Official Ep Discussion: S3 Ep12-13: "Battle for New York"

[Mew]

Originally Posted by Amaranthus

Old Hob could give so much emotional weight to this show.
I already have him written out entirely and I feel like it would work amazing on this show.

Something we actually agree on.

[TigerClaw]

The problem with adding Old Hob to the show, is the fact we already have a feline mutant who wears an eye patch, Old Hob wears an eye patch as well.

Spoiler:

Does Nick have room for two eye patch wearing mutants?

[CyberCubed]

Yeah the moment Tiger Claw was introduced I knew Old Hob would never be used on this show. They're not going to have two prominent villain cat-family mutants in the show.

[TigerClaw]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Yeah the moment Tiger Claw was introduced I knew Old Hob would never be used on this show. They're not going to have two prominent villain cat-family mutants in the show.

True, But I would love to see how Old Hob and TigerClaw would interact, They are complete opposites, Old Hob isn't a fan of the Foot Clan.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by TigerClaw

The problem with adding Old Hob to the show, is the fact we already have a feline mutant who wears an eye patch, Old Hob wears an eye patch as well.

Spoiler:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/...old+hob+03.jpg

https://tortueman.files.wordpress.co...tiger-claw.jpg

Does Nick have room for two eye patch wearing mutants?

Tiger Claw is a bit of an anomaly, he seems like he would be cool but he just plain don't fit into the story, they gave him so much yet so little. There's no character development, they just made a character with a bunch details in place, instead of letting him develop over time.

Hob is a bit different, they created him to be a simple thug and then gave him some development, they didn't try force a bunch of crap into him at once thinking it people would instantly love him, what's interesting about grew in time. He starts out as a simple thug, then he becomes a test animal, then he's betrayed and starts hating humanity which leads to him starting a mutant army. There's a growth to his character.

So in a bizarre way, despite their physical similarities, Hob and Tiger Claw seem to be opposite in how they were created and developed as well as how they contribute to the story.

Hob started out very basic, just an emotional state and a simple backstory, then his actions moved the story along and fleshed out his goal and personality details.

Tiger Claw on the other hand has a ton of things about established in his first episode (he's even promoted to second in command right away) but he hasn't changed much since then, he has barely done anything that moves the story forward for the 26 episodes since his introduction.

Spoiler:

OK now it's becoming a rant here, this is why I prefer the IDW series, crap like this!

How does the IDW series treat it's characters? Splinter, April, Casey, Karai, Hun, Baxter, Krang, Fugitoid, Hob, Slash, Harold, Lindsey, Renet, Kitsune, Zog, Alopex etc, hell, even Bebop and Rocksteady for Christ's sake, all of them either contribute to the storyline or they're actually fleshed out as characters! Sure there are some things that appear to be abandonned but most things seem to stay on track and keeps everything flowing. There are actual sub-plots developing which do in some part contribute to the main story.

The Nickelodeon show though? Got kind of stale in the second right? The main story about the Kraang trying to take over the world took 52 episodes to get anywhere and another 13 to reach (what is possibly) it's ultimate conclusion, which after almost a week of contemplating, did feel like it had rushed pace. Why did it take so long? Because they had to spend episodes on introducing characters like Spider-Bytez who barely even reappeared, if at all. Meanwhile, the characters that are meant to be mainstays grow stale because the lack of focus on them.

If you were to cut out all the episodes that lead nowhere and spliced together episodes that did lead somewhere but in such a small way it might as well be a scene in another episode, guess how long the series up until now would be? Probably shorter in quite a noticable way.

And then there's the sub-plot with the Foot... Urgh, despite being promoted as the main villain Shredder really does not do much does he? He's even absent for the first half of season 2, which puts all the character development of a Foot character on Karai untils she mutates, only then does Shredder show signs of taking a more active role. She mutates 48 episodes into the series, not only does this mean the Foot characters do very little for almost all of the first two seasons but it also makes Karai's character development really slow.

This is a serious problem, you can't commit to a serious story and make a great chunk of the episodes seem irrelevant. If you don't want purely episodic or serialised storytelling there is a spectrum, you can have an episodic show with a lot of world building or a serialised show that takes small breathers to develop the characters but this is just plain doing it wrong.

[TigerClaw]

Originally Posted by neatoman

Tiger Claw is a bit of an anomaly, he seems like he would be cool but he just plain don't fit into the story, they gave him so much yet so little. There's no character development, they just made a character with a bunch details in place, instead of letting him develop over time.

Hob is a bit different, they created him to be a simple thug and then gave him some development, they didn't try force a bunch of crap into him at once thinking it people would instantly love him, what's interesting about grew in time. He starts out as a simple thug, then he becomes a test animal, then he's betrayed and starts hating humanity which leads to him starting a mutant army. There's a growth to his character.

So in a bizarre way, despite their physical similarities, Hob and Tiger Claw seem to be opposite in how they were created and developed as well as how they contribute to the story.

