The Donatello Thread

[ssjup81]

You know, I think Donny has become my favorite for 2k12. I love how emotional he is and I like his outbursts. They're funny and it is interesting seeing how he handles stress. I also like his sarcastic nature.

As I mentioned earlier back on page 1 or 2 of this thread, as a kid, I always favored Raph for the OT series because of his slight cynicism and sarcastic smart allecky humor. I've always liked that type of humor. 2k12 Donny have some of those traits now, and I do enjoy it.

So my fav turtles for the mediums I've been exposed to...

OT: Raph followed by Mikey, but since revisiting the series as an adult, Donny (for reasons mentioned earlier in this thread) inches up above both.

Mirage: Donny followed by Mikey

Archie: Donny followed by Raph

TNM: I'm one of the rare ones who liked the premise of Venus...but admits to her execution being bad. Other than that I don't recall much about the series.

Movies 1-3: I didn't have one...although for movie 1 I loved Raph as a kid. I was pretty neutral with the others.

2k7 movie: Didn't have one

2k12: Donny followed by Leo

Interesting how some can find an aspect about a character interesting while another may find it irritating or bothersome.

I also think that it's nice that I can finally include Leo in a favorites list. lol.

[Netkeeper]

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

I never minded seeing characters other than Raph being moody or angry - the way I look at it, everyone has a darker side, and the potential for darkness within them, and it's refreshing not always having Raph be the go-to guy for that kind of thing.

Indeed, everyone does have a darker side, especially the turtles. I just don't like it being overplayed and I don't like the general tone and feel associated with the turtles' personalities going way off from what I've grown accustomed to. It doesn't make sense.

Originally Posted by Powder

Staff comments, podcasts, that sort of thing, they've made it pretty clear that's their mission. Whether or not they're able to succeed (as Nick, Playmates, or Viacom could ultimately step in and insist things stay goofy for the sake of ratings/toy sales) remains to be seen. I have faith, though. I've definitely seen elements of it sprinkled throughout.

Then I'd love to stay informed and see if it happens. I am genuinely interested in developments like this, as I love realistic character writing [which 2k12 has had almost none of especially in comparison to earlier TMNT works].

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

It's weird actually, now that I think about it, Raph and Donnie probably both have the same tendency to not talk about their emotions, and channel their stresses into being overachievers. With Raph, he vents his stress on physical pursuits, with Donnie I imagine he pushes himself with his science and techno-projects.

I never minded seeing characters other than Raph being moody or angry - the way I look at it, everyone has a darker side, and the potential for darkness within them, and it's refreshing not always having Raph be the go-to guy for that kind of thing.

It's nice to see other sides that aren't rage-aholic angry, or devastatly sad. He can be cocky when he happy, and mischievous when he wants to have fun.

[pennydreadful]

Originally Posted by Luckyday

It's nice to see other sides that aren't rage-aholic angry, or devastatly sad. He can be cocky when he happy, and mischievous when he wants to have fun.

Absolutely. The way I look at it is that yes, everybody has certain personality traits specific to them as individuals, but it makes for dull reading/viewing if someone acts the same way all the time. Not to mention, people change throughout their lives as well.

[ssjup81]

Out of curiosity, for this version, does anyone else feel that when in that fight mode, when his eyes go white, that Donny looks the most intimidating compared to the other three?

[Netkeeper]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

Out of curiosity, for this version, does anyone else feel that when in that fight mode, when his eyes go white, that Donny looks the most intimidating compared to the other three?

It's probably because he's the tallest. Makes him come across as imposing as opposed to dorky.

[pennydreadful]

Originally Posted by Netkeeper

It's probably because he's the tallest. Makes him come across as imposing as opposed to dorky.

That's actually a really good point... I never thought of that. I agree, I definitely find white-eyed Donnie most intimidating!

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

That's actually a really good point... I never thought of that. I agree, I definitely find white-eyed Donnie most intimidating!

I like him even more. lol. Oh yeah, in the intro when all four are together (the part after being given their masks), Donny really looks intimidating with that smile and the white eyes. I LOVE it!!

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

Absolutely. The way I look at it is that yes, everybody has certain personality traits specific to them as individuals, but it makes for dull reading/viewing if someone acts the same way all the time. Not to mention, people change throughout their lives as well.

