Are the Turtles still aliens?

[TurtleMaster4]

Originally Posted by sgtfbomb

Shredder was probably the most disappointing aspect of the script. I have no problem with changing the character, but, essentially, it's not really the same character. He's an alien/inter-dimensional being that poses as a human colonel, infiltrating the army with his own faction. He changes form and has a spiky body, if I remember right. His name was Col. Schrader.

If I remember right, it was less of an alien planet or more of an alternate dimension, rifting over into our world. Essentially, imagine if the Turtles themselves were born in Dimension X. Krang is a dictator and if I recall he wants to cross over into our world and dominate it. There are turtle people, and apparently, since Splinter knew their parents, rat people. This is all fine and dandy, except there is some lame prophecy crap.

But this irrelevant because everything has most likely changed, re-tooled, or fleshed out, since this was an early draft. Early drafts are often godawful.

I agree with your point that shredder was the most disapointing part of it. In all of Ninja Turtles history, he is a ninja, but now he's a colonial, and the foot "ninjas" are now an army unit.

I don't mind the whole prophecy "crap" I liked the star wars prequels, they are a peice of art to mem so I'm a big fan of the chosen one thing. The thing with the script is the turtles themselves are aleins, and that's a big jump. If they were just mutant who some how found themselves and were part of a prophecy that a bunch of MUTANT reptiles from another planet, must come an face an alien threat, I would be perfectly fine with that. But of course, it's not like that.

Let's just hope the scripts had some major changes over the last year or two.

[chrisdude]

Originally Posted by Slap-Happy

That's a lie. The script is written by Appelbaum and Nemec, and dated January. Those guys came on after Platinum Dunes came on to do the movie a couple years ago.

I figured the script was too new, but I didn't know those writers worked with Platinum Dunes.

The plot, the over-the-top action sequences, the way the turtles' characters are so shallow, the stupid jokes - everything about that script screamed Transformers, and it was mindblowing to hear Michael Bay say it was before his time.

[Sleepingseeker]

Originally Posted by Zulithe

The fact that the turtles are FROM earth is what makes them 'our' heroes and relatable. If they are from another planet it changes them totally.

Couldn't agree more.

[chrisdude]

The origin isn't such a big deal, to me. I think the important thing is that they grow up on Earth not knowing it. And they did, in the leaked script. Like adopted children, the dynamic would change after they found out, but the turtles were very much American and human, because of the world they grew up in.

I'm also not bothered by The Foot being a military unit. And honestly, I thought the Schrader thing was pretty cool.
I've seen so many origin stories, so many Shredders, so many Foot Clans. And I'm not even old. I'm cool with trying something different.

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

I'm also not bothered by The Foot being a military unit. And honestly, I thought the Schrader thing was pretty cool.
I've seen so many origin stories, so many Shredders, so many Foot Clans. And I'm not even old. I'm cool with trying something different.

I can handle "different". But I draw the line at "****ing retarded". I won't see this movie if any aspect of Col. Schrader is left intact.

[chrisdude]

Originally Posted by ToTheNines

I can handle "different". But I draw the line at "****ing retarded". I won't see this movie if any aspect of Col. Schrader is left intact.

I don't think it's less reasonable than a ninja clan in present day America.

[Wildcat]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

The origin isn't such a big deal, to me. I think the important thing is that they grow up on Earth not knowing it. And they did, in the leaked script. Like adopted children, the dynamic would change after they found out, but the turtles were very much American and human, because of the world they grew up in. I'm also not bothered by The Foot being a military unit.

And honestly, I thought the Schrader thing was pretty cool. I've seen so many origin stories, so many Shredders, so many Foot Clans. And I'm not even old. I'm cool with trying something different

I agree. Didnt read the script but everything Ive heard sounds kinda cool to me. Im sure Im in the minority here, lol.

Regardless of Bay I like the idea of alternate origins. Not as replacements but as fresh takes. Long as the characters still represent their usual self.

Ive thought an alternate-origin Batman would be cool. Instead of his parents killed hed be a regular joe who works his way up but doesn't become rich.

[Zulithe]

You know what the leaked script reminds me of...

Super Mario Bros. Yeah, the live action film from 1993.

I was really young then but I remember liking it because it took a sort of "realistic" approach to mario. Where bowser is a human and his goomba thugs are humanoids with lizard heads... the princess is really not much of a princess at all... and they use robotic boots to "jump" high :/

While I don't think TMNT needs a "realistic" spin (aliens are not more believable than mutants, IMO), you can see a lot of similarities, like how it takes the established lore and it tries to filter it into something more... palatable? Something that will appeal to more people, like sci-fi fans.

