Star Wars: Episode IX

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by MikeandRaph87

I like to forget about that life draining power. It took away from Luke's actions and what we wanted to see for decades.

I doubt Luke was ever going to be the superhero people thought he would be, even if Rian and not directed TLJ. People wanted to see Luke be Goku or Superman or Jesus, but it was likely never going to happen.

Luke wasn't going to charge out from his island with a laser sword to go save the galaxy.

[Xav]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Sequel Trilogy: The Empire comes back and is overthrown by rebels again.

BTW, how exactly was the Empire overthrown? Just because Palpatine's Sith fleet was destroyed doesn't mean the First Order doesn't still rule the galaxy.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by Xav

BTW, how exactly was the Empire overthrown? Just because Palpatine's Sith fleet was destroyed doesn't mean the First Order doesn't still rule the galaxy.

Most of the Order's leaders were killed.

[newfan]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I doubt Luke was ever going to be the superhero people thought he would be, even if Rian and not directed TLJ. People wanted to see Luke be Goku or Superman or Jesus, but it was likely never going to happen.

Luke wasn't going to charge out from his island with a laser sword to go save the galaxy.

You know people might not be thinking on the extreme and wanting a god, they might have just wanted something better than what was done with him.
Given the time gap we managed to miss the full on Jedi in his prime and skip from just making Jedi to... what became of Luke.

[Xav]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Most of the Order's leaders were killed.

So? Killing Vader and the Emperor didn't defeat the Empire. Why are they defeated now just because Klyo Ren is dead?

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by Xav

So? Killing Vader and the Emperor didn't defeat the Empire. Why are they defeated now just because Klyo Ren is dead?

Because in a quick one-liner at the end of ROS you hear Finn calling out over the radio that "people are rising up all over the Galaxy!" before it cuts to the montage of Star Destroyers falling from the skies of planets all over.

And that nonsense about sums up this entire trilogy, especially ROS.

[CyberCubed]

It does make sense for the Empire to still continue after Vader/Emperor fall, that's what happens in the EU too. It's not like all those Star Destroyers and all those other random Generals and Admirals just disappear from existance or give up. It's like in any country in the real world that loses a leader, another one steps up to take it's place.

This isn't like a videogame where you beat the final boss and all the underlings just magically disappear.

[Vegita-San]

other thought...did we even see a single sith trooper in the movie for all their build up?

'Lea new'..bull. how?

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Xav

BTW, how exactly was the Empire overthrown? Just because Palpatine's Sith fleet was destroyed doesn't mean the First Order doesn't still rule the galaxy.

Rewatch the ending. They make it a point to show all over the galaxy, all of the First Order being destroyed.

[CyberCubed]

I’m surprised Lieutenant Connix wasn’t given a bigger role here, she got more scenes in TLJ. Although that scene of her holding Leia and walking with her before she rested her down was nice.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I’m surprised Lieutenant Connix wasn’t given a bigger role here, she got more scenes in TLJ. Although that scene of her holding Leia and walking with her before she rested her down was nice.

Yeah, I thought for sure they'd want to beef her part up.

Just a lot of very puzzling decisions, in ROTS. Very puzzling.

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Yeah, I thought for sure they'd want to beef her part up.

Just a lot of very puzzling decisions, in ROTS. Very puzzling.

I think a lot of those puzzling decisions can be explained from the real life take on the situation as opposed to a any of the minutiae logic from within the story.

Abrams clearly had a situation much the same as faced by Ron Howard in Solo, except Abrams also had to remedy three films of story, one of which was a significant deviation from probably what was his "story thesis" going into The Force Awakens.

[CyberCubed]

Abrams had no story building so it didn't matter. Remember how people were complaining that Rian didn't use the "Knight of Ren?" LOL, and then JJ does absolutely nothing with them either, he brings them back to quickly turn on Kylo and get killed off in a less than 1 minute on-screen fight.

Then we have Maz the orange alien lady, a character JJ gave a lot of screentime to in TFA and Rian just gave one small scene to, what does JJ do with her? Nothing but have her stay at the Rebel base with Leia.

JJ also had no real plans for Snoke, he just wanted another generic evil emperor character because he had no real ideas where to take the story. Had Rian not killed him off, he'd just sub Palpatine for Snoke in the final act and have Rey and Kylo team up against him instead.

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Abrams had no story building so it didn't matter. Remember how people were complaining that Rian didn't use the "Knight of Ren?" LOL, and then JJ does absolutely nothing with them either, he brings them back to quickly turn on Kylo and get killed off in a less than 1 minute on-screen fight.