It especially great for them to react in a way that's relatable but in a way that will make sense with in the context of their characters.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by Luckyday

It especially great for them to react in a way that's relatable but in a way that will make sense with in the context of their characters.

I agree. I like Donny in this incarnation because he's so emotional, imo, compared to the other incarnations I've read/seen. I like Leo for this incarnation because he's so laid back, but still has that seriousness to him.

[ssjup81]

You know I take back what said about Donny being stalkerish. I was rewatching some eps. One I rewatched was Mutagen Man Unleashed. The part where they were trying to figure where April was had me change my mind slightly. Donny mentioned that she was probably in the park. The guys didn't stop or react until he added in "on a date". So it seems her being in the park is common (there is a photo openly showing them in the park) for her.

That irrelevance aside, what do you think of Donny's fighting? I notice that he rarely ever uses his naginata. They'd probably fight off the Kraang a heck of a lot faster if he did. Do you feel if this may be a way to show off his slight pacifist side? Even Mikey uses his kusarigama a lot compared to Donny using his naginata on the Footbots and the Kraang.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

You know I take back what said about Donny being stalkerish. I was rewatching some eps. One I rewatched was Mutagen Man Unleashed. The part where they were trying to figure where April was had me change my mind slightly. Donny mentioned that she was probably in the park. The guys didn't stop or react until he added in "on a date". So it seems her being in the park is common (there is a photo openly showing them in the park) for her.

That irrelevance aside, what do you think of Donny's fighting? I notice that he rarely ever uses his naginata. They'd probably fight off the Kraang a heck of a lot faster if he did. Do you feel if this may be a way to show off his slight pacifist side? Even Mikey uses his kusarigama a lot compared to Donny using his naginata on the Footbots and the Kraang.

Possibly. Donnie doesn't seem to pull out the Naginata blade against a living creature unless absolutely necessary such as that unseen fight against Slash.

But we also see Splinter have fights with a Naginata blade as well. Splinter is more of a martial pacifist which means he uses Martial Arts to find inner peace and prolong his life. But if the people he cares about most are hurt or threatened, be prepared to be pwned because he will mop the floor with your ass.

Donnie has hints of being a pacifist in previous incarnations, but it's never really explored or talked about. I mean yeah there has been some people he has killed without mercy or remorse such as the Shredder and Stockman. However there are other people he has killed and he has felt bad about it. Such as that one militia leader who wanted to set off a nuke in the city during one of times the Turtles are in Northamption.

Even though the guy essentially killed himself, Donnie doesn't take it as a victory because as he put it 'He was a flawed individual, but he was still and individual that desired change.'

I think Donnie's qualms about killing someone are more based in how human they are in his opinion. I mean in the Mirage Comic when the Turtles defeat the Shredder, they give him the option to commit sepuku (ritualized suicide) and die honorably. But Shredder chooses a cowards way out to take himself and the four of them out with a grenade instead. So Donnie makes the split decision to knock him and the grenade off the building.

With Stockman, Donnie secretly kept him alive for years with the hope that there was good in Stockman's genius. But in the end realizes that Stockman was evil through and though.

OT Turtles the Turtles normally don't kill villains. One because of the censorship wouldn't allow it because it's a kids show and all that. Also they prefer to leave the villains in their own mess. The only time we see a Turtle really go out of his way in an attempt to kill the Shredder was "Night of the Dark Turtle" Where Donnie gets electrocuted and become a homicidal nut job.

2k3 Donnie is more gentle-hearted and not as gung ho as his brothers. Often in battle he will stand off to the side and defend the non-fighters such as April. Or will find a logical solution to minimize the casualties or avoid unnecessary fights. And in later battles he would partner more with Master Splinter instead of brothers.

Like the rest of his brothers he will fight and take lives if needed particularly if his brothers and father are threatened. But in the long run he would rather leave the enemy incapacitated and no longer able to fight vrs. leaving them for dead.

As for Donnie in the 2k12 version. There are hints where it is hinted Donnie is a pacifist. But unlike other versions he seems to be less accepting of that aspect of himself. The first real hints we have of this is in Metalhead where Raph in essentially traps Donnie into admitting he is a pacifist.

