What if Casey Jones is black in the sequel?

[Xav]

Originally Posted by Netkeeper

What the hell?

That isn't what I said at all. I said white Shredder and white Aang/Katara/Sokka are different from making a white character non-white.

Learn to read.

No you didn't you said.

White Shredder and white Aang/Katara/Sokka are completely different things.

Plus I have no idea what that has to do with the fact that there would be people upset with a black Casey Jones.

[Netkeeper]

Yes, I said they were different from changing a white character to a non-white character.

[arkangel]

Some good thought provoking ideas here.
I'm almost always of the belief that characters should remain the same race as they were originally created. I'm also pleased to see a lot more racial diversity in comics and cartoons.

After reading some of the above posts, and thinking on it further, I can see how a lot of people would have a fit over a non-white April. Since my biggest area of fandom is the Mirage comics from the 80s, I forget that the average movie go-er would be set on the more mainstream April (white, redhead, reporter)
From my perspective, however, I really don't feel like I'm trying to make a forced fit or change April to something she's not, as I've always viewed her as bi-racial and that the original cartoon changed her into a white redhead just like they made dramatic changes to the turtles.

Oh, and from MY perspective, the JEDI are bad.

[pennydreadful]

Originally Posted by arkangel

Oh, and from MY perspective, the JEDI are bad.

Don't make me get Plinkett in here...

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by pennydreadful

Don't make me get Plinkett in here...

So... how bout we all shut up and leave the white people white, the black people black, asian people asian and so forth? If race isn't important to certain characters how bout we do something shocking and leave them the same race as conceived?

Instead of complaining, focus your energies on making the big comic/series/whatever and not make the main characters white. Or help the bigwigs know you want more multi-racial characters. After all it's the public media and general audience that made Batman so big. If noone watched or read, he'd be a forgotten Adam West fad. Give lots of love to Falcon, Cyborg, Static Shock, Storm, Blue Beetle, etc.

[plastroncafe]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

So... how bout we all shut up and leave the white people white, the black people black, asian people asian and so forth?

How about No?

[pennydreadful]

LOL whut? I like complaining on the internet - it makes me feel special. Besides, I look so darn cute when I'm getting all indignant.

[KROW]

I think what we all can take away from this is that if Casey Jones were to be a black man in the next film, that it wouldn't really matter, as long as the movie stayed true to his character. Sure, it may be a surprise, but it wouldn't not make sense, either. The theory that it would be done to garner more of a black audience is pretty laughable, since there are plenty of black people who are fans of the franchise and really don't give a crap.

To do it just for the sake of making a character black can be categorized as just poor casting and lazy production... which we seemed to have gotten with this movie so it can be even less of a surprise. So, hey, no harm done!

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

So... how bout we all shut up and leave the white people white, the black people black, asian people asian and so forth? If race isn't important to certain characters how bout we do something shocking and leave them the same race as conceived?
.

What about when they swap genders? They did that in Silent Hill and in the Robocop remake.

[plastroncafe]

Worked really well for the remake of Battlestar too.
Well...so long as you avoid the inane ramblings of the actor who played the role originally.

[arkangel]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

What about when they swap genders?

Round Two. Get ready to RUUUUMMMMBBBLLLEEE !!!

When they made Starbuck a woman for the Battlestar Galactica reboot, it was a momentously grand idea. I also heard through the grapevine that Thor has been stripped of his hammer and that the new Thor will be woman. I'm actually liking that change too. And I agree that all of the well established black superheroes should stay black as it would be too weird to visualize them as anything else and would be a huge disservice to the character and his/her creator. So I guess what I'm saying is I'm much more agreeable when they change the odd white character to black then the other way around. eg: Black Nick Fury was a definite improvement. Baxter Stockman being white in a past cartoon. Not so much...

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by arkangel

Round Two. Get ready to RUUUUMMMMBBBLLLEEE !!!

When they made Starbuck a woman for the Battlestar Galactica reboot, it was a momentously grand idea. I also heard through the grapevine that Thor has been stripped of his hammer and that the new Thor will be woman. I'm actually liking that change too. And I agree that all of the well established black superheroes should stay black as it would be too weird to visualize them as anything else and would be a huge disservice to the character and his/her creator. So I guess what I'm saying is I'm much more agreeable when they change the odd white character to black then the other way around. eg: Black Nick Fury was a definite improvement. Baxter Stockman being white in a past cartoon. Not so much...

*Facepalm* Those examples don't count. Ultimate Nick Fury is black. Normal Nick Fury is still white. Thor is still a man, another woman is taking the mantle, but the guy we know as Thor is still a guy.

The perfect example if the Kingpin. He's white in the comics and for whatever reason he's black in the movie. It's not another guy posing as the Kingpin. It's not like Wilson Fisk died and random black crimeboss took the mantle. It's Wilson Fisk.... turned black for whatever reason.

I do agree Clark Duncan did a good job in the role. But yeah... still... he doesn't look like that in the comics I'm reading.

[plastroncafe]

The problem with retaining the status quo when translating older properties into newer movies/television shows/comics/whathaveyou, is that the past is really white and male.

Like...a lot.

Every main titular protagonist in the Marvel Movie Universe is a white guy, three of which are played by a guy named Chris.

How many times has Batman gotten a movie? How about Superman? They even chose Hal Jordan to be Green Lantern, even though in the cartoon universe it's been John Stewart for years. Wonder Woman has never gotten a movie, and a Black Widow movie is no where in sight.

