Masked Ninja]

Hm...

So when they find a piece of Master Splinter, does Don store it on a Flash drive? Or is it pleasant little lump of rat?

...

I'm not even sure what to think. I suppose I'll wait for it, watch it, and let that decide for me, heh. :trazz:

[Whitewolf89]

Posted at ninjaturtles.com today (hope I'm not double-posting)

TV News

Fall ’07: Fast Forward is 4Kids TV’s top rated show! On November 10, 2007 the show received a 2.6 for Boys 6-11 and a 2.8 for Boys 2-5 which were the highest ratings in the block!

Spring ’08: Spring ’08: 4Kids TV will be airing a series of 12 never before seen ‘lost episodes’ called “Ninja Tribunals."

Fall ’08: 13 new episodes and a brand new toy line are in development for Season 7:

When the Turtles return from the future to their present time, Viral interferes causing Master Splinter to get trapped in cyberspace, bits of his data code scattered all throughout the digital domain. The Turtles must find a way to access the virtual realm so they can gather Splinter’s code and save their beloved father before he is lost to them forever...


Thoughts?

Aw, shoot, you beat me TO it, Splinter's Iroona! I didn't think anyone had even SEEN this news yet! Shoulda KNOWN, I guess.........:lol:

Anyway, I'm honestly not sure yet HOW I feel about this. It's a BIT better than the "Splinter staying in the future with Cody, while Serling comes to the present with the boys" scenario, but NOT by MUCH!

Although I suppose that it's okay.

About the ONLY caveat that I have with this idea (so far) is that I thought that they got RID of Viral back in the "Day of Awakening" ep, and, as Viral is yet ANOTHER TMNT villian that I absolutely LOATHE, I'm decidedly NOT happy about HER being back in the 2k8 season. Truthfully (and this is saying something, given how much I absolutely hate HER!), I think I'd rather see KARAI come back on a regular basis in the series.

And that's MY 2 cents. For now, anyway.;)

[VaughnMichael]

Hm...

So when they find a piece of Master Splinter, does Don store it on a Flash drive? Or is it pleasant little lump of rat?

...

I'm not even sure what to think. I suppose I'll wait for it, watch it, and let that decide for me, heh. :trazz:
If that idea doesn't scream marketing idea I don't know what does.
TMNT Flash Drives...you know you'd buy em' :lol:

[Fledermaus]

If that idea doesn't scream marketing idea I don't know what does.
TMNT Flas Drives...you know you'd buy em' :lol:

TMNT: Flash Drive

The new subtitle of the series.

[Scandia]

Honestly I thought Viral was gone.

And how can you trap an organic being in a digital realm?

I do not know which one of the two was worse. And I hope that this plotline does not last 13 episodes. It is WAY too different from Mirage.

[ZariusTwo]

trooper Transform!

L_19qySUrzY

[Splinter's Iroonna]

Honestly I thought Viral was gone.

And how can you trap an organic being in a digital realm?

I do not know which one of the two was worse. And I hope that this plotline does not last 13 episodes. It is WAY too different from Mirage.

It sounds almost like that first pitch Mirage received, about making it like "Card Capture" or "Chaotic"-- They've turned Splinter into a "Gotta collect 'em all" type of crusade.

And White Wolf-- sorry about that! :p

[ZariusTwo]

True. It's like telling Splinter to step on a landmine and spend weeks collecting all the peices.

[AquaParade]

Eh, strange news, I'm pretty much ok with it, as long as it does'nt involve them in a bunch of cyber computer worlds to fight evil virus's and befriend firewalls on...which it probably will....:| But really, as long as they return to a slightly more mature tone and can pump out a little more darkness out of the tmnt, I'll be very happy. The movie being darker was a big part of the reemergence of the property, so I think we'll get a bit of that in the new show.

[Scandia]

More than Card Captor Sakura it sounds like Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicles, where they are capturing feathers that are Sakura's memories.

Now where did they pull this from exactly? I know they need some sort of bridge transition. But I would have been perfectly happy with a smooth and seamless return to present time and their having new episodes based on Mirage comics.

[ZariusTwo]

F*ck the comics, go for originality.

[Jester]

You mean VR Troopers originality?

[Scandia]

Of all the Power Rangers rip-off shows that were popular around 93-94, VR Troopers was the absolute worst one.

So yeah, that would make it even lamer.

[Lord Nightwalker]

TMNT: Flash Drive

The new subtitle of the series.


LOL. That's pretty good.

[ZariusTwo]

Of all the Power Rangers rip-off shows that were popular around 93-94, VR Troopers was the absolute worst one.

So yeah, that would make it even lamer.

Which is proof you didnt watch it that long or couldnt see past the talking dog, which makes your arguents even lamer.

And Troopers was made by the same company, do your homework

[Mr. Stay Puft]

Which is proof you didnt watch it that long or couldnt see past the talking dog, which makes your arguents even lamer.

Actually, she's right. VR Troopers did suck a lot.

[triplexxx]

Well, VR Troopers, I believe, was a rip-off of an already lousy franchise. I believe that Power Rangers remained on TV a heck of a lot longer than its fandom lasted. The TMNT franchise ran into a couple roadblocks over the years but was never lousy, save for NM, and originality has only done it favors, but still, their choice. All opinion of course, so no need to take me too seriously.

[Stephen]

Actually, she's right. VR Troopers did suck a lot.

But that's probably be expected since it was footage spliced together from several Japanese shows. And even then, it was footage from the 80's despite V.R Troopers being produced in 1994.

[Stephen]

I believe that Power Rangers remained on TV a heck of a lot longer than its fandom lasted.

It's fandom can't be doing that bad. The traffic for Rangerboard is significantly higher than the Technodrome forums.

http://siteanalytics.compete.com/rangerboard.com+thetechnodrome.com/?metric=uv

[Drtooth]

Well, at least that explains why Splinter doesn't make it back and why Serling needs to go back with them. It's likely that Serling may be some sort of key to bringing Splinter back. I'm sure in the finale, the turtles will save Splinter, and Serling will be free to go back to the future where he belongs. Or perhaps the writers will keep him around just for laughs. Anyway, sounds interesting.

I will say, I like that a lot better than what everyone was thinking, that he just stayed back in the future to train Cody. This is a pretty interresting developement. not of course that I like it. It's interresting almost in a not so nice way. This has the potential to be either pretty good or VERY VERY VERY bad.

[Raph's Girl]

My thoughts on the plot:

1: Yay!! Viral!! *hugs her Viral action figure*

2: Where does it say Serling's coming with em??

3: 2008's the year of the rat, bad things shouldn't happen to Spinter in such a year! How rude!

So Splinter is lost online??

Mikey: "I just did a google search and found an ear!"
Raph: "And I found a hand at Wikipedia!"

[gobo]

Wayne Grayson said that stuff about Serling at the TMNT-l forums.

Don: "You won't believe how much Splinter's tail is going for on eBay... :o"

[VaughnMichael]

F*ck the comics, go for originality.
Exactly man I'm glad some one else agrees!
I apricate more orig. episodes and stories than I do half assed episodes bassed on the comics.

[Stephen]

Presumably Cody knows that all this was going to happen, since he's read the Journal.

[Ra]

The future/past isn't always set in stone, unfortunately. Hasn't Heroes taught us anything? :lol:

I will say, I like that a lot better than what everyone was thinking, that he just stayed back in the future to train Cody. This is a pretty interresting developement. not of course that I like it. It's interresting almost in a not so nice way. This has the potential to be either pretty good or VERY VERY VERY bad.
My thoughts exactly. Very interesting, but I'm not too sure if we should relax and think "lol, this is going to rock". I'm going to hold all judgment for the first episode, like I did with Fast Forward. We shall see then. If things are still bad for me, or they haven't improved from Fast Forward...well, I'm afraid I'll just have to stop watching TMNT all together. :ohwell:

[VaughnMichael]

The future/past isn't always set in stone, unfortunately. Hasn't Heroes taught us anything? :lol:


My thoughts exactly. Very interesting, but I'm not too sure if we should relax and think "lol, this is going to rock". I'm going to hold all judgment for the first episode, like I did with Fast Forward. We shall see then. If things are still bad for me, or they haven't improved from Fast Forward...well, I'm afraid I'll just have to stop watching TMNT all together. :ohwell:
Well if you're going to watch only the first episode you might as well not watch at all. I'm not trying to be rude but think about it.
This series has taken time with each incarnation to get decent..
Fast Forward didn't really start to even pick up towards the end there..and it took awhile for the 2k3 series to get good past the first few episodes.
Waiting through everything and then making a judgement is the best thing to do.

[ZariusTwo]

Well, VR Troopers, I believe, was a rip-off of an already lousy franchise.

Again, how can something from the same company be a rip-off? Metalder was from Toku too, the same Japanese production company who developed Sentai (the source material for PR amongst other shows Saban used). V.R Troopers/Metalder, the same with Beetleborgs/B-Fighter, and Masked Rider/Kamen Rider are all part of a GENRE, not a rip-off of one another. This genre is known as Tokusatsu

I believe that Power Rangers remained on TV a heck of a lot longer than its fandom lasted.

As Stephen noted, it's fandom is ten times larger than ours, and ten times less ignorant about the show, it's influence, and it's cultural legacy.

But that's probably be expected since it was footage spliced together from several Japanese shows. And even then, it was footage from the 80's despite V.R Troopers being produced in 1994.

Splicing the footage had nothing to do with how "lame" Troopers were, aspects of it stereotype it (and lord even I skip the scenes with Katelin's goofy nerd nemesis Percy and Jeb the talking dog), when the show cuts into the footage or/and around the more serious aspects of the series? It's great. Most PR fans attribute V.R Troopers for setting the tone for the later, darker PR seasons like In Space and Lost Galaxy.

Most people who bash Troopers never saw "Defending Dark Heart" or "Quest For Power", they saw one or two fillers and said "thiz suxcz"

[Jester]

I think that only die hard TMNT fans are members of this forum. I know tons of causal TMNT fans who hardly know the "Drome exists.

[Ra]

Well if you're going to watch only the first episode you might as well not watch at all. I'm not trying to be rude but think about it.
This series has taken time with each incarnation to get decent..
Fast Forward didn't really start to even pick up towards the end there..and it took awhile for the 2k3 series to get good past the first few episodes.
Waiting through everything and then making a judgement is the best thing to do.
No, it's fine. Everyone is entitled for their opinion. I was just voicing mine, and you are just voicing yours. That's how things work around here, right? :)

We'll see, I guess. I continued watching the 2k3 season after watching it's first episode, and I stopped watching Fast Forward after watching it's first episode (and after giving the series a chance by watching three other episodes that went on later into the season). It's all about what you like as a person, I guess...

[gobo]

I hope "DNA is Thicker Than Water" was one of the other Fast Forward eps you saw. It reinstated my faith in the series.

[Mr._Mutant_Man]

As Stephen noted, it's fandom is ten times larger than ours, and ten times less ignorant about the show, it's influence, and it's cultural legacy.

But how much of that larger fandom is kids that will eventually move onto being fans of other things? Not trying to bash the series, it provided me with hours of entertainment when I was a lad, I'm just saying what would the comparison be like when you compare nostalgic turtles fans to adults that still follow Rangers? I think the Turtles has aged better than the Power Rangers did. Michelangelo's surfer talk IMO isn't quite as annoying as the Saved by the Bell knockoff aspect of MMPR.

[Spitfire]

I hope "DNA is Thicker Than Water" was one of the other Fast Forward eps you saw. It reinstated my faith in the series.

That and the entire second FF DVD for that matter. "Milk Run" is also awesome.

[Splinter's Iroonna]

I stuck with Fast Forward-- and in a few of the early episodes I could find something to like-- but yeah, once the series got going, I could see that Murphy et al were slowly working their way back into the series (take that 4Kids!)-- for ME, I think "the Journal" was a stand-out as a whole (not just in sections, as in other episodes). The first one where they meet Sho'kanobo was pretty cool...

And by the end, it was getting better.

I shall give this new version a chance as well-- I love the guys-- but this whole thing with Splinter really concerns me.

[gobo]

I hope "DNA is Thicker Than Water" was one of the other Fast Forward eps you saw. It reinstated my faith in the series.
That and the entire second FF DVD for that matter. "Milk Run" is also awesome.
Oddly enough, since Australia started using the 'half-season set' idea for Seasons Three and Four, I guess they already had some of the 3-ep releases out for Fast Forward. So, they continued with that pattern. But, yeah. The second half of that season was frequently good. "DNA..." was just the most perfect of them IMO. Character development FTW, yo! ^_^

[Jester]

I'm just glad my suspisions were confirmed, that Splinter's not returning withthe boys was an accident. He'll be back. Heck this may lead to him having a larger role in the series...*shrugs*

[gobo]

Heck this may lead to him having a larger role in the series...*shrugs*
Maybe higher significance, but everyone's complaint about him in >> was that he didn't DO anything of use. There's not much one can do while they're unencoded and scattered over cyber-space. :P

[Spitfire]

Maybe higher significance, but everyone's complaint about him in >> was that he didn't DO anything of use. There's not much one can do while they're unencoded and scattered over cyber-space. :P

Well he did train them still, graduated them to a higher class, and stopped the turtles from undoing their future. Most of what he did was teach them lessons and offer his words of wisdom and advice. He's stopped holding their hands and only stepped in when he thought they were incapable of taking care of a problem themselves. He;s teaching them to not rely on him as an aid for when he passes away they won't be able to go to him for help.

That's just my speculation.

[ZariusTwo]

I'm just glad my suspisions were confirmed, that Splinter's not returning withthe boys was an accident. He'll be back. Heck this may lead to him having a larger role in the series...*shrugs*

I hope not. This is just further proof fans dont watch the show for the TMNT's character development, but for a comfort zone.

