Am I The Only One Who Feels Bad for Megan Fox?

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by The Stryker

Ridiculing and hating other people because they f*cked up in their life. Real honest and moral living.

I understand where you're coming from but I've seen too many people struggle, fail and succeed in those situations to take the ridiculous stand of "You did the thing. You are no longer worth anything and I look down on you."

Lots of people f*ck up their lives, for various reasons. Doing so with certain things like drugs, alcohol, gambling... that is a person CHOOSING to f*ck up their life, because there are absolutely NO good outcomes for people in those situations, yet they act like they were pushed. It's just another way to avoid responsibility.

To clarify, like anyone else, obviously, I still know lots of people in all areas of my life who abuse drugs and alcohol. And I do enjoy them individually and always hope that they start practicing common sense, yet seemingly am continually disappointed by them and do my best not to be around them when they screw up yet again. We all know where we stand; I do my best not to harass them, and they keep their bullsh*t far away from me. And in between, we get along fine. But more often than not, they end up dead or in jail, and that really doesn't speak much positive for people who accept that lifestyle.

I'm a very hard person. I'm hard on myself, and I'm hard on others. I don't like liars. I don't like thieves. I don't like abusers. As such, I don't like anything that contributes to a person BEING any or all of those things. People who choose addiction do so under the lie they tell themselves that their addiction "makes life easier", when in fact all it does is make it worse for everyone. Every person knows this in their heart. Which is why I cannot find it in mine to accept why so many people think they will be the ONE person who comes out the other side just fine. It's insane.

Some people believe deeply in the idea of redemption. And that's a fine and wonderful thing. But all things being equal, if we accept that people can be redeemed, we must also accept that they can fall so low as to no longer be of equal measure to other human beings. That's what I believe, that when you choose to hurt yourself and those around you, that you lose worth as a human being. I don't deny that it's possible to go back the other way... I've just personally never witnessed it. Most people who fall just keep falling, no matter who tries to help them, because they very often refuse to admit they've done anything wrong.

I know this particular point of view is pretty rigid and too hard for most people to accept, and that's fine, I guess. Frankly, I'm just not very accepting of "mistakes", especially ones that only have a set number of predetermined outcomes, the main one being death and the second one being poor. I completely can't understand it. And it absolutely can't be genetic, because if addiction was genetic then I would be a substance abuser, since almost everyone in my family is. That more than anything makes me feel it's not a "disease" as much as just poor, selfish choices.

I'm thankful every day I was able to escape my family's cycle, and it really bothers me that nobody else I share blood with has the "strength" to do the same. Instead they pass it on to their kids. It's like watching people get murdered in slow-motion.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Spoiler:

of people f*ck up their lives, for various reasons. Doing so with certain things like drugs, alcohol, gambling... that is a person CHOOSING to f*ck up their life, because there are absolutely NO good outcomes for people in those situations, yet they act like they were pushed. It's just another way to avoid responsibility.

To clarify, like anyone else, obviously, I still know lots of people in all areas of my life who abuse drugs and alcohol. And I do enjoy them individually and always hope that they start practicing common sense, yet seemingly am continually disappointed by them and do my best not to be around them when they screw up yet again. We all know where we stand; I do my best not to harass them, and they keep their bullsh*t far away from me. And in between, we get along fine. But more often than not, they end up dead or in jail, and that really doesn't speak much positive for people who accept that lifestyle.

I'm a very hard person. I'm hard on myself, and I'm hard on others. I don't like liars. I don't like thieves. I don't like abusers. As such, I don't like anything that contributes to a person BEING any or all of those things. People who choose addiction do so under the lie they tell themselves that their addiction "makes life easier", when in fact all it does is make it worse for everyone. Every person knows this in their heart. Which is why I cannot find it in mine to accept why so many people think they will be the ONE person who comes out the other side just fine. It's insane.

I know this particular point of view is pretty rigid and too hard for most people to accept, and that's fine, I guess. Frankly, I'm just not very accepting of "mistakes", especially ones that only have a set number of predetermined outcomes, the main one being death and the second one being poor. I completely can't understand it. And it absolutely can't be genetic, because if addiction was genetic then I would be a substance abuser, since almost everyone in my family is. That more than anything makes me feel it's not a "disease" as much as just poor, selfish choices.

I'm thankful every day I was able to escape my family's cycle, and it really bothers me that nobody else I share blood with has the "strength" to do the same. Instead they pass it on to their kids. It's like watching people get murdered in slow-motion.

[Leo656]

...Is that Martin Mull...?

[CyberCubed]

Its from Citizen Kane.

[Leo656]

I know, just trying to lighten the mood.

[Cure]

Can't really lighten the mood when you used this thread (and plenty others, actually) as a personal soap box to look down on others.