Hob started out very basic, just an emotional state and a simple backstory, then his actions moved the story along and fleshed out his goal and personality details.

Tiger Claw on the other hand has a ton of things about established in his first episode (he's even promoted to second in command right away) but he hasn't changed much since then, he has barely done anything that moves the story forward for the 26 episodes since his introduction.

Spoiler:

OK now it's becoming a rant here, this is why I prefer the IDW series, crap like this!

How does the IDW series treat it's characters? Splinter, April, Casey, Karai, Hun, Baxter, Krang, Fugitoid, Hob, Slash, Harold, Lindsey, Renet, Kitsune, Zog, Alopex etc, hell, even Bebop and Rocksteady for Christ's sake, all of them either contribute to the storyline or they're actually fleshed out as characters! Sure there are some things that appear to be abandonned but most things seem to stay on track and keeps everything flowing. There are actual sub-plots developing which do in some part contribute to the main story.

The Nickelodeon show though? Got kind of stale in the second right? The main story about the Kraang trying to take over the world took 52 episodes to get anywhere and another 13 to reach (what is possibly) it's ultimate conclusion, which after almost a week of contemplating, did feel like it had rushed pace. Why did it take so long? Because they had to spend episodes on introducing characters like Spider-Bytez who barely even reappeared, if at all. Meanwhile, the characters that are meant to be mainstays grow stale because the lack of focus on them.

If you were to cut out all the episodes that lead nowhere and spliced together episodes that did lead somewhere but in such a small way it might as well be a scene in another episode, guess how long the series up until now would be? Probably shorter in quite a noticable way.

And then there's the sub-plot with the Foot... Urgh, despite being promoted as the main villain Shredder really does not do much does he? He's even absent for the first half of season 2, which puts all the character development of a Foot character on Karai untils she mutates, only then does Shredder show signs of taking a more active role. She mutates 48 episodes into the series, not only does this mean the Foot characters do very little for almost all of the first two seasons but it also makes Karai's character development really slow.

This is a serious problem, you can't commit to a serious story and make a great chunk of the episodes seem irrelevant. If you don't want purely episodic or serialised storytelling there is a spectrum, you can have an episodic show with a lot of world building or a serialised show that takes small breathers to develop the characters but this is just plain doing it wrong.

The problem with TigerClaw is that, They never followed through, on the back story on how he lost his tail, That something that needs to be explored on the show.

[xenopokemon]

Originally Posted by TigerClaw

The problem with TigerClaw is that, They never followed through, on the back story on how he lost his tail, That something that needs to be explored on the show.

Let's kill two underdeveloped birds with one stone. Tiger Claw lost his tail to Xever somehow when Xever was still human. Somehow in a later episode Xever gets the double mutation treatment and becomes Armaggon, he is happy with his new power and tells Tiger Claw he is the one that did it, kicks Tiger's Claw's tail (by that I mean beats the living cat out of him) and leaves the Foot to join the Purple Dragons.

[shredder orokusaki]

Old Hob is a cat while tiger claw is a tiger. Old hob is my enemy while Tiger Claw is on my side and second in command of the foot Which means he can appear in the show as he is a different character and he has nothing to do with Tiger Claw.

[xenopokemon]

Originally Posted by shredder orokusaki

Old Hob is a cat while tiger claw is a tiger. Old hob is my enemy while Tiger Claw is on my side and second in command of the foot Which means he can appear in the show as he is a different character and he has nothing to do with Tiger Claw.

You've completely missed the point that these guys were trying to make. Old Hob and Tiger Claw are both feline. Just because he doesn't like the Foot Clan doesn't mean he is on the Turtles' side. I don't know a lot about him, but from what I've seen, their body shape and size are similar and they both wear eye patches. Hob cannot and most likely will not appear in the Nickelodeon incarnation of TMNT.

[IndigoErth]

Finally get to stop avoiding this thread, now that it's 12 pages in and late to the conversation.

Pretty decent episode(s), good to see some characters reappear. Cool that Rockwell speaks now! Although I'll never stop cringing at that eye thing. lol

Loved how Leo and Slash ended it on different terms and what Slash said. Also, "Just like Space Heroes!" Nice to see a touch of the old Leo from back before he got all jaded with life and forced to grow up after prior events. And interesting(?) watching Leo and Donnie both reacting to feeling like their turf is being stepped on, esp Donnie.

Only thing I was a little "eh" on was the changing of all the people back to human again, that was awfully fast and easy for almost an entire city worth of people? Were they not somehow spread out working in groups on different floating island things or whatnot across Dimension X?

Whoever was in charge of the electricity must have seriously teleported right back to their chair if they turned it back on that fast. lol



I swear, if this Iguana lady or whatever she is shows up, I really kinda hope they don't intend on making her some kind of vixen. It would be awesome to have a female mutant added (even if not around much), not to mention an adult female of either human or mutant variety, but if they have to make her personalty reflect that image... I'll just facepalm early and get part of it over with.