[odupianist]

Personally I see this as either Superhuman Samurai Syber-Squad or Megaman NT Warrior or Digimon. I'm sure the turtles will get new digital forms and be able to evolve into some sort of super turtles in the virtual realm. I'm surprised no one has thought about the temporal effects of this. How does Splinter get caught in the virtual realm if they are travelling thru time? Even if that is possible, is Splinter still in the future or is he in the present or what? Temporally where is he? Does Viral sneak back with them and trap Splinter in the virtual realm in the present or what? Do Casey and April get to get in the virtual realm?

[The Shelf]

I wonder if they'll ever get the guts to kill off Splinter like they did in the comics. Splinter has sort of run out of potential for development, imo. If they kill him off, then it could add a lot to the character development of everyone else on the show. But they'll never do it because it's a Saturday morning children's show. In any case, I know they won't do it this season, but I'm thinking it could work maybe one or two more seasons down the road.

[Splinter's Iroonna]

I wonder if they'll ever get the guts to kill off Splinter like they did in the comics. Splinter has sort of run out of potential for development, imo. If they kill him off, then it could add a lot to the character development of everyone else on the show. But they'll never do it because it's a Saturday morning children's show. In any case, I know they won't do it this season, but I'm thinking it could work maybe one or two more seasons down the road.


NO TOUCHIE SPLINTER!!!!!

[Mr. Stay Puft]

Personally I see this as either Superhuman Samurai Syber-Squad or Megaman NT Warrior or Digimon. I'm sure the turtles will get new digital forms and be able to evolve into some sort of super turtles in the virtual realm. I'm surprised no one has thought about the temporal effects of this. How does Splinter get caught in the virtual realm if they are travelling thru time? Even if that is possible, is Splinter still in the future or is he in the present or what? Temporally where is he? Does Viral sneak back with them and trap Splinter in the virtual realm in the present or what? Do Casey and April get to get in the virtual realm?

My guess is that, unless I've missed something, it's probably not so much that Splinter's physical body is scattered over cyberspace, but actually his mind, personality and memories. As far as how Splinter get stuck in cyberspace while time travelling, I'm assuming by the year 2105, everything is connected to the internet. Even so, Viral was able to manipulate most, if not all technology. She could have used herself to link the time-window to the internet.

[Scandia]

Do NOT kill Splinter off. PLEASE.

And as of his body being intact but his soul and memories being scattered- yup, definitely Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicles.

[Mr._Mutant_Man]

Personally I see this as either Superhuman Samurai Syber-Squad or Megaman NT Warrior or Digimon. I'm sure the turtles will get new digital forms and be able to evolve into some sort of super turtles in the virtual realm. I'm surprised no one has thought about the temporal effects of this. How does Splinter get caught in the virtual realm if they are travelling thru time? Even if that is possible, is Splinter still in the future or is he in the present or what? Temporally where is he? Does Viral sneak back with them and trap Splinter in the virtual realm in the present or what? Do Casey and April get to get in the virtual realm?

What's with this virtual realm stuff? What happened to good old personally kicking each other's butts? If I was going to be one of those people that blame pop culture on society's ills, I'd say that this tendency for cartoon heroes to do things through a card game or through a video game as opposed to the physical activity of fighting the enemy themselves is why this generation of kids are heftier than they've ever been before (because all their cartoon role models do is play video games or card games or have these animals doing the battles for them);) j/k

[blue_angel99]

I'm just happy the series will continue in 2009. The changes won't bother me none. As long as the turtles aren't mutilated, I'm happy. I can't wait to see what happens to Splinter. :D

[Warhorse]

^I agree about the non mutilation part. But I would be for a shrinking Donny, for a little while, that could make some interesting episodes!

[The Shelf]

NO TOUCHIE SPLINTER!!!!!

Do NOT kill Splinter off. PLEASE.

This is exactly the sort of thing that keeps stories from progressing beyond a certain point. I mean, I don't want Splinter to die any more than you gals, but it could add so much more depth to the turtles and even characters like Casey and April if Splinter does die... assuming it was handled as well as the stories from the first few seasons. Anyway, like I said, I think it's still too early for something that drastic to happen. If we consider 2k8 to be season 7, then I'm thinking that this sort of development would fit in well as part of season 9 or 10.

Oh, and just for clarity, I don't think Splinter should be killed off -- I think he should die, like from a disease or something. Or they could go the comic route and make it due to a heart-attack or even simple old age. Heh, I think it would be far too horrifying if he was murdered -- I don't want that at all. It should be a peaceful death.

But it's not like anyone has anything to worry about. They'll never kill off any good characters in this show -- at least, none of the major ones. Splinter will live on forever on tv.

[Scandia]

Splinter did not die in either the 1987 toon or the Archie comic. And if time progressed with the years, the Turtles must have been in their mid-twenties by the time each series ended.

The Turtles are only about 18 right now in the 2k3 series. When Splinter died in Mirage, the Turtles were in their 30s. Much more mature. They had Splinter for much longer.

Hopefully they will keep Splinter around. He has so much potential to be developed.

[Jester]

You don't have to do big changes to develop a character. Just because we don't wanna see Splinter die doesn't mean we are against character development. Some times it is the little things that shape us, not always the huge events. I'm just saying...:P

[Splinter's Iroonna]

Any of us can move on with our lives without the death of a parent.

I don't like the "killing off" of a character merely because someone else sees no use any longer for it.

If they want the guys to take off on their own (as they have in the past) then do so, and don't engage in useless (to me) elimination of other characters.

From the viewpoint of the VAs, Darren D. already was being short-changed during Fast Forward. This seems like a "your services are no longer needed" type of thing.

And as for Scottie R. returning (but I'm sure not as Shreds)-- he could easily be voicing that new character we've see piccies of at Mr. M.'s blog.


I will leave out my own personal desire to keep the FAMILY feel of this series (which is what won me back to the franchise, btw).

Anyway, putting all that aside-- I can't help it, this digital search sounds like the most mega-accomidation of various $$$$$ investors imaginable. When you try to please everyone, you end up pleasing no one.

BUT-- I will watch-- and I will give it the chance I gave FAst Forward.


Though even I have my limits.

[TheShowstoppa]

I believe that killing off splinter would add so much more depth to the characters too. However, knowing full well that this is a show aimed at children and preteens, there's no way it will happen, however, this is certainly a way to add depth as well - Being as that we only got to be without splinter for half of season 2 as well. :) However, following suit, I think this storyline could and probably will work being as that they don't eff it up by putting too much comical nonesense into it. That drove me beyond NUTS. I think that The turtles going through various losses - like almost losing a father - will add a darkness level to the show we haven't seen in almost 3 years. (With the exception of the Ninja Tribunals. - GOD I CAN'T WAIT FOR THAT TO AIR!!!!!)

[Ninjinister]

Y'know, it's a shame Digimon didn't turn out better than it was. That show had so much potential. Oh well.
Watch Tamers (AKA season 3). Start to finish. Now. Some of it was darker than anything TMNT has done on TV.

If anybody has read Loop (book 3 of the Ring series by Koji Suzuki - the novels in which the horror film Ringu/The Ring was based on), that is a very interesting and well-thought out take on organics to digital. It also features a really weird plot twist:

The main character, in the real world, is actually a clone of a character in a computer simulation from the first two books.

[Raph's Girl]

Splinter did not die in either the 1987 toon or the Archie comic.

Wrong on the Archie comic. He was dead by 2095. When asked where Future Splinter was Future Don said he had died years earlier of old age. And then they did the issue where Splinter had to deal with the fact that his sons have realized his mortality and with an earth spirit we saw his life story (up to a certain point).

No he didn't die on panel like in Vol 4 but he died off panel.

As for the OS series. Splinter's death DID come into question but he didn't die on screen. There was an ep where Splinter left the turtles to fend for themselves. It was a lesson to see how they'd go on with their lives when he eventually did die.

And the turtles were killed off in another timeline and without the turtles Lord Dregg took over the earth. But that all changed with the help of a couple kids from 15 years in the future.

[Drtooth]

If Splinter is scattered into cyberspace... all I can think of is this scene:

Cut to dirty, broken down appartment interior. We see a large 40 year old man hunched over a computer checking out various adult sites. But instead of downloading pictures of women, Splinter's head pops up

SPLINTER: And what may I ask are you doing? Do you think that this is going to make you happy by any means? I suggest you leave your cavernous appartment and try to go out and get a real woman.

Thank God I don't writer for that show...

[Scandia]

He may have passed away in future time, but it was not shown in the comic. It is simply known from the future. Hey, I am assuming that by Fast Forward, the Turtles and Splinter have passed away. After all, sliders live around 30 years- nowhere near as long as the Galapagos turtles.

I do not want Splinter to die in present time period. Or any of the Turtles.

[The Shelf]

Watch Tamers (AKA season 3). Start to finish. Now. Some of it was darker than anything TMNT has done on TV.

I've seen the first 3 seasons of Digimon. Season 3 was the one that took place in the "real" world, right? I suppose it was a bit better than the first 2 seasons, but I still don't think any of it was darker than stuff we've seen in TMNT. I think my biggest beef with Digimon was that they de-evolved whenever they ran low on energy. They should have let the Digimon keep evolving, and they should have made them meaner and scarier. I got really tired of all the cuteness on that show. But it had some really good moments too.

Anyway, I'm done talking about Digimon, back to TMNT...

So yeah, I'm against killing off characters just to progress the story, but sometimes the story needs a jolt like that. We've gotten to the point where the writers are sending the turtles to the future and now we're getting Digiturds (sorry, I still think that's funny). I'm not complaining at all, but pretty soon the writers are going to run out of ideas on places that they can send the turtles to, and they're going to need something meaty to delve into. I think having Splinter die in a couple seasons from now could give them the meat that they need. There are sooo many stories they could tell with a dead Splinter. April and Casey could have a kid or two to help maintain that "family" feel of TMNT that so many people like.

Ugh, I dunno. I just don't want to see seasons 8 and 9 feature Teenage Mutant Card Collectors or Teenage Mutant Underwater Buddies or anything silly like that. I want something with a bit of depth to it. Hopefully this season will gradually move back in that direction and stay in that direction.

Anyway, don't get me wrong, I'm actually looking forward to the 2k8 season, and I think it has potential, but I'm just speculating on where they could take things after 2k8.

Hrm, that reminds me. What year do the aliens come to earth according to >>? Perhaps they'll bring them in by season 9 or 10.

[Mr._Mutant_Man]

Splinter's death wouldn't necessarily add depth to the Turtles, good writing afterward would have to do that.

[The Shelf]

Erm, well, that goes without saying... which is why I said that it would only be good if it was handled as well as the first few seasons were. But something that major would give good writers a lot of material to play with because, frankly, they're starting to run out of things to tell stories about.

Hehe, after reading through the "What if..." thread in the General forum about what might happen if one of the turtles went evil for a while, it would be cool if the writers could pull that off for a whole season. I don't see how they could do it because whoever goes bad would have to have an awfully good reason to turn against their family, but if the writers could come up with a good reason, then it would be a lot of fun to watch. Something like that could certainly give the cartoon the big boost that it needs in order to keep going for several more seasons.

[Drtooth]

So yeah, I'm against killing off characters just to progress the story, but sometimes the story needs a jolt like that. We've gotten to the point where the writers are sending the turtles to the future and now we're getting Digiturds (sorry, I still think that's funny). I'm not complaining at all, but pretty soon the writers are going to run out of ideas on places that they can send the turtles to, and they're going to need something meaty to delve into. I think having Splinter die in a couple seasons from now could give them the meat that they need. There are sooo many stories they could tell with a dead Splinter. April and Casey could have a kid or two to help maintain that "family" feel of TMNT that so many people like.

I would more than love to see that either happen in the cartoon series, or in a film Sequal, should one ever happen. I am not opposed to Splinter passing on of old age for dramatic purposes like in the comic. But I don't know if 4Kids will bite. Or even Peter Laird for that matter.

I would say, if TMNT had to have a subbranch of show for every seasons, I'd like the idea of Turtles in time, only if the time periods are by way of Renet the time Sorceress. But even still, that's cliched and it would have been more suited to the 80's/90's Turtles.

I really think that the TMNT line can sustain itself a couple seasons more with out the use of a cheesy sub brand. But it is all about toy lines, which is the only reason they animated the TMNT in the first place.

[ZariusTwo]

I've seen the first 3 seasons of Digimon. Season 3 was the one that took place in the "real" world, right? I suppose it was a bit better than the first 2 seasons, but I still don't think any of it was darker than stuff we've seen in TMNT.

Yeah, right, Jeri's entire ordeal was much darker than TMNT's fourth season.

[The Shelf]

Yeah, right, Jeri's entire ordeal was much darker than TMNT's fourth season.

You're probably right. To be honest, I really don't remember much of Digimon anymore, and I don't want to. I've been trying to let it slip away from my memory.

[blue_angel99]

A digital Splinter pet!! You can feed him, buy him gifts, have a training time and fight other digital pets.:lol:

[The Shelf]

A digital Splinter pet!! You can feed him, buy him gifts, have a training time and fight other digital pets.:lol:

Why not? They did it with Yoda... seriously. My friend had one. Why are you looking at me like that?

[Raph's Girl]

Why not? They did it with Yoda... seriously. My friend had one. Why are you looking at me like that?

I have the Yoda! :lol:

There's one out that's a mouse. Closest to Splinter ATM but a TMNT digipet would be awesome.....

[Fugitoid Jones]

At this point, I don't really care if Splinter dies or not, just as long as Serling doesn't come back with the Turtles, I'm open to anything. That C3-PO wannabe bastard just seems so out of place in the Turtles universe, in my opinion.