Raph: I get it, this is a weapon for wimps to afraid to fight. (I.E. This is a weapon for cowards)

Donnie: No it's a weapon for wimps to smart to fight (I.E. This is a weapon for pacifists) I I...mean.

A pacifist is more anti-killing not anti-fighting. But the difference between a coward and a pacifist is how they approach battle. A coward will run from battle to save their own skin, and when they fight at all it would be against an enemy who they is weaker then they are or is unable to fight back. Such as the Shredder wanting to execute Splinter when he was chained up.

A pacifist on the other hand will join in a battle, but would smart enough to discover the necessity of a battle or find means to defeat an enemy without taking his opponents life. Or sacrificing the lives of his companions or innocents around him.

However in moments where they are forced to end the life of someone, and depending on the type of pacifist it can cause some severe mental and emotional damage. Such as having a "Blue Screen"-esk break down.

Donnie isn't a martial pacifist in the same sense as Splinter. He's more what could be coined as a technical pacifist.

I.E. Unlike the principle of Thou Shalt Not Kill pacifist, the Technical Pacifist is certainly capable of making the killing strike if there was no other option, but he doesn't ever treat it lightly and may have some emotional backlash because of it. Sometimes, a Technical Pacifist may have an aversion to certain weapons due to their lethality, preferring to fight with his fists and other blunt weapons that are less likely to kill someone. Also perfectly fine with the villain causing their own demise.

The turtles themselves have been trained to use killing as a last resort. Such as when April had asked if she could use the ninja skills she would be gaining to kick peoples butts. Splinter answers with "We don't believe in using our skills in that way, but...yes."

So yeah they all would be affected by taking the life of an opponent just as much as they are effected when an ally sacrifices themselves for them. But Leo, Raph, and Mikey would tell themselves it was for the greater good because many other innocents would have been lost if they didn't do what they did. Donnie on the other hand would wish things didn't have to come to that end. Particularly if another option was possible.

Which is where I think the Pulverizer comes in. Because every time he appears he seems to draw out the pacifistic side out of Donnie.

In his first appearance Donnie offers to train him, because he couldn't let the Pulverizer leave the lair in good faith. Because he knew that he would still go out and face the purple dragons regardless of whether he can truly take them on. So by training him he would at least have some means of having a better chance of surviving. And it was hammered home that by training him, Donnie is the one who would be responsible for whatever came of it.

The other Turtle's more then likely wouldn't have bothered training him, they would have shrugged it off and said if he foolishly decides to go after the Purple Dragons, that's his own fault. Though I do think that retrieving the power cell vs. letting an innocent person die would have been a no brainier. They all would have chosen to save him, instead of retrieving the power cell. But they wouldn't be happy with him because of it.

In Pulverizer returns, Donnie is the only one of the Turtles who is adamantly telling the Pulverizer to get out of the Foot. This is of course for the Pulverizer's safety because the Foot Clan are their enemies and if the Shredder or his hench mutants suspected or learned the Pulverizer was associated with the Turtles it could be hazardous.

None of the other Turtles see much problem with the situation and feel if he can pass them information on what the Shredder is planning then all the better. I get the impression that the other Turtles never knew Donnie had taking the Pulverizer as a student even if it was temporary. If they had known, maybe they would have been less dismissive about it. But instead when Donnie takes off in the Stealth bike, Leo sighs as if saying "Donnie, what's wrong with you?" And in the end when he's mutated, since they couldn't physically save him due to the acid that made up his body. The other Turtles were ready to chock him up as a lost cause and leave him to his fate.

Then in Mutagen Man Unleashed, we sort of get the hint that the Pulverizer feels like he's the victim in all this. I mean the way he acts when in Pulverizer Returns when Donnie tells him to get out of the Foot. He looks up as if interpreting it as "Wait, Donnie wants me out of the Foot because he's afraid I'd be better then he is."

So in his mind he sees Donnie has the better mutation, a cute girl as a love interest, and better skills. While he's just a blob in a jar who is mounted on to the wall and treated like a pet. But when Donnie is telling him about how April doesn't want to see them any more, because they were responsible for her father mutation. He's probably thinking "Wait this April girl is a victim of the Turtles too. If she doesn't like Donnie any more, then maybe she'll like me."