Then we have Maz the orange alien lady, a character JJ gave a lot of screentime to in TFA and Rian just gave one small scene to, what does JJ do with her? Nothing but have her stay at the Rebel base with Leia.

But Cubed, everything you're describing are all basically problems caused by the Last Jedi - not J.J. The last Jedi did nothing to further any kind of overarching narrative suspense or theme. It didn't serve as an act two at all when measured against any thesis or theme that would connect the three movies as a "trilogy".

I mean - the entire second act derailed any cohesion to an arcing narrative completely. Those were supposed to be two or so very important hours of story telling that instead derailed what otherwise could've been a cohesive story. Everything you've described is exactly how TLJ failed and therefore weakened TROS in it's ability to come back from it. Any seeds planted by the Force Awakens were crapped on by TLJ and TROS did every nonsense thing it could to try and bring the three paragraph essay back to it's thesis.

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

JJ also had no real plans for Snoke, he just wanted another generic evil emperor character because he had no real ideas where to take the story

How do you know? But for the sake of it, let's say this was true. He might not have a real plan, but he clearly had intentions for the character to the overall narrative. I highly doubt that intention was to be unceremoniously cut down and simply made to be a nothing proxy character.

[Andrew NDB]

Pretty sure JJ intended for Snoke to be Plageuis. Given Snoke's theme is identical to the music in Episode III when Palpatine is telling the Plagueis story and Snoke's injuries (and age) seem consistent with someone who was left for dead by their apprentice.

But yeah... Johnson killed him off. Retroactively making Snoke into Plagueis in IX would have been dumb.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by IMJ

But Cubed, everything you're describing are all basically problems caused by the Last Jedi - not J.J. The last Jedi did nothing to further any kind of overarching narrative suspense or theme. It didn't serve as an act two at all when measured against any thesis or theme that would connect the three movies as a "trilogy".

I mean - the entire second act derailed any cohesion to an arcing narrative completely. Those were supposed to be two or so very important hours of story telling that instead derailed what otherwise could've been a cohesive story.

The entire main plot of TLJ did exactly what it intended to, show Rey train with Luke, focus on the Rey/Kylo Ren dynamic/rivalry, have Luke come back in some form, and then reunite Rey with her original friends. It was all the subplots like the casino planet, Rose, and Poe basically being used as a hot-head pilot, that were just the focus of that specific movie.

Any seeds planted by the Force Awakens were crapped on by TLJ and TROS did every nonsense thing it could to try and bring the three paragraph essay back to it's thesis.

What did people expect to happen otherwise? Had Rian not killed Snoke, most likely Palpatine would not have been brought back, and Snoke would just be used for the final climatic battle in TROS. Everything else continued directly off of TLJ.

Getting rid of Snoke was the best thing TLJ did because he was a terrible character to begin with (both design wise and character wise), and it allowed him to develop Kylo Ren and Rey's dynamic with him much better. Which is basically the focus of all 3 movies given Kylo Ren is actually the main villain of the new trilogy, not the emperors.

Only other thing I wish they did is focus more on Finn's history being a former Storm Trooper with Captain Phasma, but even then JJ treated her like crap in TFA too and she actually got more screentime in TLJ.

I keep seeing people say the "narrative" was derailed, but I don't see that at all. We even had JJ give Rey the backstory of being related to a powerful force wielder, and that didn't make much of a difference either.

[Shark_Blade]

People are saying the original ending was different. Rey was copy pasted from previous scene for ROS ending. The shot of Daisy “standing in front of the twin suns” is very clearly taken from the footage of her standing on Passana, waiting for the Tie Fighter.

https://twitter.com/im_organa/status...040172545?s=21


Fan edit reylo ending.
https://twitter.com/neuvoreylogirl/s...823228928?s=21

[oldmanwinters]

Originally Posted by Shark_Blade

People are saying the original ending was different. Rey was copy pasted from previous scene for ROS ending. The shot of Daisy “standing in front of the twin suns” is very clearly taken from the footage of her standing on Passana, waiting for the Tie Fighter.

https://twitter.com/im_organa/status...040172545?s=21

Yikes.

"Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain," indeed!

[ranger_scout]

I went to see it again with two of my best friends yesterday. One of them hadn't seen it yet. It's still a solid final chapter for this saga and I had even more of an appreciation some of the performances during my second viewing.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Shark_Blade

People are saying the original ending was different. Rey was copy pasted from previous scene for ROS ending. The shot of Daisy “standing in front of the twin suns” is very clearly taken from the footage of her standing on Passana, waiting for the Tie Fighter.

https://twitter.com/im_organa/status...040172545?s=21

I don't know if that's true. Daisy Ridley said they went to Tunisia to film the last scene, and everyone was tearing up on set.