[Spitfire]

At this point, I don't really care if Splinter dies or not, just as long as Serling doesn't come back with the Turtles, I'm open to anything. That C3-PO wannabe bastard just seems so out of place in the Turtles universe, in my opinion.

Why because he's funnier then Mikey? Seriously I think he's funny and he's a good balance to Mikey's annoyance.

[Fugitoid Jones]

No, just the idea of an android butler with a british accent in my opinion feels like it should be in some other cartoon, not the TMNT. But I haven't been watching TMNT FF, I stopped after the first couple of episodes. So maybe I just didn't give Serling a chance.:ohwell:

Just the idea of the Turtles being able to walk around in the daytime amongst aliens really kinda turns me off. To me, the Turtles seem less special when they're living in a world inhabitited by various alien races. And the focus on the ninja action started to drift away towards more silly storylines, like being stuck in video games and what not. Plus, I don't like the looks of the animation. It's not as nice as the 2k3 series. I just hope the new series is more like the new movie is all. K. I'm done ranting.

[VaughnMichael]

You know I'm really getting sick of this "I watched a few episodes and gave up" thing.
I'm so glad people who own these characters don't have this sort of attitude.
And quite frankly you've got some nerve blasting any character for being like
C3P0...Fugitoid will be more like C3P0 any day than Serling will ever be.
Fugitoid was taken apart and taken all over the city remind you of anyone there Luke?
Serling is Codeys care taker especially now that Darius is out of the picture.
He's saved the kids life giving up his own even if he is just a robot.
I know Fugitoid gave up his but it wasn't under the same circumstances.
And honestly I like Serling he was one of the best things from Fast Forward he was funny where no other character from the start of this new series could be.
Fast Forward was such a damn breath of fresh air for me because this series was taking it's self waaay to seriously.
Just like allot of the fan base does...change is good and is going to happen and people are just going to have to live with it.
If change didn't happen we'd have 4 dead baby turtles in a sewer instead of 4 mutant ones.
Something to think about folks the next time you gripe about change.
But hey everyone keep watching a few episodes being overly judgemental without constructive cristisim and bitching at every chance you get how things are not so and so a way You want them.
Just remember why when the turtles are gone again for another 10 or so years.

[gobo]

Seriously, Fugitoid was C3PO-incarnate, not Serling. But, he quite obviously is just a British Butler stereotype in robot's clothing. 'Course, I don't find there to be anything wrong with that. I didn't dislike Fast Forward (all the time), but he shared the spot of my favorite featured character with Donatello. His plot-significance was mainly just comedy-relief, but I agree that it would be harder to take the more serious tone they're promising seriously without a lot of effort from the production crew as well as the audience.
If change didn't happen we'd have 4 dead baby turtles in a sewer instead of 4 mutant ones.
What in the shell? :-? *turns and walks briskly away.

[VaughnMichael]

Seriously, Fugitoid was C3PO-incarnate, not Serling. But, he quite obviously is just a British Butler stereotype in robot's clothing. 'Course, I don't find there to be anything wrong with that. I didn't dislike Fast Forward (all the time), but he shared the spot of my favorite featured character with Donatello. His plot-significance was mainly just comedy-relief, but I agree that it would be harder to take the more serious tone they're promising seriously without a lot of effort from the production crew as well as the audience.

What in the shell? :-? *turns and walks briskly away.
Well everyones wants to be serious they get serious...it's a disgusting reality.
Hell in reality the rat that became splinter more than likely would have eaten them.:P

[gobo]

Oh, I get it now. :P That's kinda sick.

[Fledermaus]

Hence, the gathering of the tasty morsels -- er... cute baby turtles -- in a coffee can and taking them to his lair. I'm sure he would have eaten them if they hadn't gotten so big. :lol:

Ah Putrescent, I agree yet disagree with you regarding Fast Forward. It was good... had more character development, better story (even animation) than the Lost Season but I still would not put it above the first four. I hardly thought the show was overly dramatic and in my opinion it was going interesting places. It did not need a rehaul.

The nice thing about all the sci-fi mystical stuff before is that it didn't completely take over the entire series. It was there, but it wouldn't occupy more than a five-part story.

In music, in all kinds of art the thing we all want to do is make something new. When you're making fine art for art's sake or telling stand-alone stories with no recurring characters or themes, when there is no existing soul to uphold, you're completely free to do whatever. There's nothing to honor but your own creativity.

When you're telling stories for an established series of characters, it's important to remember the soul of the characters. That's the one restriction and you have to work with it and somehow also allow for change. Something stays constant that makes that property unique -- other things can change.

I guess the main thing is that a lot of us disagree on what makes TMNT what it is. Some say it's over the top humor, some think it's action, some think it's scifi aliens, or scifi mutant conspiracy stories, drama, magic and fantasy, suspense, mystery, NINJAS, urban crime stories, family dynamics, teenage themes, larger epic "serious" stories as well as smaller "self-contained stories...

Why can't it be all of the above? Wouldn't TMNT be horrible if any one of these aspects completely trumped the rest?

Just a thought.

[Fugitoid Jones]

Seriously, Fugitoid was C3PO-incarnate, not Serling. But, he quite obviously is just a British Butler stereotype in robot's clothing.

That's kinda what I wanted to say. British Butler stereotype.

And quite frankly you've got some nerve blasting any character for being like
C3P0...Fugitoid will be more like C3P0 any day than Serling will ever be.


Take it easy there tiger, I was just making a joke.(yeah, funny one, right?)
Putrescent, your very passionate about the way you feel about FF, and that's awesome. I was just stating MY opinion is all,and the direction that FF took just wasn't to my liking is all. I'm up for change, but I just didn't care for that direction. That's just me.

If it makes anyone feel better, I don't think Serling is as annoying as say...this guy:
.
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.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
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.
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.
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http://home.netvigator.com/~mofo/jar-jar_binks5.jpg

[Jester]

Hence, the gathering of the tasty morsels -- er... cute baby turtles -- in a coffee can and taking them to his lair. I'm sure he would have eaten them if they hadn't gotten so big.

Ah Putrescent, I agree yet disagree with you regarding Fast Forward. It was good... had more character development, better story (even animation) than the Lost Season but I still would not put it above the first four. I hardly thought the show was overly dramatic and in my opinion it was going interesting places. It did not need a rehaul.

The nice thing about all the sci-fi mystical stuff before is that it didn't completely take over the entire series. It was there, but it wouldn't occupy more than a five-part story. Sort of like saying how "Slimer and the Real Ghostbusters" was as good as or even superior to "The Real Ghostbusters." Slimer and the sillyness was present before, but it didn't completely smother everything else. As a result, a lot of the later Ghostbuster episodes were missing a lot of their smartness. It was wry humor, aware of itself, but balanced by a lot of different elements. Then one day someone thinks "why don't we redirect it towards the children?" Sure, why not? So it loses its heart, big deal? At least it's still "Ghostbusters."

...

In music, in all kinds of art the thing we all want to do is make something new. When you're making fine art for art's sake or telling stand-alone stories with no recurring characters or themes, when there is no existing soul to uphold, you're completely free to do whatever. There's nothing to honor but your own creativity.

When you're telling stories for an established series of characters, it's important to remember the soul of the characters. That's the one restriction and you have to work with it and somehow also allow for change. Something stays constant that makes that property unique -- other things can change.

I guess the main thing is that a lot of us disagree on what makes TMNT what it is. Some say it's over the top humor, some think it's action, some think it's scifi aliens, or scifi mutant conspiracy stories, drama, magic and fantasy, suspense, mystery, NINJAS, urban crime stories, family dynamics, teenage themes, larger epic "serious" stories as well as smaller "self-contained stories...

Why can't it be all of the above? Wouldn't TMNT be horrible if any one of these aspects completely trumped the rest?

Just a thought.
I hear you Flying Rat. TMNT is more than just an action cartoon or a comedy show. It has subtitly and nuance and other words I have difficulty spelling. If they did use the big earth shattering event of killing Splinter, and it was done tastefully, I could go for it, but using it as nothing more than a story point, is ridiculous. That's why I like the idea of this next season. Maybe it'll be a season where the boys learn how much they still need their father, but also grow as more adult characters. But, we also have to remember that when it's all said and done, this is just a kids show. :P

[VaughnMichael]

Why can't it be all of the above? Wouldn't TMNT be horrible if any one of these aspects completely trumped the rest?

Just a thought.
That's exactly what I want in a turtles series..but since I can't have that I go along for the ride. And say what's good and whats not about each episode.

[Fugitoid Jones]

When you're telling stories for an established series of characters, it's important to remember the soul of the characters. That's the one restriction and you have to work with it and somehow also allow for change. Something stays constant that makes that property unique -- other things can change.

I guess the main thing is that a lot of us disagree on what makes TMNT what it is. Some say it's over the top humor, some think it's action, some think it's scifi aliens, or scifi mutant conspiracy stories, drama, magic and fantasy, suspense, mystery, NINJAS, urban crime stories, family dynamics, teenage themes, larger epic "serious" stories as well as smaller "self-contained stories...

Why can't it be all of the above? Wouldn't TMNT be horrible if any one of these aspects completely trumped the rest?


Well said.



But, we also have to remember that when it's all said and done, this is just a kids show.

Yeah, and we're the biggest kids of all!;)

[VaughnMichael]

Take it easy there tiger, I was just making a joke.(yeah, funny one, right?)
Putrescent, your very passionate about the way you feel about FF, and that's awesome. I was just stating MY opinion is all,and the direction that FF took just wasn't to my liking is all. I'm up for change, but I just didn't care for that direction. That's just me.

If it makes anyone feel better, I don't think Serling is as annoying as say...this guy:
http://home.netvigator.com/~mofo/jar-jar_binks5.jpg
The thing is everyone acts as if it destroyed something.
It was going to happen all along and everyone can keep ignoring that fact if they like but they're gonna have to live with the characters a bit long because they aren't going anywhere any time soon.
You made an opinion after watching a few episodes...shows aren't like people..you can't make a quick asumption about them.
Hell even people some times can be given a bad wrap by a quick judgement.
I'm not trying to chew you out or anything.
& it really doesn't have to do with just Fast Forward.
I'm sick and tired of the fan base bitching and complaining about everything under the sun.
And Yeah I'd hope not Jar Jar Binks is more along the lines of Elmo status in the annoying book.

[Fledermaus]

I hear you Flying Rat. TMNT is more than just an action cartoon or a comedy show. It has subtitly and nuance and other words I have difficulty spelling. If they did use the big earth shattering event of killing Splinter, and it was done tastefully, I could go for it, but using it as nothing more than a story point, is ridiculous.

If splinter died for the sake of the maudlin, angsty repercussions (and naught else), that would give us fanfiction. :lol:

But, we also have to remember that when it's all said and done, this is just a kids show.

Gargoyles is a kid's show.

Chaotix is a kid's show.

The Real Ghostbusters is a kid's show.

So's Bratz.

Oh well -- my future career hinges on my ability to tell stories -- possibly children's stories -- so my view on this is rather biased. I think just because it's animated or just because it's deemed okay for kids doesn't mean it can't be a great show that can be appreciated by adults as well.

[Fugitoid Jones]

And Yeah I'd hope not Jar Jar Binks is more along the lines of Elmo status in the annoying book

Just remember this:




http://www.beetle-bugsinc.com/shop/images/SSElmoWantsAHug5815307.jpg

+

http://www.ninjaturtles.com/mov1pix/mov28.jpg

=

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/10/Performer.kevinclash.jpg

[Fledermaus]

Fugitoid Jones, I can't see the second image in your post. First save the image to your desktop, then upload it for free onto www.imageshack.us.

I would very much like to decipher your equation. :)

[Roseangelo]

FYI:

This...
http://www.ninjaturtles.com/mov1pix/mov28.jpg

= this for the rest of us:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v36/roseangelo/hotlink.jpg

[Jester]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Jesterangalo/PDVD_000.jpg
I wanna watch cartoons!!! I wanna watch Cartoons!!

Was Fugi-Jones posting a pic of Movie Splinter to remind us that Elmo Muppeteer Kevin Clash is our favorite mutant Rat also?

[VaughnMichael]

Just remember this:

=

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/10/Performer.kevinclash.jpg
I know who Kevin Clash is...one character ruined star wars for me the other ruined sesame street for me *kermit voice yaaaayy!*
Was Fugi-Jones posting a pic of Movie Splinter to remind us that Elmo Muppeteer Kevin Clash is our favorite mutant Rat also?
yeaup..

[Roseangelo]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v36/roseangelo/tmnt_daily/50585056.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v36/roseangelo/tmnt_daily/50585055.jpg

[VaughnMichael]

holy crap Rose I've never seen those before!!
I may not like 2 of Kevin's characters but there's allot more of his that I do like. {incase anyone is wondering those 2 would be Elmo & Clifford}

[Roseangelo]

Elmo was cool before the whole Tickle Me Elmo fiasco. :ohwell:

[Jester]

Gargoyles is a kid's show.

Chaotix is a kid's show.

The Real Ghostbusters is a kid's show.

So's Bratz.

Oh well -- my future career hinges on my ability to tell stories -- possibly children's stories -- so my view on this is rather biased. I think just because it's animated or just because it's deemed okay for kids doesn't mean it can't be a great show that can be appreciated by adults as well.
Touche'. But still just because adults enjoy it, doesn't mean that since the primary demographic is lil' kiddos the stories will be more geared for them. They can't go too frar for fear of throwing off their fan base. And to throw it back to Clash...the Muppets are kinda kiddie fare too...:P

Peut, why no love for Clifford?