[CyberCubed]

I agree with this matter. People can choose not to drink (I don't), or do drugs, etc. There are ways to help yourself as well as your family to keep you on the right track.

I've never done drugs or smoked in my life, and I only drink very rarely. At least I know I'll never die from drugs/drinking/lung cancer.

Of course anyone could be killed simply by walking across the street and being hit by a car tomorrow, but that's just being ****ed in every way possible.

[Jester]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I've never done drugs or smoked in my life, and I only drink very rarely. At least I know I'll never die from drugs/drinking/lung cancer.

Lung cancer isn't exclusive to smokers, you know.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by Cure

Can't really lighten the mood when you used this thread (and plenty others, actually) as a personal soap box to look down on others.

There's absolutely nothing admirable about people with drug and alcohol problems, and even if you feel sorry for them you're still "looking down on them", sooo... I'm not sure I get the problem? Right is right, smug or not.

So I'm a narcissist. If that's the worst thing anyone can say about me, Awesome.

Jester: No, lung cancer or any cancer absolutely is not exclusive to certain behaviors. BUT I feel that if certain behaviors are proven to highly increase risk factors, those behaviors should be avoided. Emphysema is common in my heavy-smoking family, thus I've never smoked cigarettes; I may well get it someday anyway, but at least I'll be at peace knowing it wasn't ALL my fault. Some things just happen, sadly. That said, one of the most absurd and infuriating moments of my life was a few months ago, when my aunt was rushed to the hospital with a collapsed lung brought on by years of post-diagnosis smoking. After visiting her, seeing her all hooked up to tubes and machines, her two kids and my sister made the completely rational decision to chain-smoke in the parking lot to "relieve the stress." I feel like pushing yourself into it is just crazy; you literally stand face-to-face with the end results of your behavior, and continue to engage. It's such a shame. Especially when so many people take care of themselves and get sick anyway.

[Cure]

Originally Posted by Leo656

So I'm a narcissist. If that's the worst thing anyone can say about me, Awesome.

Hahaha, no, plenty more than that.

[Leo656]

I'd love to see your make-believe list of my character flaws that only exist in your mind, but this probably isn't the place.

[shuriken]

SOOOO Megan Fox huh? This has turned into something that should be in the general discussions don't you think? Nothing really to do with TMNT.
But no i don't feel bad for Fox, I'm sure she'd fine. I feel worse for Lohan tho, she's been on a downward spiral and looks pretty tore up for being 27.
And why are people attacking Leo? Sure he got a bit preachy but hey people tend to do that when they believe in what they say.

[Konchadunga]

What's weird about Leo's argument is it's fueled by rage that his mother abused drugs into the grave, and yet his solution to this is to shoot everybody who's on the path to that. Seems extremely ironic to me. I also believe he has no business declaring everyone can beat an addiction of their own willpower, yet has never had to live with an addiction to prove this; all he seems capable of feeling is contempt for drug addicts; no empathy. Nor is his vilification of clinics warranted, given that they tried to close clinics in the Reagan era, and the only effect was drug addicts spilling out into the streets with their crap. Finally, the sort of scare tactics we use against drugs in our schools are contributing to the problem; not helping prevent it. Teens fall into the trend of reverse psychologhy; they also fall out of it eventually, but in the meantime, a better solution would probably just be not to tell them dangerous drugs exist.

Back on the subject of how millionaires can be pitied, I, for one, pity Peter Laird, and far more than Megan Fox. I feel bad for Megan because she gets hate I think is unwarranted, but Laird got rich off of a job that, by all accounts, ate up most of his free time and pestered him constantly with contrary ideas, and the worst thing is that many people still aren't even aware of how bad it was; they probably think creating TMNT would grant one the most awesome life ever.

[Davetello]

Originally Posted by Toby Barrett

Please go play in traffic CyberCubed.

To be fair, he has a point.

Not to single out Megan Fox, but the entertainment business is full of people who rely on their image to compensate for a lack of talent. This is true in movies, TV, music and even sport. In the latter for example, someone like David Beckham, while talented, shouldn't really be more famous than myriad superior footballers. Then there's 'celebrities' who don't actually have any talent at all e.g. reality TV stars, the British monarchy, Justin Bieber etc.

The whole western concept of 'celebrity culture' really does irritate at times. It's most certainly not exclusive to Fox though, and I'm still hoping she can do April some justice.

[Davetello]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I don't "hate" the rich, per se. Hating the rich, like hating the old, is a questionable prejudice, because if all goes well for you, you BECOME them, one day.