And I hate it. Yeah if I were 10yo today I might still like it, but I'm not 10 and I'm not having it. This approach to adapting material is exploitative and ultimately will result in a product that is easily forgotten and despised by the fanbase just like Super Mario Bros. was.

Imagine what a Mario movie could be like if they took the source material and instead of pushing it into a different mould they just took it seriously and gave it a treatment it deserves. Worked for Lord of the Rings. Worked pretty well for the first live action TMNT film, given the constraints they had to deal with it still turned out quite well.

[shuriken]

^^ The problem with Mario is anyway you look at it it's an Italian dude tripping out on Shrooms. Granted that movie would be amazingly hilarious but someone should make one for the sake of the Mushroom Kingdom.

[Wildcat]

Super Mario Bros is a bad example imo. That was terrible. It wasn't just different origins and a different take. They literally changed everything (except mario and luigi).

A human Bowser and Goombas with bodies? and Yoshi was like a JP raptor. From a realistic stand point I guess Yoshi was ok but everything else was totally different.

Here (from what Ive read, I have not read the actual script) the turtles would still be turtles. Shredder would still be a guy with spikes. Him being an alien is certainly believable. Just look at him in the 2k3 cartoon.

Commanding an army is even more believable. The foot and Krang use guns and weapons in the cartoons. Having an army is not farfetched at all.

[Zulithe]

You don't think making shredder a colonel and changing his name into a joke as well as making the turtles ALIENS FROM SPACE are comparable terrible design choices to that found in Super Mario Bros? We are on two different worlds then.

I think you are underestimating what a big change to the lore it actually is. The TMNT are mutants... from earth... mutated from earth lifeforms. If they are aliens then what does that mean about mutants? There are no mutants on earth? Everything is from Dimension X then? If there are still mutants then WHY? it no longer makes sense to even have mutants in this universe if the TMNT themselves aren't even mutants.

Ciro broke it down perfectly himself on his last comic con panel. The core elements of TMNT shared across all iterations: mutants, dimension x, ninjas and brotherhood. If any of those are missing, it's not TMNT anymore.

It changes A LOT. Stop ignoring it. Instead, raise hell so hopefully we can influence someone to change it if they haven't already.

[Wildcat]

@ Zulithe, as I mentioned in my first post I dont mind this type of thing as a different take but NOT as a replacement. I see what youre saying and what everyone else is too. Ive seen it on IMDB also.

What Im saying is I think itd would be cool as a different take on it, if just for 1 movie. Not that this would become the standard for TMNT storytelling.

As long as the characters still represent their usual self, which it sounds like it would, I think itd be fun to see a different spin on it.

Super Mario Bros did not do that, from what I remember (have not seen it in so long). Human Bowser and thug Goombas in no way represent how they were in the games. Turtles still being turtloids and Shredder still being a dude with spikes and soldiers is still a representation of how they've always been.

I hope you understand what I mean.

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

I don't think it's less reasonable than a ninja clan in present day America.

It really is. How the **** is an alien going to infiltrate the US Army and bring in his own personal group of soldiers?

With ninjas, they always work. Look at Batman Begins. I mean, ninjas could be around in real life, and we just don't know about them

[sgtfbomb]

It's not exactly like it, but yeah, the first draft did remind me of the Super Mario Bros movie, in a way. Krang is trying to merge the dimensions and enslave human kind. However, it was the bad humor that did me in. The sexy Turtle chick just seems like something you would see in a poor adaption from the 90s.

[CyberCubed]

The whole concept is horrible. It completely changes the characters into something they're not.

IDW and Nick managed to make new universes with new ideas and yet it still feels true to the original material.

I always got the feeling the new movie would be the worst of the 3 new incarnations too.

[chrisdude]

I wouldn't be surprised if it were the worst version. But I think it'd be because of how Michael Bay treats the turtles. No, he's not the director or the writer, but that script is exactly Transformers for TMNT. I don't wan the turtles to be goofy background characters like the Autobots were

[Leonardo87]

Yes; yes they're aliens. For Goodness sake people; we must stop this madness!


Seriously; do people still think this? Why? I think they need to learn a Mirage book in my opinion.

[Konchadunga]

Being aliens wouldn't automatically ruin the movie for me, but at the same time, I feel it is completely unnecessary. The Turtles have gone to fight aliens on Earth, other planets, and even other dimensions before, without being aliens themselves, so given that, why change it? I see no point.

[CyberCubed]

Being aliens completely destroys the TMNT concept.

[zodiac brave]

seems as arbitrary as the spider-man origin change from amazing. i thought it was ridiculous and i think this is ridiculous.

did it ruin amazing spider-man? well, that movie seemed to have so many shortcomings at the end of it all, that it made that detail seem insignificant to the other worse, far more blatant mistakes.

that's exactly my thought on how this movie might end up anyway.