[VaughnMichael]

Elmo was cool before the whole Tickle Me Elmo fiasco. :ohwell:
It was funny I remember him waaaaay back when..Richard Hunt orig. had the character and hated him. They then gave him to Kevin..Elmo wasn't always a baby talking sugar rushed screen hog that he is today.
He was cute, funny, and really furry...they cleaned him up and made him almost retarded.
Peut, why no love for Clifford?
I liked him on the Jim Henson Hour when he was more like a Bob Marley Muppet. Then they made Muppets Tonight and he turned into the Muppet Version of Arsenio Hall loosing his cool shades and slicking his dreads back and giving him a suit.
The Characters of Kevin's I do like are Leon, Jim Henson Hour Clifford, Griddle Gorilla from the great space coaster, Splinter, Baby Dinosaur, Polly Lobster, Hoots the Owl (my fave sesame street character of his), & Natasha.

[gobo]

{incase anyone is wondering those 2 would be Elmo & Clifford}
What's there to dislike about the big, red dog? :-?

[VaughnMichael]

What's there to dislike about the big, red dog? :-?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8e/Clifford.gif
The Muppet, not the dog.
Which I liked better like this.
http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Hills/4155/ker06.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/Harmophious/anth03june05a.jpg

[Fledermaus]

Touche'. But still just because adults enjoy it, doesn't mean that since the primary demographic is lil' kiddos the stories will be more geared for them.

I guess that's TMNT's immortal curse. :(

... Someday I swear, I will do all in my power to help break that curse.

They can't go too frar for fear of throwing off their fan base. And to throw it back to Clash...the Muppets are kinda kiddie fare too...:P

What about the Muppet Show and the Jim Henson Hour? (from the 70's and 80's, early 90's)

Also Sesame Street was originally meant to appeal to both children AND their parents. "The Tipping Point" does a lengthy case study comparing Sesame Street to Blue's Clues. Part of why Sesame Street was surpassed by Blues Clues was that it was just too adult in how it presented information, how it had new things going on all the time instead of repetition and formula. We adults might find that tedious, but three-year-olds love it. That's why they like to sing the same songs and read the same books, watch the same movies over and over and over again.

[gobo]

What's there to dislike about the big, red dog? :-?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8e/Clifford.gif
The Muppet, not the dog.
Which I liked better like this.
http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Hills/4155/ker06.jpg
Just when I think it's safe to make an impulse-post... :embarass:

[VaughnMichael]

What about the Muppet Show and the Jim Henson Hour? (from the 70's and 80's, early 90's)

Also Sesame Street was originally meant to appeal to both children AND their parents. "The Tipping Point" does a lengthy case study comparing Sesame Street to Blue's Clues. Part of why Sesame Street was surpassed by Blues Clues was that it was just too adult in how it presented information, how it had new things going on all the time instead of repetition and formula. We adults might find that tedious, but three-year-olds love it. That's why they like to sing the same songs and read the same books, watch the same movies over and over and over again.
Thank you! I don't think enough people have seem the muppet show or taken the time to know that there is a differnce from Sesame Street.
Hell even the old Sesame Street is now being called not good for todays kids.
Jim Henson made his shows for everyone though not just one group of people and thats why they where so great and always will be.
I'm with you I hope the turtles can break that whole they're for kids thing some day.
Just when I think it's safe to make an impulse-post... :embarass:
heh Dear Nephew Gobo,
The other day you forgot I was a Muppet Nerd but it's ok we have silly creatures here to remind you.
Love
Your Uncle Traveling Putrescent

[Jester]

I understand that Muppets is ment for all ages, but it's had to become more kiddy to keep with the times.

[VaughnMichael]

I understand that Muppets is ment for all ages, but it's had to become more kiddy to keep with the times.
The Muppets really haven't but yes Sesame Street has.
Keeping the Muppet show Muppets for everyone even more so adults in recent years is the only thing I will give Disney credit for.
Because they sure haven't done much with them since buying them.
They take forever to release the box sets & put them on game shows.
When what they need to do is get a good writting team together and work in an updated muppet show and bring back the lost characters from the Jim Henson Hour. I really wish Jim didn't pass away, he was moving forward with them but now it feels like they stay in limbo forever if you know what I mean.

[Fledermaus]

I understand that Muppets is ment for all ages, but it's had to become more kiddy to keep with the times.

Too bad it couldn't have ended while it still had some dignity. Kind of like Disney churns out its sequels. Sure, there's a demand and bucks to be made off a franchise, but at what cost to an inspired, unique concept?

"Times" like this are a sign that maybe it's time for change.

EDIT: Maybe I was getting too carried away... :embarass:

[VaughnMichael]

Too bad it couldn't have ended while it still had some dignity. Kind of like Disney churns out its sequels. Sure, there's a demand and bucks to be made off a franchise, but at what cost to an inspired, unique concept?

"Times" like this are a sign that it's time for change.

EDIT: Maybe I'm getting too carried away...
Which leads us back to my first post before went went on a muppet tangent lol Change is good and we'd be nowhere without it.

[Fugitoid Jones]

Which leads us back to my first post before went went on a muppet tangent lol Change is good and we'd be nowhere without it.

Yes, well said.

And my picture way back there on the previous page was supposed to be movie Splinter. WOOOH! NOW THAT YOU KNOW, ISN'T THAT A RIOT!!!:|

[gobo]

Just to prove to everyone that this stigma of 'Silly Shredder, Turtles are for kids!" isn't a bad thing, consider what it'd take to get those who say it's just for kids to say that it's for adults. It would have to be ultra-violent/gory, vulgar and/or pornographic. I don't know about anyone else, but I'd hate to see that.
And my picture way back there on the previous page was supposed to be movie Splinter. WOOOH! NOW THAT YOU KNOW, ISN'T THAT A RIOT!!!:|
:o I never would have guessed. My mind is blown. :P

[Fledermaus]

Just to prove to everyone that this stigma of 'Silly Shredder, Turtles are for kids!" isn't a bad thing, consider what it'd take to get those who say it's just for kids to say that it's for adults. It would have to be ultra-violent/gory, vulgar and/or pornographic. I don't know about anyone else, but I'd hate to see that.

Hmm... I didn't see ANY of that in the Spider-Man, Star Wars, POTC movies... and whaddya know? Adults enjoyed it as well as the ten year olds, who begged their parents to buy them toys. :) No sex, no excessive blood, and only minor swearing... had these movies been released in the 80's they would've been PG.

I'm sorry but that's such a lie I'd laugh if it weren't so sad -- you don't have to turn TMNT into "Frank Millerfest 3000" to cater to mature AS WELL AS to younger viewers.

[gobo]

True... But, I was referring to the stigma of Turtles being just for kids. :) I'd prefer this 'maturebutnotinappropriateforkids' type as well, but that's 2K3, the first movie and (to a slightly lesser degree) the CGI film. So, it has been done. However, Turtles is still 'just for kids'. Why? Because it's not 'only for adults'.

[Fugitoid Jones]

you don't have to turn TMNT into "Frank Millerfest 3000"

Mikey: "I hope you boys ate a hearty amount of pizza, for tonight, WE DINE IN HELL!"


or


Raph: "I'm the g***amn Ninja Turtle!"




yeah, that would suck.

[odupianist]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1-PwZltH8E&feature=PlayList&p=A82CA33EF172006D&index=1

for you Putre if you haven't seen it already lol

off topic, Jim Henson was a genius and it is a shame he had to die. If he hadn't Muppets would be A LOT bigger than they are today. They would have given Disney a run for their money I think. Although I heard he was already going to sell them off to Disney before he died, am I wrong Putre?

on topic, Serling isn't that bad, he just reminds me of a cross between C-3PO and Marvin the Paranoid Android. He has his funny moments as well his "oh jeez whyd he just say that" moments, just like all the characters do IMO.

[Drtooth]

on topic, Serling isn't that bad, he just reminds me of a cross between C-3PO and Marvin the Paranoid Android. He has his funny moments as well his "oh jeez whyd he just say that" moments, just like all the characters do IMO.

And a little of Duckworth from Ducktales thrown in. yeah. in Small doses, Serling and even Biggles were pretty alright. I'd definately have bought that Biggles figures. Let's hope he's no where near the new show, though.

Somehow a robotic stereotype of a British bobby would have worked much much better in the older series. But that's just me.

[The Shelf]

Somehow a robotic stereotype of a British bobby would have worked much much better in the older series. But that's just me.

Well, for that matter, the entire Fast Forward season(s) would have fit better in the OT.

[VaughnMichael]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1-PwZltH8E&feature=PlayList&p=A82CA33EF172006D&index=1

for you Putre if you haven't seen it already lol

off topic, Jim Henson was a genius and it is a shame he had to die. If he hadn't Muppets would be A LOT bigger than they are today. They would have given Disney a run for their money I think. Although I heard he was already going to sell them off to Disney before he died, am I wrong Putre?

on topic, Serling isn't that bad, he just reminds me of a cross between C-3PO and Marvin the Paranoid Android. He has his funny moments as well his "oh jeez whyd he just say that" moments, just like all the characters do IMO.
Yeah I saw it and loved every minute off it. That's when Clifford was a good new character still..untill they made him a total stereo type.
Nope you are correct! Jim was going to give them a home at Disney because he was friends with Michael Eisner....that's why Disney doesn't know what to do with them now because Michael bought them then they fired him.
And I agree that if Jim was around they'd be even better they would look allot differnt mind you and we'd have allot more new characters instead of the same group of piggy, gonzo and fozzie all the time...that's one of the big issues for me is that the Muppets are about all the crazy characters and randomness not just 5 or 6 puppets.
But Jim was going to work with Disney sort of like a backer so the Muppets has a home incase something happend to him..I think he sort of knew he was going to die.
Well, for that matter, the entire Fast Forward season(s) would have fit better in the OT.
And You have just pointed out exactly why I liked it they came close to capturing the longevity of the old toon series for me with FF and that's exactly why I like it. I can watch the episodes over and over and over and they don't get old for me just like the old toon. Sadly I can't do that with all of 2k3.

[Fugitoid Jones]

Somehow a robotic stereotype of a British bobby would have worked much much better in the older series. But that's just me.
Today 10:38 AM


You ain't alone, my friend. I agree.


I guess what it all boils down to is personal tastes. Most people who enjoy FF prefer the OT, while most people who didn't enjoy FF tend to prefer the 2k3 show. I guess it's just that the direction of FF is more reminescent of the OT, which kinda seems to divide the fanbase into the fans who prefer cartoony silliness, and the fans who prefer the action and edge of the 2k3 show. Whatever. We're all different.

[Spitfire]

You ain't alone, my friend. I agree.


I guess what it all boils down to is personal tastes. Most people who enjoy FF prefer the OT, while most people who didn't enjoy FF tend to prefer the 2k3 show. I guess it's just that the direction of FF is more reminescent of the OT, which kinda seems to divide the fanbase into the fans who prefer cartoony silliness, and the fans who prefer the action and edge of the 2k3 show. Whatever. We're all different.

Actually I prefer the new toon to the old toon but as Putrescent said the new series really fails to have a lasting appeal. I can't watch the episodes over and over again, which is weird I can do that with every other show I watch. I get bored and I start to fall asleep. That only happens if I've seen something to many times in a set period of time or when something fails to have a lasting appeal. Sometimes I look at my 2K3 DVDs and go "Which one should I watch" and then everything that happens in those episodes plays out in my head and I say "F it" and I pick something else. I haven't even seen them that many times each so that's pretty sad.

For some reason I can watch FF alot. I could never figure it out before but I figured it out last night. I was reading the Archie series and there are some issues in the beginning based off episodes of the old toon series. I just skipped them because the old toon versions are better and there's no difference in it really. There's 2K3, most of the episodes are adapts of the comics but the comics are better so that's what makes it boring.

All the new episodes in 2K3 are great and I will watch those a bunch, that's why I love FF, new stories. It's great to animate your comics but at the same time if your not going to make it better then the comic then I see no point in doing it. Had I never read any of the comics I'd love the stories but since I have their all dull to me.

I also like FF because it doesn't try to be a rated R movie in a kids universe. That's another huge problem I have with 2K3. They have all these dark storyline undertones and messed up stuff happen but they can't depict it the way it should be because it's a kids series and all that does is piss off people who notice this and turns kids away because it has stuff in it their not interested in.

If TMNT wants to remain a kids cartoon series then it needs to stick with the kids. If it wants to be an adult series then they need to make a Spawn style cartoon but I guarantee it wouldn't last more then a season or two. It would do even worse if they tried to re-tell the origin if I see that again my eyes will bleed. Batman TAS is the only cartoon series that will ever exist that broke the boundary of kids cartoons and was successful. This was because the network let them do whatever they wanted in it because it was Batman and Batman was super popular after the movie came out.

[VaughnMichael]

You ain't alone, my friend. I agree.


I guess what it all boils down to is personal tastes. Most people who enjoy FF prefer the OT, while most people who didn't enjoy FF tend to prefer the 2k3 show. I guess it's just that the direction of FF is more reminescent of the OT, which kinda seems to divide the fanbase into the fans who prefer cartoony silliness, and the fans who prefer the action and edge of the 2k3 show. Whatever. We're all different.
That's not true at all..I like a fine mixture of everything.And that's what FF became halfway through the series...you'd know that if you watched more than a few episodes.

[Scandia]

I like 2k3. I like FF. I like 1987. I like the first five 2k3 seasons best out of those, but can honestly watch most of the episodes over and over again.

[Fledermaus]

Weird, I have no trouble watching the 2k3 eps repeatedly. Though I have lots of trouble forcing myself through a single episode of the old toon.

It's not that I dislike comedy, it's that there is almost nothing to appeal to me now that I'm older. (Someone point me to some "decent" episodes of the old toon. I am trying to be "converted" but nothing's quite lifting my skirts. LOL :oops: Sorry.) And TMNT OT was without a doubt my favorite show as a little kid.