Maybe it's just Kurtzman's unmentioned girlfriend, post mutation. Or just a friend. Hope she wasn't his pet. lol

[GoldMutant]

Wanted to wait until the episode aired on Nick before giving my thoughts but I'm ready to do so:

Battle for New York was a good special, bringing back older characters and wrapping up the Kraang plot decently. Subprime was hilarious like last time and had more screen time this time around, which helped. ("HERE'S KRAANGY!") Also, more plot development with the mutants forming the Mighty Mutanimals. Slash and Leatherhead were going to appear no matter what to me (I haven't read the story of the team in the comics with Pete), but I'm especially surprised with Rockwell's addition. Besides the plot telling of it, why was Tom Kenney used instead of Frank Welker?

The only real problem I had was the lack of Kraang Prime in this special, but it does open up more storylines for the Kraang's return.

I'd rate it a 9/10, it was awesome. Let's see how the rest of the season continues with the Foot Clan, Purple Dragons, and new additions of mutants transpires.

[Vicky82]

IGN review up

8.8

Should be over 9.0

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2015/03/1...ew-york-review

[JTH]

Originally Posted by Vicky82

IGN review up

8.8

Should be over 9.0

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2015/03/1...ew-york-review

No, I don't agree. 8.8 is about right.

The weird thing is I think the thing that hurt was that it was a 2 parter. Because then you compare it to the others, and it's not as strong as T.M.P., or Invasion.

The spot they were able to end it, they could have just made it 2 seperate episodes and I think it would have come off even better. As two seperate, these would have been awesome, but as a 2 parter, it doesn't hold up to the other 2 part episodes.

8.8 is pretty much what I gave it. Real fun episode, but I didn't really feel like the "it factor" that the other hour long specials did. Maybe that's because Nick cast as a primetime special, so it doesn't feel as special to me.

Oh well, that's my take anyway.

[Vicky82]

Originally Posted by JTH

No, I don't agree. 8.8 is about right.

The weird thing is I think the thing that hurt was that it was a 2 parter. Because then you compare it to the others, and it's not as strong as T.M.P., or Invasion.

The spot they were able to end it, they could have just made it 2 seperate episodes and I think it would have come off even better. As two seperate, these would have been awesome, but as a 2 parter, it doesn't hold up to the other 2 part episodes.

8.8 is pretty much what I gave it. Real fun episode, but I didn't really feel like the "it factor" that the other hour long specials did. Maybe that's because Nick cast as a primetime special, so it doesn't feel as special to me.

Oh well, that's my take anyway.

Yeah this special is more of a light hearted and fun episode and had a happy ending so I wonder if the season final will be more serious and have a sad ending with another cliffhanger, like The Invasion so to balance things out a bit.

Out of of the special this is my 3rd favourite (so far)

1. The Invasion
2. The Manhatten Project
3. Battle for New York
4. Rise of the Turtle
5. Showdown

[Karai Samurai]

Thatsapenis.gif

I swear deep down I'm a 12 year old boy because I couldn't help but focus on how phallic that missile looked. I really liked this episode, even though it wasn't as great as the season 2 hour long specials. So excited about the Mutanimals...finally the turtles have mutant allies. Surprisingly Foot free, though. And the actual freeing of the NY citizens was a bit too quick, but whatever. I agree with IGN; 8.8/10

[IndigoErth]

Not alone in immediately thinking that looked like... yeah.

[T-U-R-T-L-E POWA!]

Awesome episode and I loved finally seeing Leatherhead again. I was actually sorta hoping they would get stuck in Dimension X. I guess the only thing I would have liked to have seen would've been for Casey to do more. It was still really good though. My biggest gripe would actually be Mikey doing something so incredibly reckless at the start of the episode. I feel like sometimes they make Mikey a little "too" stupid. The retro mutagen is incredibly valuable and even he should know it's not to be messed with. I've not read through the thread but did anyone else think that was a little over the top for Mikey?

[T-U-R-T-L-E POWA!]

Out of curiosity, I noticed that Leo said in Dimension X that they couldn't take down "A" Technodrome. So does this mean there are other Technodromes and the reason that really stood out to me is that I thought back about when the first one that we saw landed out and sunk to the bottom of the water and that as a cliffhanger. I can't remember if that Technodrome ever came out of that water. Does anyone else remember?

[T-U-R-T-L-E POWA!]

Originally Posted by Karai Samurai

Thatsapenis.gif

I swear deep down I'm a 12 year old boy because I couldn't help but focus on how phallic that missile looked. I really liked this episode, even though it wasn't as great as the season 2 hour long specials. So excited about the Mutanimals...finally the turtles have mutant allies. Surprisingly Foot free, though. And the actual freeing of the NY citizens was a bit too quick, but whatever. I agree with IGN; 8.8/10

LOL! I thought that too...and I'm 33. HA!

[Raph's Girl]

I totally admit I squeed watching this episode. FINALLY after 20 years we have an animated adaption of the Mighty Mutanimals!! WOOH!! I loved every minute of it!

Can't wait for Mondo to pop up now.