But I do agree that people who can choose to live where they want, f*ck who they want, eat as well as they want, are not generally able to be punished by any known laws no matter what they do, don't have to raise or even see their own annoying children, and spend literally all of their time playing make-believe, having a mid-life crisis, and/or doing insane amounts of expensive drugs... those people literally have nothing to complain about, ever. And the things they DO complain about makes them look like the absolute shallowest c*nts on Earth.

Your second paragraph is why I hate the British monarchy - in fact it sums them up perfectly. They've had everything handed to them through birth and earned nothing, yet they have the audacity to complain about 'media intrusion'. The same media who makes them as popular as they are through unbalanced sycophantic coverage which is transmitted to the gullible masses. It's funny how the 'intrusion' doesn't seem to be offensive enough to make the Queen abdicate isn't it?

But I don't want to start ranting. I just noticed that there was a debate going on here and your comment reminded me of the royals so much.

[TigerClaw]

There's a article with a new interview with Megan Fox, however its in Spanish, But the Megan Fox fan site ran it through google translate.
http://meganfox86.tumblr.com/post/58...-is-definitely

Here's the TMNT part of it.

Asked About TMNT

“It was great to Ninja Turtles. I liked playing a girl who is making his way and wants to become a good journalist. Was fun, never done anything like this,” he said Megan.

I know the translation is bad.

[Metalwolf]

Originally Posted by Davetello

Your second paragraph is why I hate the British monarchy - in fact it sums them up perfectly. They've had everything handed to them through birth and earned nothing, yet they have the audacity to complain about 'media intrusion'. The same media who makes them as popular as they are through unbalanced sycophantic coverage which is transmitted to the gullible masses. It's funny how the 'intrusion' doesn't seem to be offensive enough to make the Queen abdicate isn't it?

But I don't want to start ranting. I just noticed that there was a debate going on here and your comment reminded me of the royals so much.

Well, there's a lot of people that feel the same way you do about the British Monarchy, as they seem to be of little more function then a tank full of goldfish- pretty to look at, but also kind of useless.

.

Anyway, Megan Fox, if she feels so put down into difficulty by her present life in Hollywood, is welcome to walk away after her contracts expire. Nobody is forcing her to stay. I know she likes the accolades and recognition, but if it's that bad, then she can leave.

[Davetello]

Originally Posted by Metalwolf

Well, there's a lot of people that feel the same way you do about the British Monarchy, as they seem to be of little more function then a tank full of goldfish- pretty to look at, but also kind of useless.

.

Anyway, Megan Fox, if she feels so put down into difficulty by her present life in Hollywood, is welcome to walk away after her contracts expire. Nobody is forcing her to stay. I know she likes the accolades and recognition, but if it's that bad, then she can leave.

They really are pointless parasites. For an egalitarian like myself it's a disgrace that we don't have the right to freely elect our head of state. 'Democracy' yeah, right.

The thing is that the financial 'arguments' for keeping them (tourism etc) have been completely debunked too. Even if said arguments were legit, I'd still be against them simply because hereditary privilege is despicable in the 21st century. Lords, ladies, knights, princes, kings - it's like an episode of Game of Thrones!

I do not wish to deviate from the topic of the thread however, so I will stop going off on tangents and cease ranting now.

[Jester]

You know...watching all those Maury Povich knock-offs while off on weekdays, I can see where Leo is coming from...sort of.

But if one of my family members was struggling with this stuff, I'd try to help, and if they refused the help, then I'd probably write them off. Not before.

[Leo656]

I've never understood the Royals. I totally wish them no ill will... but what do they DO, anymore, really? WHY do we still care? It's not like we have media reporting daily, every second, on every detail of the lives of Jimmy Carter or George H.W. Bush, and they are literally EXACTLY as important, to anything, as the British Royal Family. The Kennedys, same thing. Forget the entire fact their entire legacy and family fortune was born out of organized crime, that's ancient history, what's baffling is that they're so BELOVED, to this day, despite only one of them (John) doing anything REALLY important, his brother (Bobby) being sort of but still rather less important, and another one (Teddy) becoming a beloved public servant despite being 110% for killing someone in a drunk driving accident. JFK had probably the hottest wife in Presidential history, but aside from that and being a clan of alcoholic serial adulterers, I simply don't get the continued fascination, to this day, with anything attached to the Kennedy name even a little bit, even if ol' Jack did avert the Cuban Missile Crisis. Everybody gets ONE, man...

But yeah, I really don't understand the "Cult Of Celebrity" at all. I've been around lots of famous people, and they all burp and tell racist jokes when they're drunk like everyone else does. They just happen to be prettier while doing it.