[ToTheNines]

Someone point me to some "decent" episodes of the old toon.

The whole first season

Almost the whole second season

Turtles on Trial
The Maltese Hamster
Enter The Rat King
Ninja Sword of Nowhere (would be even better if Paulsen was Raph)
Take Me To Your Leader
Casey Jones: Outlaw Hero
Usagi Yojimbo
Usagi Come Home
The Making of Metalhead
The Grybyx
The Big Break In + The Big Blowout

Some of Season 4, 5 and 6

A Real Snow Job (I dunno... just always liked that one)

ALL of Season 7

Most of Redsky

Those are some standouts, but I think the whole series (generally) is great.

[Scandia]

Don't forget about "The Sword of Yurikawa".

Plus both episodes featuring Lotus Blossom.

[Spitfire]

Don't forget about "The Sword of Yurikawa".

Plus both episodes featuring Lotus Blossom.

Yeah that episode is the best of the OT in my opinion. Atleast before it went Red Sky.

[VaughnMichael]

Weird, I have no trouble watching the 2k3 eps repeatedly. Though I have lots of trouble forcing myself through a single episode of the old toon.

It's not that I dislike comedy, it's that there is almost nothing to appeal to me now that I'm older. (Someone point me to some "decent" episodes of the old toon. I am trying to be "converted" but nothing's quite lifting my skirts. LOL :oops: Sorry.) And TMNT OT was without a doubt my favorite show as a little kid.
I guess we're all just very differnt people...I never enjoyed the 80s and 90s turtles for jokes nor did I find them funny back then..It was all about action, characters and stories.
Now being almost 28 years old I find allot of things that went over my head as a kid to be very very funny.

[ZariusTwo]

I guess what it all boils down to is personal tastes. Most people who enjoy FF prefer the OT.

I prefer the original series over the modern series and I loathed FF.

[The Shelf]

I prefer the original series over the modern series and I loathed FF.

There are always exceptions... except to this rule.

[VaughnMichael]

I prefer the original series over the modern series and I loathed FF.
That's funny I could have sworn you've said quite a few nice things about it Zarius.

[Jester]

Legend of Koji, Night of the Dark Turtle and Night of the Rogues are pretty good dramatic pre-red sky episodes.

[gobo]

Ooh! I bet all the bots in 2105 were 'made in England'. How'd I never think of that before? :P

EDIT: Sorry. Was responding to the last post of the previous page. Whoops... :embarass:

[Spitfire]

Ooh! I bet all the bots in 2105 were 'made in England'. How'd I never think of that before? :P

EDIT: Sorry. Was responding to the last post of the previous page. Whoops... :embarass:

haha I always saw this in movies as a joke to bag on British people for being so proper and they say robots are prefect so what the better way to be a smart ass then make them British.

[U2WaTCHer]

does anyone know when any new eps of ff will be going on, and when last ff will be coming on around. Like to see where things are going in that :P I been out of the loop with holidays and such

[Roseangelo]

does anyone know when any new eps of ff will be going on, and when last ff will be coming on around. Like to see where things are going in that :P I been out of the loop with holidays and such

FF is over..

[gobo]

I been out of the loop with holidays and such
>> was finished premiering all 26 of its episodes for a couple months now. Currently, all 26 eps are evenly split on two dual-disc DVD volumes in America. You can probably get the whole season/series for $20. I highly suggest you check out the second half of it.

[Fugitoid Jones]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugitoid Jones
You ain't alone, my friend. I agree.


I guess what it all boils down to is personal tastes. Most people who enjoy FF prefer the OT, while most people who didn't enjoy FF tend to prefer the 2k3 show. I guess it's just that the direction of FF is more reminescent of the OT, which kinda seems to divide the fanbase into the fans who prefer cartoony silliness, and the fans who prefer the action and edge of the 2k3 show. Whatever. We're all different.

Actually I prefer the new toon to the old toon but as Putrescent said the new series really fails to have a lasting appeal.

That's not true at all..I like a fine mixture of everything.And that's what FF became halfway through the series...you'd know that if you watched more than a few episodes.

When I said most people who prefer the OT like FF and people who don't like FF prefer 2k3, I meant MOST people, which is not EVERYONE. Just seemed to me that that was the case from most of the posts I had seen.

And I will say this: even if you like the direction of FF, wether it be the stories or new characters or humor over action or whatever it is that makes you like the show, you have to admit that the look of the animation isn't quite as nice as 2k3. Maybe some of you will disagree with me (seems to be a given) but I just don't find the art-style of FF as pleasing as 2k3. What's up with Bishop's mouth in FF? Why's he look like a rabbit?

[gobo]

I heard people liken his mouth to a cat's before, but 'rabbit' sounds more appropriate (since their mouths really aren't as rounded in reality).

[Sage Ninja]

I am also one of the the fans on here that loves the OT and didn't care for FF. And yes I gave the series a chance before making the descion that I didn't care for it. People say that fans who enjoy the OT should love the FF since it is more like it, but to tell you the truth I didn't. I don't think FF holds up to the greatness that was the OT, that is my opinion, others are free to disagree. I liied the OT for the OT, its charm its likeable characters the humour and spattering of serious and emotional elements that under scored the lightered hearted tone of the serious and suble character development that, despite what other say, was apart of the OT series. and of course the turtles and their unique dynamics that never tried to be like mirage. It took me a while, but I also came to love the 2k3 series and the elemants that set it apart as a diffrent series as the OT. I came to love the darker story lines and and more serious tone the edgier more conflicted characters and the engaging and engrossing story arcs that that all tyed together, As well as the action and fighting, oh my gosh for once you see the turtles acting like ninjas who have to stay in the shadows and litterly be apart from the world thats all around them. The 2k3 series was the first series to really translate the tragidy of the the turtles osterisation from the normal world and it endeared the turtles to me. I also came to appriciate the turtles new personalites and deeper developement (despite some misgivings) and the more conflicted dynamics the turtles share with each other as brothers, unlike the OT where the turtles generally got along with each, the 2k3 turtles don't always do and fight and feel real fealings of resentment and inferority. This is why I liked 2k3 series, for it own merits and because it isn't like the old series.

The new series pulled off a big acomplishment and morphed into it's own medium despite how monsterously huge the OT series was and still did it's own thing. That is why I can't accept FF. I like the new series because it's diffrent from the old toon, not because it is similar which is what FF seemed like it tried to be. The turtle suddenly being thrust in a world where they can walk around with other mutants and alines is great but I feel that it took some of the richness away from the show that I loved about the 2k3. I don't want the turtles to try to be like the old series, the old series has already been done and it can't be emulated. I'm not saying all of I do agree that season four (even though I enjoyed) went a little over board in trying to be too edgy and R-rated to the point of being nearly ridiculous. But I think all they had to to do was ease up on that and it would have been fine. I not saying everything was bad in FF, I actually quite enjoyed some characters like Torbin Zixx and Viral sort of grew on me (seriously how many genuanly threateneing female villans are there in the ninja turtles?) but I am glad that FF is done and that they will be returning to the present. I hope for the best in this new direction in the series.

[Fugitoid Jones]

A very articulate and insightful response. Well said.

[VaughnMichael]

FF is over..
It sort of isn't Rose.:lol:
When I said most people who prefer the OT like FF and people who don't like FF prefer 2k3, I meant MOST people, which is not EVERYONE. Just seemed to me that that was the case from most of the posts I had seen.

And I will say this: even if you like the direction of FF, wether it be the stories or new characters or humor over action or whatever it is that makes you like the show, you have to admit that the look of the animation isn't quite as nice as 2k3. Maybe some of you will disagree with me (seems to be a given) but I just don't find the art-style of FF as pleasing as 2k3. What's up with Bishop's mouth in FF? Why's he look like a rabbit?
Oh no that I agree with but if you ask me whats coming up next is even more streamlined and looks even worse than FF.
I like things about every version of TMNT I'm kinda one of those people who hates to see the turtles being bashed I guess.
The boys in green and the company have been there for me when no one else in my life has been.
At the end of the day they are just show made to entertain and that's exactly what they all do for me just some more than others.
I am also one of the the fans on here that loves the OT and didn't care for FF. And yes I gave the series a chance before making the descion that I didn't care for it. People say that fans who enjoy the OT should love the FF since it is more like it, but to tell you the truth I didn't. I don't think FF holds up to the greatness that was the OT, that is my opinion, others are free to disagree. I liied the OT for the OT, its charm its likeable characters the humour and spattering of serious and emotional elements that under scored the lightered hearted tone of the serious and suble character development that, despite what other say, was apart of the OT series. and of course the turtles and their unique dynamics that never tried to be like mirage. It took me a while, but I also came to love the 2k3 series and the elemants that set it apart as a diffrent series as the OT. I came to love the darker story lines and and more serious tone the edgier more conflicted characters and the engaging and engrossing story arcs that that all tyed together, As well as the action and fighting, oh my gosh for once you see the turtles acting like ninjas who have to stay in the shadows and litterly be apart from the world thats all around them. The 2k3 series was the first series to really translate the tragidy of the the turtles osterisation from the normal world and it endeared the turtles to me. I also came to appriciate the turtles new personalites and deeper developement (despite some misgivings) and the more conflicted dynamics the turtles share with each other as brothers, unlike the OT where the turtles generally got along with each, the 2k3 turtles don't always do and fight and feel real fealings of resentment and inferority. This is why I liked 2k3 series, for it own merits and because it isn't like the old series.

The new series pulled off a big acomplishment and morphed into it's own medium despite how monsterously huge the OT series was and still did it's own thing. That is why I can't accept FF. I like the new series because it's diffrent from the old toon, not because it is similar which is what FF seemed like it tried to be. The turtle suddenly being thrust in a world where they can walk around with other mutants and alines is great but I feel that it took some of the richness away from the show that I loved about the 2k3. I don't want the turtles to try to be like the old series, the old series has already been done and it can't be emulated. I'm not saying all of I do agree that season four (even though I enjoyed) went a little over board in trying to be too edgy and R-rated to the point of being nearly ridiculous. But I think all they had to to do was ease up on that and it would have been fine. I not saying everything was bad in FF, I actually quite enjoyed some characters like Torbin Zixx and Viral sort of grew on me (seriously how many genuanly threateneing female villans are there in the ninja turtles?) but I am glad that FF is done and that they will be returning to the present. I hope for the best in this new direction in the series.
Well think about this...FF had one season man...the old toon had 10.
That's many more years to become a well done series...had FF been even given a hint of a chance which it wasn't I'm sure it could have been a hell of allot better. You can't do everything in one season but they sure tried their best if you ask me.
It's like comparing a Watermelon (old toon) to a cherry(FF) one that I don't think is even a fair comparison.
But I'm stating things that are the truth not trying to be bitchy or try to even make you see my way because I know you cant.
And it's fine I don't care I like each and everyone of the turtles worlds for what they are.

[Fledermaus]

Even in its first few eps of its first season, 2k3 already had me hooked. Like Sage Ninja said, it "did its own thing" and did it beautifully. The only reason I bothered to watch the first episode when it aired was because the preview commercials made them look COOL.

They used to have the stark shadows at the beginning of the series. The ninja and stealth themes playing out visually. It died down a little in the second and even the third seasons to my disappointment, but came back strong at the beginning of the 4th season... then died again starting in the episode "Ancient One." The Lost Season was just... something else entirely.

[Sage Ninja]

It sort of isn't Rose.:lol:

Oh no that I agree with but if you ask me whats coming up next is even more streamlined and looks even worse than FF.
I like things about every version of TMNT I'm kinda one of those people who hates to see the turtles being bashed I guess.
The boys in green and the company have been there for me when no one else in my life has been.
At the end of the day they are just show made to entertain and that's exactly what they all do for me just some more than others.

Well think about this...FF had one season man...the old toon had 10.
That's many more years to become a well done series...had FF been even given a hint of a chance which it wasn't I'm sure it could have been a hell of allot better. You can't do everything in one season but they sure tried their best if you ask me.
It's like comparing a Watermelon (old toon) to a cherry(FF) one that I don't think is even a fair comparison.you make a good point about comparing the OT to FF like a watermelon and a cherry, and FF might have devloped into some thing more awsome, it's just that I didn't care for the direction it choose that is all.

But I'm stating things that are the truth not trying to be bitchy or try to even make you see my way because I know you cant.
And it's fine I don't care I like each and everyone of the turtles worlds for what they are.


you make it sound like I'm being unreasnable when I'm not. I'm just stating my views and my impression. on things. And even though other liked FF it just was not my cup of tea. On things like this I think it's better to just agree to disagree.

[VaughnMichael]

you make a good point about comparing the OT to FF like a watermelon and a cherry, and FF might have devloped into some thing more awsome, it's just that I didn't care for the direction it choose that is all.




you make it sound like I'm being unreasnable when I'm not. I'm just stating my views and my impression. on things. And even though other liked FF it just was not my cup of tea. On things like this I think it's better to just agree to disagree.
Yeah about the comparing thing and no about you being unreasonable...at least "you" gave it a chance. Allot of people didn't.
I don't care for allot of 2k3 because it's half assed versions of amazing comic book issues waterd down for kids...doesn't mean I'm a bad person..just think it could have been done better.
I also think FF could have been better..I'm just one of those people who look at the light and dark sides of things. I still say it could be worse.

[odupianist]

Putre's got a point, I mean think about it like this... the first season of turtles of the OT only had five episodes. FIVE, and look what it spawned in to. Do you think they could have predicted nine more seasons just from those five episodes? We really can't say how long FF would have gone on to from 26 season. I am one of those people who likes all 3. I like the OT for nostaglia purposes now that I'm older (24). 2k3 I was skeptical about bc I was hooked on the OT for so long, but came to enjoy the dark grittiness of it now that I am older. FF took awhile to grow on me, but they had a lot of good ideas and bad ideas on there that worked and didn't work. I think with the way the end of the season wrapped up, they could really do something with it, but again, that's just me.