During the battle, there is one point where Leo rushes at Mutagen man to eliminate him. Because Mutagen man had tried to kill Raph, but Donnie jumps in and says "No Don't hurt him." And in the end when Donnie tampers with that mutagen canister there is a moment where he tells the Pulverizer not to drink it. And it's clear he didn't take any pleasure in hurting Mutagen Man in this manner. But as Raph said "He did what he needed to do."

As for further encounters, I don't know. Ciro has said that not all characters will have a happy ending, and Donnie's responsibility for Pulverizer wouldn't have been pointed out so heavily if there wasn't going to be any serious results.

There is a likely hood that Donnie may need to step away from the group and reevaluate who he is as a ninja for a while.

[Netkeeper]

As much as I like your post, I don't think Donnie's lack of use of his naginata blade has anything to do with pacifism mostly because I don't think the 2012 turtles have that much depth and the writing staff is even paying that much attention to begin with. I think they just plain forget he has it. Also, on that note, the naginata works a lot better for Splinter than it does Donnie, imo.

I just can't see 2012 Donnie as a pacifist in the same way previous incarnations of the character are because he's so uptight and quick to anger. Idk, every pacifist I've ever met fell under the category of "gentle and laid back, hard to anger but once you piss them off watch out". [Which is the personality Don had in his 2k3 incarnation and I think it worked really well for him. Friendly, generally opposed to killing, prefers to talk things out than fight, but absolutely not a pushover either.]

[Donatello19]

Not to add to the shipping war thing but...

The next episode involves mind swapping, and Casey and April swap (Casey is in April's body and vice versa). In the preview, Casey takes advantage of this and touches April's butt, since he has control of her body, and April says "Stop pinching your own butt Casey!".

But Donnie is the creep, right?

[Sighphi]

Originally Posted by Donatello19

Not to add to the shipping war thing but...

The next episode involves mind swapping, and Casey and April swap (Casey is in April's body and vice versa). In the preview, Casey takes advantage of this and touches April's butt, since he has control of her body, and April says "Stop pinching your own butt Casey!".

But Donnie is the creep, right?

Yup, Jones crossed the line.
Don wins!

[pennydreadful]

Originally Posted by Donatello19

Not to add to the shipping war thing but...

The next episode involves mind swapping, and Casey and April swap (Casey is in April's body and vice versa). In the preview, Casey takes advantage of this and touches April's butt, since he has control of her body, and April says "Stop pinching your own butt Casey!".

But Donnie is the creep, right?

... this Casey, man. Nyyyygh.

[Donatello19]

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

... this Casey, man. Nyyyygh.

I agree with you, he's probably my least favorite Casey so far. I hope he gets a little more mature after a while, because let's face it, right now he's just a stereotypical teenage guy...who happens to fight crime.

[pennydreadful]

Originally Posted by Donatello19

I agree with you, he's probably my least favorite Casey so far. I hope he gets a little more mature after a while, because let's face it, right now he's just a stereotypical teenage guy...who happens to fight crime.

Oh I could handle him if it weren't for him acting like a total sleaze regarding April (and by association, antagonistic towards Irma). Seriously, I'm sure they're going to play the upcoming body-swap butt-squeeze for laughs, but it's really not funny to me - touching someone in a sexual way without their consent is totally not ok, and the only appropriate response for April to give would be a round-house kick to the head. Preferably once she's back in her own body, so she doesn't damage her own meat-suit.

[Netkeeper]

Originally Posted by Donatello19

Not to add to the shipping war thing but...

The next episode involves mind swapping, and Casey and April swap (Casey is in April's body and vice versa). In the preview, Casey takes advantage of this and touches April's butt, since he has control of her body, and April says "Stop pinching your own butt Casey!".

But Donnie is the creep, right?

Because if one does something inappropriate, the other's inappropriate actions are completely excused.

They're both ****in' creeps.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

I think you way over-think things where Don is concerned. Casey, however, has certainly done some things that would be called sexual harassment IRL. At least Donnie knows to keep his hands to himself! (Though I bet he WISHES....)