Off-Topic reply to earlier-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wanna thank everyone for being mostly civil about it. I know it was off-topic, and I know I come off insanely judgmental about this stuff, but you have to understand the absolutely INSANE amount of dead people I know, or consider that for a VERY long period of my life, literally EVERY person I knew except me and my wife was a drug addict. Everyone in my family, everyone at my job, everyone I hung out with... I have seen a mind-f*cking amount of absolute bullsh*t, and at times, yeah, it really has me hating all of humanity, because people are supposed to be BETTER than that. Yes, it comes from a position of rage. Literally every bad thing that EVER happened to me in my entire life (which is somewhere between 21 and "none of your F'n business" years old) was because of someone's habit. What can I say? I'm out of patience with it, and just want people to behave.

Also, I'm not exactly railing against people who smoke a little pot, because frankly, I've never honestly seen anyone's life get completely ass-f*cked from that. It's still kind of stupid, but really it's different because it seems like the worst, in that case, is spending money you probably can't afford to spend on something with zero actual value, which is irresponsible. But cigs, booze, coke, pills, heroin, etc. is all absolutely proven to at least turn the user into an assh*le, and at worst, ruin their entire life. So I think there is a wide gap between marijuana and everything else; feel free to call that hypocritical, I can see where it can be viewed that way.

And as far as shooting anyone, I thought that was easily identified as hyperbolic. Obviously, we shouldn't do that, but the thing is, these people are killing themselves, and while they do it, everyone they know is suffering, too, which is even worse. Watching a 60-year old man with a ridiculously bad heart smoke crack, for example, literally days after having major surgery, will make a person like myself go insane. That guy was my Dad, who gave not a sh*t about anything but "having fun", and that's why he's dead. I asked him once point blank if he cared about dying, and got the stock "we all go sometime" response of anyone in denial. So I simply stated that a gun would be quicker. That's how I feel about these people who are so hell-bent on having their vice that literally nothing matters at all. Obviously, though, I don't literally wish death on people. Usually.

I don't think any of it has to do with education, just common sense. I also feel that acceptance is part of the problem, because the user feels they've done nothing wrong, and plying them with empathy or letting them know "it's no big deal" enables them. My empathy is for the friends and family members, not the user. I feel that until the user is confronted with the absolute fact that what they're doing is unacceptable, there can be no true rehabilitation. That's why many people don't "get sober", they "get discreet", like a guy I worked with who quit smoking weed because it showed up on his random drug tests, so he started doing coke because it would pass through his system quicker. To him that was "solving the problem"; he willingly gave himself an addiction to one drug so as to not get busted for another, when a sane person would just stop entirely. Seriously, the biggest problem many of these types have is simply They Like Being High, and nobody ever actually FORCES them to deal with the consequences or take responsibility for their lives.


Jester, believe me man, I've tried, and still do, to help people in my family. I've given up, mostly, because when talking it out, crying it out, begging, and eventually arguing about it fall short, you just have to walk away. When people feel they "need" something, there's no shaking them. It can be anything, not just drugs. My one sister, for example, lost almost all her teeth from excessive smoking and soda rot by her twenties, and still drinks at least a 12-pack of Pepsi a day and smokes a pack and a half. Lots of us have tried to talk to her, even her kids, and it's always "I don't give a sh*t, I NEED IT!" and becomes her screaming at everyone to mind their business. I hate it; she sounds like she's getting emphysema already and she's not even 40. When her kids try to talk to her, she says it "relieves stress from dealing with them", which is horrible. My cousin screams at her kids when she gets drunk and blames her drinking on them (a common theme among alcoholics with kids, if you weren't lucky enough to grow up with that). I cannot accept the people they are right now, because they for their own reasons choose to look down on me (mostly because I'm not independently wealthy; they're not either, but when you're rock-bottom you try and drag others down with you) when I'm not the one hurting anyone else, and they are, willingly and willfully. So while I love them, I can't be around them until they get better. If and when they do, and stop blaming their bad choices on others (especially their damn KIDS), I'll always be there for them.

My father and I reconciled right before he died, too; in our last talk, he admitted I'd always been right about everything and he was proud of me for never straying from my convictions. It just felt like such a cheat, because we could have had more Good years together instead of horrible ones, if only he realized sooner what was right in front of him. His mother lived to 96, so if he hadn't blown his entire adult life he'd be around for a long time yet. It's so nonsensical. His other kids didn't forgive him at all or go to his funeral, which I find sad, because he never did ANY of the bad things he did to me, to them, not at all. It's funny how the most-judgmental one was able to forgive, but the other, older, "more mature" people couldn't.

I'm gonna just try and leave it at that. People can judge me if they want but I appreciate those who at least try to *understand* why I'm so angry about this stuff. This week was also the anniversary of my Mom's OD when I was 14, so yeah...

But thanks to those who do "get it", and I hope my experiences haven't ever been yours.