[ZariusTwo]

The original five episodes had awesome animation, Krang levelling New York, street gangs with nunchucks, and Rocksteady with a machine guin. Non-PC, unrestricted old-school TMNT at it's best.

...You cant say that about any of FF can you? There's only like two to three episodes where they took any risks.

The general consensus is that FF didnt have to suck if they had stuck with their guns. Look at the power Laird had when rejecting ideas for the next season from Playmates, why couldnt he have done the same with 4Kids request to make it lighter? The season had a great concept, but it could only suceed as an emulation of Phantom 2040 and Batman Beyond

[AquaParade]

The original five episodes had awesome animation, Krang levelling New York, street gangs with nunchucks, and Rocksteady with a machine guin. Non-PC, unrestricted old-school TMNT at it's best.



Must...not...speak...of how great the original 5 episodes were. Makes me cringe at the potential of having a tmnt show that reflected the opening credits....:ohwell:

[VaughnMichael]

The original five episodes had awesome animation, Krang levelling New York, street gangs with nunchucks, and Rocksteady with a machine guin. Non-PC, unrestricted old-school TMNT at it's best.

...You cant say that about any of FF can you? There's only like two to three episodes where they took any risks.

The general consensus is that FF didnt have to suck if they had stuck with their guns. Look at the power Laird had when rejecting ideas for the next season from Playmates, why couldnt he have done the same with 4Kids request to make it lighter? The season had a great concept, but it could only suceed as an emulation of Phantom 2040 and Batman Beyond
It's because it was something he wanted as well because it's more like vol.4 than anything we've ever seen.
And funny he didn't reject one of the worst ideas in tmnt history...friggin baby turtle side kicks..that's enough to make me stop watching turtles right there.
My fandom is seriously on the brink of not existing for this new stuff anymore.
Perhaps I just know to much inside stuff and that's whats killing it for me.

[The Shelf]

And funny he didn't reject one of the worst ideas in tmnt history...friggin baby turtle side kicks..that's enough to make me stop watching turtles right there.

Wait, what? Who rejected the idea then? I thought Laird was the only one at Mirage who could reject proposals.

[Drtooth]

Well, for that matter, the entire Fast Forward season(s) would have fit better in the OT.

To me, FF was almost like they were trying to do the OT, but they were doing everything the wrong way. If you took a lot of the plots, rewrote them with the personalities of the OT turtles, changed the dialouge to reflect that, and just did a lot of sharpening here and there, I'd say they could have used these stories for OT.

However, they made things light in the wrong aspect. it's like taking Batman TAS, and putting him in 1960's Adam West batman type stories. While Batman TAS had its share of fun, campy episodes (like the one where Joker was mentally controlling all the comedians to become odd supervillains), I still think the point is valid.

Had FF been darker where it had to, it would have been a might closer to what they intended. plus, if they realised it wouldn't go beyond 2 (production) seasons, they would have known when to end it, and how to end it, without egregious filler like Headlock Prime.

That said, other than the live action TMNT series, I haven't hated any TMNT television series. I just felt FF was uneven all over.

But that's all Monday Morning Quarterbacking.

I will say, 13 episodes would be great for this particular idea. That means they know how to start it and how to finish it, unlike FF. I can see little filler, and maybe returning to the darker roots, while keeping slight levity to keep the youngins interrested.

[VaughnMichael]

Wait, what? Who rejected the idea then? I thought Laird was the only one at Mirage who could reject proposals.
Playmates rejected the stupid idea to have the turtles with their annoying cutsie baby selves as side kicks..and peter liked the idea.
The man has lost his mind I swear..not only that but the fact that the people who work for him get treated like complete crap when they have the fans intrest at heart really p1sses me off.

[odupianist]

In regards to FF being darker, aren't some of the comics of FF a bit darker than the cartoon?

[The Shelf]

Playmates rejected the stupid idea to have the turtles with their annoying cutsie baby selves as side kicks..and peter liked the idea.
The man has lost his mind I swear..not only that but the fact that the people who work for him get treated like complete crap when they have the fans intrest at heart really p1sses me off.

Ah, my bad, I thought it was Playmates that came up with the idea to begin with. I don't follow this stuff close enough sometimes.

[VaughnMichael]

Ah, my bad, I thought it was Playmates that came up with the idea to begin with. I don't follow this stuff close enough sometimes.
It's all good...no 4kids came up with the idea and peter liked the way it blew up that skirt he wears.:lol:

[ZariusTwo]

In regards to FF being darker, aren't some of the comics of FF a bit darker than the cartoon?

The UK Strips are slightly more enjoyable, but there not as good as they could be. Furman really doesnt seem to like writing anything but Transformers and phones it in on anything else (though he seemed to start treating his Power Rangers SPD strips better as he began wrapping them up)

[Drtooth]

Ah, my bad, I thought it was Playmates that came up with the idea to begin with. I don't follow this stuff close enough sometimes.

Which one, FF or the others?

I recall the first three proposals-

Super Hero CCG- Idea: 4kids. Rejection: Laird

Overload babies- Idea: Playmates and Laird. Rejection: 4kids

TMNT with elements of old series- Idea:" Rejection: Laird.

Though in all honesty, that last one sounded great, but I couldn't see it as anything but a second relaunch. The ideas just wouldn't work unless viewers tossed out most of the continuity of the 2k3 series. I ahte to admit it, but that's what I saw as the problem. Maybe if they got rid of the whole Hamato Yoshi Splinter idea, it could have worked as a finisher to the series.

I still have hope for this series, though. I mean, we have a dramtic reason why Splinter is trapped in the past, a nice seguay from FF, and it's only one (production) season long, and that's it. No waffling with episodes that were one shots, and they clearly have a direction fot a longer plot.

[VaughnMichael]

Overload babies- Idea: Playmates and Laird. Rejection: 4kids

TMNT with elements of old series- Idea:" Rejection: Laird.
First one wrong...the idea was 4kids and peter approved it..Playmates rejected the idea.
Second one was playmates idea and was the best one out of the lot.

[Drtooth]

First one wrong...the idea was 4kids and peter approved it..Playmates rejected the idea.
Second one was playmates idea and was the best one out of the lot.

Ah. Gotcha. My info was confused. Plus, I was doing it all from memory.

[VaughnMichael]

Ah. Gotcha. My info was confused. Plus, I was doing it all from memory.
I was also and it's A ok :)

[Herr_Shredder]

Should it be this hard just to do another season of TMNT?

Why can't it just be TMNT why the sub-lines ?

[The Shelf]

Should it be this hard just to do another season of TMNT?

Why can't it just be TMNT why the sub-lines ?

Does the new season have a subline? Fast Forward is the only subline I know of. But I wouldn't be surprised if they give the new season a subtitle just because they've already started down that path and it would be weird to go back.

[Scandia]

The DVDs featuring episodes from the third season have the subline of "Ways of the Warrior".

And is the "Ninja Tribunal" an official subline for the 5th season?

[Masked Ninja]

They doesn't show up in the title in the intro sequence, so no. Those are storyarcs. Well... "Ninja Tribunal" is. "Way of the Warrior" was more of a DVD topic. "Mutants and Monsters" was another, though it only lasted for one DVD.

[Ninjinister]

Yeah, right, Jeri's entire ordeal was much darker than TMNT's fourth season.

Exactly part of the point I was trying to make. I heard even the edited dub version gave kids nightmares. Imagine this: picture Baxter's insanity from Insane in the Membrane, if you've seen it. Now imagine it occurring to a little girl (shudder)

It's all good...no 4kids came up with the idea and peter liked the way it blew up that skirt he wears.

Yeah... that line was so disturbing I threw up in my mouth a bit.

[gobo]

Well, these might be more like 'code-names' for the most part. But, there was 'Fast Forward'. Then, the first three known proposals for 2008 were 'Superworld' (the card/videogame), 'Overload' (turtle-tot sidekicks) and 'Ultimate Ninja Turtles' (the one with the Hamato Splinter origin). I haven't the slightest what the approved proposal is called. As far as whether or not it will be made official like 'Fast Forward' was, I can't see them not revising the title again as going back to the four-word title would suggest that it isn't a follow-up to 'Fast Forward'. I just can't see that happening. :ohwell:

[ZariusTwo]

Exactly part of the point I was trying to make. I heard even the edited dub version gave kids nightmares. Imagine this: picture Baxter's insanity from Insane in the Membrane, if you've seen it. Now imagine it occurring to a little girl (shudder).

Not to mention Impmon, the comic releif, was the character that killed Leomon and caused Jeri's breakdown in the first place.

[AquaParade]

My...uh...computer's being slow right now...yeeeea. Anyone wanna lemme know waht exactly your talking about right now? Sounds interesting.

[Sage Ninja]

I'm waiting for a a TMNT subtitle along the lines of: Betrayal and Malice











:|

[ZariusTwo]

My...uh...computer's being slow right now...yeeeea. Anyone wanna lemme know waht exactly your talking about right now? Sounds interesting.

Generally how Digimon Tamers was better than the fourth season of TMNT.

[VaughnMichael]

Generally how Digimon Tamers was better than the fourth season of TMNT.
Really...I'd say season 5 the anime knock off episodes..but not season 4 but to each his own I guess. *shruggs*

[Mr._Mutant_Man]

I wish I could find a picture of the April "Mighty Bean" to post a sarcastic comeback to that.... I really do....

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/6987/fattyaprilbeankq7.jpg

If she had blue skin she'd look like she had tried the gum at Willy Wonka's factory and ended up a giant blueberry.

I think it's the belly shirt, that out of all the beans, makes her look like a blimp.

[Ninjinister]

Generally how Digimon Tamers was better than the fourth season of TMNT.

I was just saying it was darker than most of TMNT. I never said anything about it being better. Is that what my opinion is? I won't say. All that I know is emo Leo bugged me.

EDIT: This is post #666 for me :D

[Drtooth]

Generally how Digimon Tamers was better than the fourth season of TMNT.


Ugh. The first half of Season 4 was tumbleweeds, man. They kept having the same exact interfearing with an alien war/ fighting giant monsters plot. In fact, most of the merchandise that was released that time was subbranded "TMNT: Mutants and Monsters."

I felt the second half of the season was pretty good. I have to get the DVD to see that banned episode, but over all, 4 was indeed a half decent season.

[ToTheNines]

I have to get the DVD to see that banned episode, but over all, 4 was indeed a half decent season.

It's avaliable in decent quality on youtube if you don't wanna buy the DVD.

[Drtooth]

It's avaliable in decent quality on youtube if you don't wanna buy the DVD.


Oh, I want the DVD. I just haven't been able to get it.

Back on topic: I'm still worried that everyone's gonna have cat mouths. Look at that opening shot of the Turtle Titan episode. Hun Looked like he was going to Meow.

[Scandia]

Banned episode? Which episode was that?

[Roseangelo]

Insane in the Membrane

[Jester]

Banned due to Baxter's going nuts and falling apart. :P

[Splinter's Iroonna]

I thought they looked more bunny-like than cat--- all he needed was the bunny teeth.

[Scandia]

Banned where? On 4kids? Mental illness is a fact of life. Hey, they devoted pretty much the whole 4th season to Leonardo's psychiatric injury- although PTSD is in the "mainly due to environmental factors" end of the spectrum.

Glad I have the DVDs.

[Jester]

It was produced and a change was made in the S&P people and so an episode that was "ok"ed by the old, was deemed to over thre top by the new.

[VaughnMichael]

Banned where? On 4kids? Mental illness is a fact of life. Hey, they devoted pretty much the whole 4th season to Leonardo's psychiatric injury- although PTSD is in the "mainly due to environmental factors" end of the spectrum.

Glad I have the DVDs.
Um Scandia his body decomposes and falls apart through the episode and April later kicks him and his jaw comes off.

[Fugitoid Jones]

Um Scandia his body decomposes and falls apart through the episode and April later kicks him and his jaw comes off.

Yeah, had to say I was surprised they did all that stuff with Baxter in that episode. But then again, I wasn't surprised with the fact that it was banned.

[Masked Ninja]

Me neither... it was cool and a great episode (fleshing out* villains ftw), but not for the 5-year-olds that commonly watch 4Kids on Saturday mornings. Can you imagine the uproar from the moms when they walk into the room and see their little darling staring at Baxter's hanging jaw?

*EDIT: Oh man, terrible unintended pun...

[Spitfire]

Me neither... it was cool and a great episode (fleshing out* villains ftw), but not for the 5-year-olds that commonly watch 4Kids on Saturday mornings. Can you imagine the uproar from the moms when they walk into the room and see their little darling staring at Baxter's hanging jaw?

*EDIT: Oh man, terrible unintended pun...

And you people are still surprised FF happened? Seriously I've been saying this for months now. 2K3 is way to much for little kids to handle not just the violence but the very adult plot lines that most children don't get.

Kids want to see their heroes kick the crap out of bad guys and have a happy day. Not all the other drama that ensues. Adults love it, kids however...

[Masked Ninja]

Surprised, no... extremely disappointed, yes. There's a difference. :trazz: And "Insane in the Membrane" is a moot point, as it never aired anyway.

[Spitfire]

Surprised, no... extremely disappointed, yes. There's a difference. :trazz: And "Insane in the Membrane" is a moot point, as it never aired anyway.

Agreed but they were barking up the wrong tree already with episodes like "Dragon's Rising" where a monster gets sawed in half with a mini-gun and it runs away with it's guts hanging out. The whole episode we find out it's just a lonely monster who misses it's wife and kids, again stuff kids don't want to see.