Oh sure there've been female protagonist comic movies: Cat Woman and Electra.
Both of which were of dubious quality. And as a result of poor box office numbers it was deemed that no one wants to see female lead comic movies.

Completely overlooking the fact that Batman got a reboot after "Batman and Robin."

It's messed up.

I would LOVE a Static Shock movie, or Jaime Reyes as Blue Beetle movie, but I think we're as likely to see that as we are to see Kamala Kahn as Ms Marvel, or Carol Danvers as Captain Marvel show up on screens, large or small.

[arkangel]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

*Facepalm* Those examples don't count. Ultimate Nick Fury is black. Normal Nick Fury is still white. Thor is still a man, another woman is taking the mantle, but the guy we know as Thor is still a guy.

The perfect example if the Kingpin. He's white in the comics and for whatever reason he's black in the movie. It's not another guy posing as the Kingpin. It's not like Wilson Fisk died and random black crimeboss took the mantle. It's Wilson Fisk.... turned black for whatever reason.

I do agree Clark Duncan did a good job in the role. But yeah... still... he doesn't look like that in the comics I'm reading.

Ahh, thanks for the clarification. Makes sense that THOR would be a mantle taken up by the new female character. Would suck having LINDA norse god of thunder.
As a huge Spidey fan, I agree about Kingpin as well. He was far too well established as a white character to have been changed, regardless of how well a job Duncan did with the role.

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

The problem with retaining the status quo when translating older properties into newer movies/television shows/comics/whathaveyou, is that the past is really white and male.

Like...a lot.

Every main titular protagonist in the Marvel Movie Universe is a white guy, three of which are played by a guy named Chris.

How many times has Batman gotten a movie? How about Superman? They even chose Hal Jordan to be Green Lantern, even though in the cartoon universe it's been John Stewart for years. Wonder Woman has never gotten a movie, and a Black Widow movie is no where in sight.

Oh sure there've been female protagonist comic movies: Cat Woman and Electra.
Both of which were of dubious quality. And as a result of poor box office numbers it was deemed that no one wants to see female lead comic movies.

Completely overlooking the fact that Batman got a reboot after "Batman and Robin."

It's messed up.

I would LOVE a Static Shock movie, or Jaime Reyes as Blue Beetle movie, but I think we're as likely to see that as we are to see Kamala Kahn as Ms Marvel, or Carol Danvers as Captain Marvel show up on screens, large or small.

Why do people keep forgetting that Hal Jordan was the first Green Lantern and therefore it makes sense to have him in the movie? Siniestro has no beef with John anyway, his deal is with Hal.

A Batman movie starts off with Bruce Wayne. It's not gonna start with Dick or Jean Paul taking the mantle. Nor does Iron Man start with the time when Rhodey was Iron Man for a while. It starts with the first.

Hal was the first. End of story. It's not the movie's fault the dumbass cartoon skipped straight to the 3rd of 4th Lantern when they did it. It's nothing about black or white. John just wasn't the first Lantern is all.

[Candy Kappa]

Hal isn't the first GL, though. And even if we disregard the original non-core lantern, Hal still isn't the first. The core was well function before he joined.

It would't be too hard making a John movie and just casually mention he is number X that's been granted a ring from planet Earth.

[Xav]

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

How about No?

How about we all just get along?

[plastroncafe]

I'm well aware that Hal Jordan is the first human Green Lantern for sector 2814. What I'm saying is it's telling that they chose him for the movie when the lantern that most people who aren't into the comics identify as being Green Lantern is John Stewart.

These movies don't need to start with the first.
It's like saying we shouldn't have Aang in the first incarnation of Avatar, because Wan was first.

There are good stories to be told. But instead of telling those stories we're rehashing the same origin stories over and over again. How awesome would it be to see a Batman story from the vantage point of Dick Greyson?

Or a Justice League story from the perspective of Jaime Reyes?

But no, the people who makes these movies...and i'm looking at you Geoff Johns, would rather see their childhoods on tv rather than cater to the next generation encountering the material for the first time.

[Slade]

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

Hal isn't the first GL, though. And even if we disregard the original non-core lantern, Hal still isn't the first. The core was well function before he joined.

It would't be too hard making a John movie and just casually mention he is number X that's been granted a ring from planet Earth.

Are you sure he doesn't mean in comics wise? Even though it was Alan Scott.

[Coola Yagami]

True, but movies always start the story from the beginning. If you want John, save him (and Kyle and Guy) for the sequels. Again, it's not the movie's fault the cartoons ****ed up. They already established Kyle Rayner in the series, then forget about him and put John in his place? And then they put a female sidekick of a male superhero in there? If they didn't want Wonder Woman to be the only woman there, why not bring in Black Canary? She's an all-original female that isn't the female sidekick/variant of an already pre-established male superhero. I always thought the JL cartoon lineup was kinda wonky due to PC executive meddling.

And don't get smart with Avatar. We know the show starts off with HIS adventures, so obviously a movie be about HIM. It's not like they're make a Dragonball movie about Master Roshi in his youth as he trained, or whenever Bardock first became a warrior. They'd start with Goku, plain and simple.

Yeah they do rehash origins over and over, but you kinda have to for newcomers. It's up to the sequels to do new stuff. Look at Batman. The Nolan trilogy had Rahs, Scarecrow and a more legit Bane. And Rahs and Scarecrow were in the first movie, the origin movie, and they weren't in the Burton movies when they did their origin movie. Same with Spider-Man facing the Lizard, Electro and.... uh.. Rhino... sorta... and they weren't in the McGuire trilogy.