I'Monster, a psychopath who feeds live people to rats. Also Leo is acting like a nut bag and kills the Rat King to his knowledge.

Tales Of Yoshi, Teng Shen is murdered by Yoshi's best friend and Yoshi kills him.

Bad Day, Turtles watch their whole life crash down in front of them, including their closest friends being killed right in front of them.

I could go on but you see what I'm getting at. I loved season 4 too and I believe had 4Kids let it alone we would have all loved FF instead of just half the fans enjoying it but in reality we have to face that kids don't enjoy that stuff. I just wish the heads at 4Kids hadn't changed cause that's the only reason the series was forced to water down.

[Raph's Girl]

Oh look a new vehicle/toy for the 2008 season. Looks like it's straight out of Tron:

http://bp2.blogger.com/_gb-JVVPbQkU/R2bVc--HYJI/AAAAAAAABSs/KR6PAN7Db3g/s1600-h/RIPPER-cyber.jpg

[Drtooth]

Oh look a new vehicle/toy for the 2008 season. Looks like it's straight out of Tron:

\

WOW.... That has some serious GITD potential to be sure....

that said...

And you people are still surprised FF happened? Seriously I've been saying this for months now. 2K3 is way to much for little kids to handle not just the violence but the very adult plot lines that most children don't get.

Kids want to see their heroes kick the crap out of bad guys and have a happy day. Not all the other drama that ensues. Adults love it, kids however...

Exactly what I've been saying. All this time, episodes like that one and the unproduced Nightmares recycled show they wanted a cut and paste kiddy show rather than a dark series that had a sustaning subplot. So yeah, cheesy kiddy action is what sells, and the ratings have been higher now than they used to be, so unfortunately it works.

[ZariusTwo]

"Insane In The Membrane" was cut from premiering around the same time 4Kids gained a new board of directors didnt it? The originals were responsible for allowing the content of the darker show because they had enough stability to renew it and keep younger audiences busy with animes they were dubbing. Now the present team want TMNT to be a backbone of their scheduling and their ratings draws with One Peice and Pokemon being dubbed by other companies.

[tortugapower]

"Insane in the Membrane" and "Nightmare's Recycled" were pulled because they had some crazy stuff going on in them that should not have made it into the show in the first place.

In IitM Stockman's new body is literally rotting away, he nails his arm back on, his jaw rots off at one point.. it's a mess and really not intended for kids. FOX broadcast standards would not have allowed it, I forget whether or not it was even bothered to be submitted for review.

When "Nightmare's Recycled" came back from the animation studio it was even worse. Here is a description SPOILER ALERT:
Hun actually had a conjoined twin, and during a flash back he has some back alley doctor remove his deformed brother. The doctor keeps the brother and you see him pouring acid on the baby etc... doing experiments, the brother eventually stops (kills or turns him into a henchman.. i forget) the doctor and brother becomes the Garbageman. I guess this whole sequence was the worst part.

Also Casey proposes to April! FUN!


Most of the episode was animated. Retakes, music and sound effects were never done because it was shelved at this point.

No one in their right mind would've aired these episodes here in the states. That said, maybe they'll see an American DVD release some day as bonus features.

[Jester]

Tortuga, where are you getting your info? Are you the member who is a board artist for the show?

[AquaParade]

Oh look a new vehicle/toy for the 2008 season. Looks like it's straight out of Tron:

http://bp2.blogger.com/_gb-JVVPbQkU/R2bVc--HYJI/AAAAAAAABSs/KR6PAN7Db3g/s1600-h/RIPPER-cyber.jpg

Meh, not very ninjaesque.

[Sage Ninja]

Agreed but they were barking up the wrong tree already with episodes like "Dragon's Rising" where a monster gets sawed in half with a mini-gun and it runs away with it's guts hanging out. The whole episode we find out it's just a lonely monster who misses it's wife and kids, again stuff kids don't want to see.

I'Monster, a psychopath who feeds live people to rats. Also Leo is acting like a nut bag and kills the Rat King to his knowledge.

Tales Of Yoshi, Teng Shen is murdered by Yoshi's best friend and Yoshi kills him.

Bad Day, Turtles watch their whole life crash down in front of them, including their closest friends being killed right in front of them.

I could go on but you see what I'm getting at. I loved season 4 too and I believe had 4Kids let it alone we would have all loved FF instead of just half the fans enjoying it but in reality we have to face that kids don't enjoy that stuff. I just wish the heads at 4Kids hadn't changed cause that's the only reason the series was forced to water down.
I think both adults and TV execs are to quick to think that kids can't enjoy cartoons plots that involve deeper emotinal issues and tragidy. Just look at some of the cartoons from the eighties and early ninites. There where quite a few that managed to be both silly and pc in some ways but also have some dark themes and serious issies. Like the orginal Care Bears (especially the movies), The Gummi Bears, The Real Ghostbusters, My Little Pony. Heck I even remeber watching Nick jr. a version of Nick specically aimed at preshoolers, and seeing some pretty silly yet serious cartoons that incorporated some emotinal themes. Like the Lil' Bit's, Grim's Fairy Tale Classic, (which sometimes had episodes dealing with death, and dealings with the Devil), and the Noozels's. The Noozel's had a plot that involved the the husband of the main character's grandmother getting lost, and her emotional turmoil at finding out what really happened to him. And David the Gnome probably one of the most immagintive and intelligent cartoons I remember from my childhood that even had the main character die at the end of the series. I liked how the cartoon of David the Gnome had faith in the audiance's abilty to grasp complex information (by childtren's standards) since they never really dumbed down the the medical, cutural, or geographical information that was prevelant in that series.

[Fugitoid Jones]

I think both adults and TV execs are to quick to think that kids can't enjoy cartoons plots that involve deeper emotinal issues and tragidy. Just look at some of the cartoons from the eighties and early ninites. There where quite a few that managed to be both silly and pc in some ways but also have some dark themes and serious issies. Like the orginal Care Bears (especially the movies), The Gummi Bears, The Real Ghostbusters, My Little Pony. Heck I even remeber watching Nick jr. a version of Nick specically aimed at preshoolers, and seeing some pretty silly yet serious cartoons that incorporated some emotinal themes. Like the Lil' Bit's, Grim's Fairy Tale Classic, (which sometimes had episodes dealing with death, and dealings with the Devil), and the Noozels's. The Noozel's had a plot that involved the the husband of the main character's grandmother getting lost, and her emotional turmoil at finding out what really happened to him. And David the Gnome probably one of the most immagintive and intelligent cartoons I remember from my childhood that even had the main character die at the end of the series. I liked how the cartoon of David the Gnome had faith in the audiance's abilty to grasp complex information (by childtren's standards) since they never really dumbed down the the medical, cutural, or geographical information that was prevelant in that series.

I agree. I hate the idea of "dumbing" shows down for kids. If we do nothing but feed kids stupid shows, kids are going to grow up stupid. I've watched alot of stupid cartoons, and look at me.
It's the same with children's movies. Look at suck stupid and "dumbed down" movies like Madagascar and Open Season, and then look at such Don Bluth classics as the Land Before Time and An American Tale. LBT and AAT both had some serious and dark themes, but both have proven to be children's movies that have lasted, while Madagascar and Open Season will be forgotten before you know it.

[Fugitoid Jones]

I think both adults and TV execs are to quick to think that kids can't enjoy cartoons plots that involve deeper emotinal issues and tragidy. Just look at some of the cartoons from the eighties and early ninites. There where quite a few that managed to be both silly and pc in some ways but also have some dark themes and serious issies. Like the orginal Care Bears (especially the movies), The Gummi Bears, The Real Ghostbusters, My Little Pony. Heck I even remeber watching Nick jr. a version of Nick specically aimed at preshoolers, and seeing some pretty silly yet serious cartoons that incorporated some emotinal themes. Like the Lil' Bit's, Grim's Fairy Tale Classic, (which sometimes had episodes dealing with death, and dealings with the Devil), and the Noozels's. The Noozel's had a plot that involved the the husband of the main character's grandmother getting lost, and her emotional turmoil at finding out what really happened to him. And David the Gnome probably one of the most immagintive and intelligent cartoons I remember from my childhood that even had the main character die at the end of the series. I liked how the cartoon of David the Gnome had faith in the audiance's abilty to grasp complex information (by childtren's standards) since they never really dumbed down the the medical, cutural, or geographical information that was prevelant in that series.

I agree. I hate the idea of "dumbing" shows down for kids. If we do nothing but feed kids stupid shows, kids are going to grow up stupid. I've watched alot of stupid cartoons, and look at me.
It's the same with children's movies. Look at such stupid and "dumbed down" movies like Madagascar and Open Season, and then look at such Don Bluth classics as the Land Before Time and An American Tale. LBT and AAT both had some serious and dark themes, but both have proven to be children's movies that have lasted, while Madagascar and Open Season will be forgotten before you know it.

EDIT:: ooops, double post.

[Spitfire]

Kids were raised differently back then that's why it sold well. Parents cared less about what their kids watched because there weren't school shootings being blamed on the media. Now that that's happened every soccer mom from the west coast to the east looks for an excuse to law suit these networks over obscene content.

Think about it, they didn't invent the PG-13 rating until late in the movie game. It was either PG or R and a lot of movies that were considered PG back in the fay are PG-13 now and even had some stuff that could be considered R. The first turtles movie would never have been like that had it been made in the 90s. The swear words alone would have bagged the movie a easy PG-13 rating, not taking the fact the villain is crushed to death in a trash compactor.

Point being kids are being raised differently now. Parents are more cautious on what their kids watch and that's why shows like TMNT don't do well.

[ZariusTwo]

Is it me, or does that 2008 ripper toy look like something from Jayce and the Wheeled Warriors?

[Drtooth]

I agree. I hate the idea of "dumbing" shows down for kids. If we do nothing but feed kids stupid shows, kids are going to grow up stupid. I've watched alot of stupid cartoons, and look at me.

Well, you go on to say the movies are similar, but I disagree. The case of the movies is basically corporate synargy, trying to get as many celebs to do voice work for weak, weak scripts. It's a totally different case, I feel. Pixar did some pretty dark stuff with the Incredibles, like the montage of super heroes with capes getting sucked into jet engines. That's the blackest humor I've seen in a movie in years, kids or otherwise.

Anyway, the television stuff is dumbing down. And there are mnay factors why. It costs too much to produce an animated series now, and it's highly unprofitable (no thanks to an FCC ruling banning food advertisements, yet letting all the media outlets get purchased by monopolies). And another FCC ruling forces networks to run 3 hours a week of educational programming, meaning some of the networks have to grab hand me downs from their cable networks, or to produce weak shows with random morals bookended into the action (Sushi Pack was completely ruined by this).

Not to mention the parents. Okay. Riddle me this. Back in the 1950's, kids were watching Westerns, where Cowboys shot Injins every five minutes, kids were playing with toy guns, and I do not recall any school shootings happening back then. I mean, the 80's saw a rise in action, sure, but it was still a little stifled. It wasn't until Batman TAS where they really broke the mold, allowing shows like X-men and Spiderman to be darker than their previous versions (as for X-men, the show only existed as a pilot in the 80's)

There are multiple factors for this, including Action for Children's television that dominated the 70's and 80's, and still hovers over children's TV. And a lot of childless old women purposely watch kids television and then call up all the sponsers to protect the children they never had.

Add to the fact that preschool programming has been sanitised by white soccermoms and Child Psycologists with questionable credentials, makes it even more rediculous. All shows now are like Dora the explorer. loud, slow, and pretending to be interactive on a medium like Television. How is this stuff not going to raise a generation of retarded, hyperactive, violent kids?

Hell, I'm surprised that TMNT got away with half the stuff they did, even in FF.

[Turtleman100]

Yes a all new season of our 4 turtles heros.

[Fledermaus]

*looks at Digi-Turd motor vehicle design... slams head down onto keyboard.*

mjkhuygcf

And the curse continues. Earlier in this thread I read that, apparently 2-5 year old boys gave FF a reasonably high rating. While I agree that FF is not badly done, the fact that the critiques of toddlers are taken into higher consideration than anyone literally over the age of eleven saddens me. It's reality, I know, that babies or rather their parents buy the most toys. Babies. Barely able to talk.

I have extremely low hopes for the upcoming season. I expect it to be crap. At best, I will be proven wrong. At best, it might have a decent script, nice pacing, stories that, for all their TV-Y subject matter will be well-told. Animation will be simpler so that the babies won't be confused by complex movement, shapes, or colors. It will be kiddier, with no multi-episode arcs or major plotlines or stuff that little kids won't possibly be able to appreciate. (Hey, and if I'm wrong, no disappointment. :D)

I was six when I first started watching Batman the Animated Series. Even then, I liked the show a lot because I knew it was good -- it looked good and the stories were good, and though I couldn't quite understand everything, I knew there was a lot of meaning to what I was watching. I did appreciate it, even though at the time I couldn't say why.

I guess either I was a very abnormal child, or humans in the span of one decade are maturing later and later in life.

Now... I feel compelled to draw some fanart for the upcoming series -- the turtles transforming in cyberspace.

I know I'm a broken record, but I wish... oh I wish I wish they'd drop the gimmicks. They're already teenagers AND mutants AND ninjas LIVING IN THE SEWERS OF NYC. They can go to the digital world for an episode. Heck, even a five-episode arc. But no one's a turtle fan because the turtles live in a cool futuristic society or are champions of the digital realm. (Of course I could be wrong.:|) TMNT is one of the most prostituted of franchises. I must remind myself of this frequently. It'd be hilarious if I didn't care so much. After I make my major contribution as a fan, maybe I will stop caring and move on to better things.

[Drtooth]

[QUOTE=Fledermaus;578624

And the curse continues. Earlier in this thread I read that, apparently 2-5 year old boys gave FF a reasonably high rating. While I agree that FF is not badly done, the fact that the critiques of toddlers are taken into higher consideration than anyone literally over the age of eleven saddens me. It's reality, I know, that babies or rather their parents buy the most toys. Babies. Barely able to talk.[/QUOTE]

"Slamms head equally as hard on keyboard"
87tehjty

2-5 year olds are NOT SUPPOSED TO BE WATCHING A SHOW RATED TVY7.

They should be watching Sesame Street or Arthur. Pheh. No wonder why FF was so dumbed down. can't wait to see the green team on Diaper pails and Gerber baby food jars. Way to raise your kids right, America.

[Masked Ninja]

I gotta say this vehicle design is not... very Turtles-esque at all. Fast Forward II: CyberTurtles, anyone?

I'll watch it... but if it turns me off as fast as Fast Forward did, then I'll probably leave this to the toddlers again.

The sad thing is Arthur, while on PBS and more accessible to kids that age, is also miles more entertaining for older folk too. Why can't the TMNT seem to hit that magic blend of entertainment and cleverness?...

*goes back to studying... sigh*

[The Shelf]

Babies. Barely able to talk.

Is it sad that when I read this, I immediately heard Shredder yell, "BABIES! They're BABIES!!!"

Wow, that gave me a good laugh. But you have a point. I will now continue to read the rest of your post...

[VaughnMichael]

Is it me, or does that 2008 ripper toy look like something from Jayce and the Wheeled Warriors?
It's you...:lol:
Not to mention the parents. Okay. Riddle me this. Back in the 1950's, kids were watching Westerns, where Cowboys shot Injins every five minutes, kids were playing with toy guns, and I do not recall any school shootings happening back then. I mean, the 80's saw a rise in action, sure, but it was still a little stifled. It wasn't until Batman TAS where they really broke the mold, allowing shows like X-men and Spiderman to be darker than their previous versions (as for X-men, the show only existed as a pilot in the 80's)
Add to the fact that preschool programming has been sanitised by white soccermoms and Child Psycologists with questionable credentials, makes it even more rediculous. All shows now are like Dora the explorer. loud, slow, and pretending to be interactive on a medium like Television. How is this stuff not going to raise a generation of retarded, hyperactive, violent kids?

It's because people today aren't like they where back then, most kids today are spoiled, rotten, depressed for no reason other than because it's cool because everyone else is doing it, selfish, no mannerd idiots who think they know everything.
It's funny they said they where worried about Gen X but if you ask me we're doing just fine.
These next 2 generations bellow us is what they need to be worried about..they worried so much that they didn't treat us correctly growing up that they now baby every generation bellow us.
Yeah bad idea..I fear for the future because of such things.
And the curse continues. Earlier in this thread I read that, apparently 2-5 year old boys gave FF a reasonably high rating. While I agree that FF is not badly done, the fact that the critiques of toddlers are taken into higher consideration than anyone literally over the age of eleven saddens me. It's reality, I know, that babies or rather their parents buy the most toys. Babies. Barely able to talk.
Dude I want a bloddy TMNT as much as the next guy but come on this is for the kids and your comment about them is pretty damn rude..I don't know about the rest of you but I was talking by age 2 and by age 5 I more than knew what I wanted and could dress myself and knew for sure what toys, food, and clothing I wanted.
Kids aren't all stuppid gibberish drolling pooping stink fountains.

[VaughnMichael]

haven't seen all 13 episode premises yet but from the 5 or 6 that I've seen it appears that either most of certain episodes or small parts of others take place in Dimension X, er, I mean, the cyber world (Cyberia?).
CLICK HERE TO VIEW FOR YOURSELF (https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=2490093766124645019&postID=4538600795738858492)

[Fledermaus]

Dude I want a bloddy TMNT as much as the next guy but come on this is for the kids and your comment about them is pretty damn rude..I don't know about the rest of you but I was talking by age 2 and by age 5 I more than knew what I wanted and could dress myself and knew for sure what toys, food, and clothing I wanted.
Kids aren't all stuppid gibberish drolling pooping stink fountains.

It's called hyperbole.

And I was talking and potty trained before I was eight months. Perhaps I am freak. But I know I didn't see things then quite the same as I saw them when I was fourteen or now.

My point still stands.

I don't dislike small children. I was one once. They can play a game of freeze tag and capture the flag better than a lot of stick-up-the-butt adults. People tell me I'm good with kids. I do not hate them. Well, not all of them. Toddlers might know how to wipe their butts and dress themselves -- hell I know one who can already multiply and divide numbers.

But I disagree that toddlers and guys over age eleven are going to view something the same way and pick up on the same things. I disagree that the adolescent + age range should be completely discounted. But then again, I care more about quality than I do about numbers. I realize that such an outlook is not "profitable" by current entertainment standards.

[odupianist]

I'm waiting for TMNT: Kung Fu. Where every episode is like a cheesy, horribly dubbed, Kung Fu movie.

[X]

Ok first they say the Turtles were going back home...

So now they go home, only to visit Cyberspace every episode?

Bleh... I will try and remain optimistic, but I think it is pure bullcrap that The Simpsons can be on its 18th season and be the same, and Pokemon has been on for almost ten years, and is basically the same.

Power Rangers is the same, only different colored Rangers, and different stories, and yet, even it remains basically the same...

-X-

[Drtooth]

Dude I want a bloddy TMNT as much as the next guy but come on this is for the kids and your comment about them is pretty damn rude..I don't know about the rest of you but I was talking by age 2 and by age 5 I more than knew what I wanted and could dress myself and knew for sure what toys, food, and clothing I wanted.
Kids aren't all stuppid gibberish drolling pooping stink fountains.

Agreed. But that doesn't meant that the kids should be watching something TV Y7. I mean, the 5 and 6 year olds fine. But even I feel that kids that young shouldn't watch something that dark and violent. 2 reasons. Reason one, they have to actually accommodate those kids, further dumbing it down, or rather younging it up. And secondly, that's what PBS shows like Arthur are for. If parents want to whine and beyotch about violence in cartoons and television, they should at least monitor what their kids are watching. If I had kids, I sure wouldn't let them watch a TVy7 show until they're at least 5 or 6.

[Spitfire]

The same concept works reverse in the video game world. They make games over the top and outwardly violent just to appeal to 12 year olds because only they think that stuff is "cool" If they make a series more family friendly they get a wider audience of kids to watch it. Also in the movie world, they market PG-13 films at little kids, Spider-man 3 and Transformers anyone?

I don't know if my cousin accounts for the majority of 7 year olds out there but I showed him "The Shredder Strikes Back Part 1" and he didn't like it because it was to violent, and when he sees violence he covers his eyes. He loves Spider-man but he won't watch the fight scenes in the movies just the other parts. Now he's almost 8, his birthday is in April, and he's always been like this. He doesn't like the Power Rangers or Batman series but he loves the toys.

So my point being is even kids 7 years old don't like watching people kick the crap out of each other. Honestly if the series was TV-14 or TV-12 if that exists it would make more sense. 2K3 as a whole was marketed at older kids but older kids don't watch Saturday morning cartoons they sleep in till noon for the most part on weekends. A very small demographic of adults watch turtles on the air, not just on DVD that doesn't count for squat, so the majority of the audience is little kids. And if most kids are like my cousin I can see why 2K3 had a format change.

[The Shelf]

I'd say your cousin's not in the majority, at least as far as young boys go. I remember watching dark cartoons when I was that young, and I loved it. My brother enjoyed them too. Frankly, I don't know any kid that age who covers his eyes because someone gets punched on tv unless it's R-rated stuff. If there was blood, then I could understand, but 2k3 isn't nearly as dark and violent as people make it out to be.

[Scandia]

but older kids don't watch Saturday morning cartoons they sleep in till noon for the most part on weekends.

I did watch Saturday morning cartoons all the way till college. In college I did not watch them because I had activities going on. But I have always been an early riser.

but 2k3 isn't nearly as dark and violent as people make it out to be.

No it's not. Why do soccer moms and fundamentalists make such a big fuss about this?

[ToTheNines]

Hmmm, I don't think most kids are like your cousin. When I was 7 I was watching Batman TAS and loving it. I also have a 7 year old cousin (who is a girl) and when I was baby sitting her around Halloween I decided to show her the TMNT Halloween special. She loved it and begged to watch more, so since I already had in "Mutants and Monsters" she watched episodes like "I, Monster", "Darkness Within", and "Bishops Gambit" and thought they were awesome. This is a girl who watches Camp Lazlo, Fairly Odd Parents, and Barbie movies.

Also, just about every little kid I've known is/was always trying to watch R movies and play fight with whoever they wish.

[Spitfire]

Yes when we were 7. You do realize that it's alot different now then it was when we were kids right? Cartoons for the most part are all dumbed down for little kids to watch. Shows like Batman TAS were the norm back then not anymore. 2K3 turtles is going against the current not with it like everything else. The ratings speak for themselves FF has higher ratings then 2K3 did, because it's more child friendly. It was an experiment and now that they saw it worked their going to try and take the fans into consideration in this new season and bring back 2K3 but don't expect the FF style to go away. Serling being there is a testament to that.

Invader Zim is another example Mr.Tooth's Avy reminds me, except it didn't get a second chance like turtles.

[tcclives23]

I'd say your cousin's not in the majority, at least as far as young boys go. I remember watching dark cartoons when I was that young, and I loved it. My brother enjoyed them too. Frankly, I don't know any kid that age who covers his eyes because someone gets punched on tv unless it's R-rated stuff. If there was blood, then I could understand, but 2k3 isn't nearly as dark and violent as people make it out to be.

I agree . . . for the most part. However, there was one part in particular (well that I can remember) that was really dark and violent. Exodus Pt. 2. Shredder kicked their asses. That was violent! Very cool but also violent. Huh, I still cringe when Shredder breaks Raph's back and Mikey's legs.

[VaughnMichael]

I agree . . . for the most part. However, there was one part in particular (well that I can remember) that was really dark and violent. Exodus Pt. 2. Shredder kicked their asses. That was violent! Very cool but also violent. Huh, I still cringe when Shredder breaks Raph's back and Mikey's legs.
You know I do also but it's more the noise of it than the visual.:ohwell:

[The Shelf]

Yes when we were 7. You do realize that it's alot different now then it was when we were kids right? Cartoons for the most part are all dumbed down for little kids to watch. Shows like Batman TAS were the norm back then not anymore. 2K3 turtles is going against the current not with it like everything else.

Erm, no. Things aren't nearly as different as you think, only your perception of it because you're older now. Seriously, there were so many cartoons that I watched when I was younger, and when I watch them now (despite my desire to say otherwise if only out of nostalgia) I realize that they weren't nearly as awesome as I thought when I was a kid. Batman TAS was a special case. It was no more or less part of the norm back then than it is now.

But I agree with you on one thing, at least. Friendlier cartoons like Fast Forward are definitely more profitable than more serious cartoons like 2k3. This shouldn't surprise anyone. Even the best R-rated movies are never as successful as the best PG-rated movies. Why? Because they entertain a wider audience. It's no different with cartoons or anything else for that matter.

[gobo]

Even the best R-rated movies are never as successful as the best PG-rated movies.
Anyone know how bad PG-rated movies can be before they get less profitable than the best R-rated movies? That'd be interesting.

[Spitfire]

Erm, no. Things aren't nearly as different as you think, only your perception of it because you're older now. Seriously, there were so many cartoons that I watched when I was younger, and when I watch them now (despite my desire to say otherwise if only out of nostalgia) I realize that they weren't nearly as awesome as I thought when I was a kid. Batman TAS was a special case. It was no more or less part of the norm back then than it is now.

I'm, not speaking on how good the series is I'm speaking on the level of violence and adult humor allowed into the series.

[gobo]

Adult humor? Meaning in 2K3? O_o If so, I don't recall any. Examples, please...

[Spitfire]

Where was I talking about 2K3 in that last comment?

Cartoons in the 80's and 90's were more violent and filled with more adult humor then they are allowed to now. This is due to parents being more over protective of their kids and what they watch.

Now why I brought this up was to explain this point, which does involve 2K3 but not in the context you thought I was talking about.

2K3 being re-vamped to FF doesn't surprise me at all, and if you look the ratings were higher for FF so when the new series comes out expect a hybrid of the two. 2K3 will never come back. Serling being in the new season is a testament to what I'm saying.

[syk_skillz]

Adult humor? Meaning in 2K3? O_o If so, I don't recall any. Examples, please...

I remember the phrase "compensate much?" said to Mikey but that was in FF

[gobo]

Where was I talking about 2K3 in that last comment?
I was under the impression that "if so" was a good-enough indicator that I wasn't sure. Chill.
I remember the phrase "compensate much?" said to Mikey but that was in FF
"Overcompensate much?" might make people think about particular situations, but it wasn't used in an even questionable manner. That's like saying Tinky-Winky was a gay-joke. So, that was just a regular joke with slightly suggestive wording. Thanks for the example though. :)

[Cure]

Justice League had lotsa adult humor, and that show ended only recently. I remember The Flash getting accused of watching porn and whatnot. :lol:

[Leonardo Mystic]

Adult humor? Meaning in 2K3? O_o If so, I don't recall any. Examples, please...

I can recall a really good one from Return New York Part One. It was half of Raphael's opening dialogue at the beginning. "They say the difference between men and boys is the size of their toys. If that's the case, I'd say I just became a man. Or at least an adult mutant ninja turtle."

He was piloting that flying laser cannon as he said it, but it has bigger implications than simply reference to the machine. o_o I don't think I'll ever forget that.